Indiana Tech Law School

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danquayle
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby danquayle » Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:33 pm

Ghost93 wrote:
danquayle wrote:
Ghost93 wrote:if there are people going to this shithole, they probably aren't on tls.


tbf, if you got a full ride, live in Fort Wayne, want to solo in Fort Wayne, have a house and three kids in Fort Wayne and are ok with teaching yourself all you need to pass the Indiana bar, then this law school would make sense.

Sure, except that is all very specific criteria that I'm sure most people looking to go there don't meet.


Haha was meant to be facetious. This is why we should have apprenticeships. There ought to be about 50-100 fewer law schools.

I'm sure there is a need for legal representation amongst the lower income. I'm also sure there aren't sufficient starting salaries representing lower income clients to justify even $20k a year in tuition.

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RAWR
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby RAWR » Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:39 pm

danquayle wrote:
Ghost93 wrote:
danquayle wrote:
Ghost93 wrote:if there are people going to this shithole, they probably aren't on tls.


tbf, if you got a full ride, live in Fort Wayne, want to solo in Fort Wayne, have a house and three kids in Fort Wayne and are ok with teaching yourself all you need to pass the Indiana bar, then this law school would make sense.

Sure, except that is all very specific criteria that I'm sure most people looking to go there don't meet.


Haha was meant to be facetious. This is why we should have apprenticeships. There ought to be about 50-100 fewer law schools.

I'm sure there is a need for legal representation amongst the lower income. I'm also sure there aren't sufficient starting salaries representing lower income clients to justify even $20k a year in tuition.


That's why they have LRAP I guess.

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North
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby North » Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:42 pm

RAWR wrote:That's why they have LRAP I guess.

Indiana Tech doesn't have an LRAP Program, herp derpington.

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RAWR
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby RAWR » Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:49 pm

North wrote:
RAWR wrote:That's why they have LRAP I guess.

Indiana Tech doesn't have an LRAP Program, herp derpington.


LOLOLOL herp derpington is probably the greatest thing I've heard ALL WEEK.

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danquayle
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby danquayle » Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:50 pm

North wrote:
RAWR wrote:That's why they have LRAP I guess.

Indiana Tech doesn't have an LRAP Program, herp derpington.


Even then, who foots the bulk of the bill on current LRAP programs? If its only the law school themselves paying the loans on behalf of the students then ok I guess, but if it amounts to federal loan forgiveness then basically we'd have the fed government subsidizing a bunch of crappy law schools. What's the point of that?

The only one I'm at all familiar with is UM's, and I believe the federal government chips in.

Income Based Repayment/Loan Forgiveness is a federal program, so that amounts to a subsidy. That'd be ok if the ultimate recipients of that subsidy weren't bloated law schools.

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RAWR
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby RAWR » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:03 pm

danquayle wrote:
North wrote:
RAWR wrote:That's why they have LRAP I guess.

Indiana Tech doesn't have an LRAP Program, herp derpington.


Even then, who foots the bulk of the bill on current LRAP programs? If its only the law school themselves paying the loans on behalf of the students then ok I guess, but if it amounts to federal loan forgiveness then basically we'd have the fed government subsidizing a bunch of crappy law schools. What's the point of that?

The only one I'm at all familiar with is UM's, and I believe the federal government chips in.

Income Based Repayment/Loan Forgiveness is a federal program, so that amounts to a subsidy. That'd be ok if the ultimate recipients of that subsidy weren't bloated law schools.


I don't understand why they're trying to open in third place in Indiana. It's setting yourself up for failure, because how is an unaccredited law school going to open in the top 100? IUPUI is ranked 96 (under 24 ND and 25 IUB) and is arguably one of the best T2 schools there is. Oh and it's in the state capital, so... there's that.

Rockfish
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby Rockfish » Tue May 07, 2013 4:19 am

I've been a lawyer since the 1980s, and please let me tell you that everything Paul Campos says is right. There is a glut of lawyers. Many graduates of elite law schools now cannot find a job that will pay off their investment. Graduates of non-elite schools struggle to get any kind of legal job. There's nothing wrong with being an insurance adjuster, but it's crazy to pay law school tuition for three years to become an insurance adjuster.

In this market, those associated with Indiana Tech law school should go to jail. They are selling a degree that will be utterly useless to their graduates. Two bucks and an Indiana Tech law degree won't even get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks. This law school is purely a mechanism to transfer funds from people who don't know any better to people who absolutely do know better. Those admitted to this diploma mill are being hornswoggled. Indeed, entrants at far better law schools are being hornswoggled, but even by the mercenary standards of current law schools this is egregiously egregious.

To all those considering law school: Don't. Or at least don't do it unless you've been admitted to an elite school and can either make law review or have an independent source of financing (e.g., screwing your parents to get job you won't get). (For LSAT pedants, this could either be an "i.e." clause or an "e.g." clause, but since there are various methods for securing funds to make a huge mistake, I used "e,g." Also for LSAT pedants, remember that "very unique" is superfluous.)

This entire thread reminds me of graffiti I saw in Michigan law school bathrooms: "If you're reading this you're hopelessly behind in CivPro." In much the same way, if your decision is based on this thread, you're hopelessly fucked. And when I say this I mean that you are completely and utterly screwed and unless you kick ass in a strong law school you should consider barking for the yak woman in a carnival.

Don't kid yourselves. Even if you're one of the salmon who make it all the way upstream, you'll only become a partner if lots of independently wealthy salmon give their fishy business to you. Or if you can attract other fishy characters to your firm. But in neither case will anything you learned in law school have anything remotely to do with your success or failure. If your intellect favors business or liberal arts or bartending or whatever, then go there and be happy. But don't give these frauds your hard-earned money -- and in particular don't give them your later-to-be-paid debt. Treat them like they're selling you a George Foreman grill, because for the most part that's all they've got.

TheNextAmendment
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby TheNextAmendment » Tue May 07, 2013 8:31 am

Rockfish wrote:I've been a lawyer since the 1980s, and please let me tell you that everything Paul Campos says is right. There is a glut of lawyers. Many graduates of elite law schools now cannot find a job that will pay off their investment. Graduates of non-elite schools struggle to get any kind of legal job. There's nothing wrong with being an insurance adjuster, but it's crazy to pay law school tuition for three years to become an insurance adjuster.

In this market, those associated with Indiana Tech law school should go to jail. They are selling a degree that will be utterly useless to their graduates. Two bucks and an Indiana Tech law degree won't even get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks. This law school is purely a mechanism to transfer funds from people who don't know any better to people who absolutely do know better. Those admitted to this diploma mill are being hornswoggled. Indeed, entrants at far better law schools are being hornswoggled, but even by the mercenary standards of current law schools this is egregiously egregious.

To all those considering law school: Don't. Or at least don't do it unless you've been admitted to an elite school and can either make law review or have an independent source of financing (e.g., screwing your parents to get job you won't get). (For LSAT pedants, this could either be an "i.e." clause or an "e.g." clause, but since there are various methods for securing funds to make a huge mistake, I used "e,g." Also for LSAT pedants, remember that "very unique" is superfluous.)

This entire thread reminds me of graffiti I saw in Michigan law school bathrooms: "If you're reading this you're hopelessly behind in CivPro." In much the same way, if your decision is based on this thread, you're hopelessly fucked. And when I say this I mean that you are completely and utterly screwed and unless you kick ass in a strong law school you should consider barking for the yak woman in a carnival.

Don't kid yourselves. Even if you're one of the salmon who make it all the way upstream, you'll only become a partner if lots of independently wealthy salmon give their fishy business to you. Or if you can attract other fishy characters to your firm. But in neither case will anything you learned in law school have anything remotely to do with your success or failure. If your intellect favors business or liberal arts or bartending or whatever, then go there and be happy. But don't give these frauds your hard-earned money -- and in particular don't give them your later-to-be-paid debt. Treat them like they're selling you a George Foreman grill, because for the most part that's all they've got.


Thank you for reviving this thread! I was looking for this a while back so I could read something entertaining during my lunch break, but I couldn't find it. Yes. I can't wait for noon now. Thank you sir.

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jingosaur
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby jingosaur » Tue May 07, 2013 10:16 am

Rockfish wrote:I've been a lawyer since the 1980s, and please let me tell you that everything Paul Campos says is right. There is a glut of lawyers. Many graduates of elite law schools now cannot find a job that will pay off their investment. Graduates of non-elite schools struggle to get any kind of legal job. There's nothing wrong with being an insurance adjuster, but it's crazy to pay law school tuition for three years to become an insurance adjuster.

In this market, those associated with Indiana Tech law school should go to jail. They are selling a degree that will be utterly useless to their graduates. Two bucks and an Indiana Tech law degree won't even get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks. This law school is purely a mechanism to transfer funds from people who don't know any better to people who absolutely do know better. Those admitted to this diploma mill are being hornswoggled. Indeed, entrants at far better law schools are being hornswoggled, but even by the mercenary standards of current law schools this is egregiously egregious.

To all those considering law school: Don't. Or at least don't do it unless you've been admitted to an elite school and can either make law review or have an independent source of financing (e.g., screwing your parents to get job you won't get). (For LSAT pedants, this could either be an "i.e." clause or an "e.g." clause, but since there are various methods for securing funds to make a huge mistake, I used "e,g." Also for LSAT pedants, remember that "very unique" is superfluous.)

This entire thread reminds me of graffiti I saw in Michigan law school bathrooms: "If you're reading this you're hopelessly behind in CivPro." In much the same way, if your decision is based on this thread, you're hopelessly fucked. And when I say this I mean that you are completely and utterly screwed and unless you kick ass in a strong law school you should consider barking for the yak woman in a carnival.

Don't kid yourselves. Even if you're one of the salmon who make it all the way upstream, you'll only become a partner if lots of independently wealthy salmon give their fishy business to you. Or if you can attract other fishy characters to your firm. But in neither case will anything you learned in law school have anything remotely to do with your success or failure. If your intellect favors business or liberal arts or bartending or whatever, then go there and be happy. But don't give these frauds your hard-earned money -- and in particular don't give them your later-to-be-paid debt. Treat them like they're selling you a George Foreman grill, because for the most part that's all they've got.


I found this the other day:
--LinkRemoved--

They admitted their first law student. Here are the highlights:
1. "decided to take advantage of the law school’s early binding decision admissions program and sent her only application to Indiana Tech"
2. "several people indicated to us that Indiana Tech Law School was their top choice, so we decided to give those applicants a streamlined early admission application process"
3. "Megan has very strong credentials and could probably attend many of the law schools in our region"
4. "If everything goes as planned I’d love to study estate law and focus on trust and wills"

kyle010723
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby kyle010723 » Tue May 07, 2013 4:16 pm

goldbh7 wrote:I found this the other day:
--LinkRemoved--

They admitted their first law student. Here are the highlights:
1. "decided to take advantage of the law school’s early binding decision admissions program and sent her only application to Indiana Tech"
2. "several people indicated to us that Indiana Tech Law School was their top choice, so we decided to give those applicants a streamlined early admission application process"
3. "Megan has very strong credentials and could probably attend many of the law schools in our region"
4. "If everything goes as planned I’d love to study estate law and focus on trust and wills"


1. Who in their right mind thinks binding ED to a non-accredited school is a good idea... (Maybe with the exception of UCI?)
2. By several they probably mean 2?
3. That statement is probably true if the region is anywhere: East of South Bend, South of Lansing, and West of Cleveland. They are probably the only law school in "the region"
4. She'll probably change her mind after taking property.

It is astonishing the perception gap between TLSer and NonTLSer. Talked to a friend few days ago trying to convince him Valpo Law is not worth going at any cost. Everyone else told him how its such a great and wonderful school. And this new Indiana Tech is probably worst than Valpo /sigh...

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MCL Law Dean
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby MCL Law Dean » Tue May 07, 2013 9:02 pm

:arrow:
Last edited by MCL Law Dean on Tue May 07, 2013 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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MCL Law Dean
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby MCL Law Dean » Tue May 07, 2013 9:05 pm

unc0mm0n1 wrote:
JCougar wrote:I do agree with Mr. Alexander on at least one thing...his school is not alone. There's at least three dozen other rackets that never should have opened or should be closed down immediately.


Three dozen???? there are that many on the west coast alone. Cali has twelve correspondence and online law schools, although not accredited, are registered by the Committee of Bar Examiners of the State Bar of California. TWELVE!!!! Not to mention the awful ones like Monterey or PCL. We should literally shut down all the non accredited law schools plus about 60 of the accredited ones. That leaves about 140 law schools enough for every state to at least have 1 and for the bigger states to have between 2-4 (NY and Cali could probably get away with 5).



I apologize for the bump . . . but was reading the back thread and couldn't resist responding to the uncalled for "Monterey" slam.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=207726

kyle010723
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby kyle010723 » Tue May 07, 2013 10:46 pm

goldbh7 wrote:I found this the other day:
--LinkRemoved--

They admitted their first law student. Here are the highlights:
1. "decided to take advantage of the law school’s early binding decision admissions program and sent her only application to Indiana Tech"
2. "several people indicated to us that Indiana Tech Law School was their top choice, so we decided to give those applicants a streamlined early admission application process"
3. "Megan has very strong credentials and could probably attend many of the law schools in our region"
4. "If everything goes as planned I’d love to study estate law and focus on trust and wills"


Latest update:
http://www.journalgazette.net/article/2 ... 1002/LOCAL

"Marks said she’s not concerned about job prospects"

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RAWR
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby RAWR » Wed May 08, 2013 9:56 am

I work in Indy in the legal field, and overheard a conversation yesterday between six or seven attorneys saying "WHAT WHAT WHAT DOES INDIANA TECH THINK THEY'RE DOING"

Indiana Tech is basically a community college / technical school and not even a full blown university, and as a lifelong Indiana resident I hadn't even heard of it until six months ago when this new law school business started. These students won't be able to break into the Indy market, or South Bend or Chicago. There are .... two? three? places in Fort Wayne where someone can work as an attorney? And the people in those jobs almost certainly went to school in Indy, which while ranked 96th is respected by Indy firms.

Just a bad bad BAD idea...

kyle010723
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby kyle010723 » Wed May 08, 2013 3:04 pm

I suppose there is always more room for another ambulance chaser. Was driving on US31 the other day and saw tons of billboards for so-and-so law firm

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danquayle
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby danquayle » Wed May 08, 2013 4:49 pm

kyle010723 wrote:I suppose there is always more room for another ambulance chaser. Was driving on US31 the other day and saw tons of billboards for so-and-so law firm


As long as you have no debt, it really doesn't matter all that much where you went to law school. In fact, going to Indiana Tech might the ideal place to go if you want to do divorces, personal injury, etc in Fort Wayne.

The problem with this school is 1) the vast majority of its graduates will have massive debt and 2) those Fort Wayne jobs are not going to go to the massive surplus if lawyers from elsewhere.

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buddyt
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby buddyt » Wed May 08, 2013 6:12 pm

That article wrote:Marks is a graduate of Homestead High School and is on track to graduate with a bachelor’s in psychology from Purdue. She said she decided to attend law school during her junior year of college because it was compatible with her major.

I just died.

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Crowing
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby Crowing » Wed May 08, 2013 10:50 pm

buddytyler wrote:
That article wrote:Marks is a graduate of Homestead High School and is on track to graduate with a bachelor’s in psychology from Purdue. She said she decided to attend law school during her junior year of college because it was compatible with her major.

I just died.


180 reasoning

TheNextAmendment
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby TheNextAmendment » Thu May 09, 2013 10:31 am

Yeah Marks probably shouldn't be going to law school, much less at Indiana tech, but it MIGHT actually pay off for her because of her status as "1st student". Even if it takes the connections of multiple staff put together, I have a feeling they are going to work very very hard to get her a job realizing that having their 1st student unemployed would put the school into a media frenzy. Just something to think about...

I might be biased though...I'm student #2.

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HarlandBassett
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby HarlandBassett » Sat Jun 01, 2013 12:48 am

Image

Image

Image

it's just ~$250,0000 in non-dischargeable debt!!!

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sublime
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby sublime » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:41 am

..

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HarlandBassett
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby HarlandBassett » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:02 pm

http://abovethelaw.com/2013/07/new-law- ... ing-class/

....30 students out of the desired 100 perfectly illustrates how little the people at Indiana Tech thought about the market for legal education before pushing this law school through. Did they really ask “should we,” or did they just ask “could we”? The school seats 350 students in total, but they’re opening with just 30.

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romothesavior
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby romothesavior » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:19 pm

HarlandBassett wrote:http://abovethelaw.com/2013/07/new-law-school-gets-just-a-third-of-its-expected-starting-class/

....30 students out of the desired 100 perfectly illustrates how little the people at Indiana Tech thought about the market for legal education before pushing this law school through. Did they really ask “should we,” or did they just ask “could we”? The school seats 350 students in total, but they’re opening with just 30.

This school will be closed in 3-5 years tops, IMO

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jingosaur
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby jingosaur » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:04 pm

I wonder who wrote the 136 page feasibility study and how long it took them.

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Cicero76
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Re: Indiana Tech Law School

Postby Cicero76 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:58 am

goldbh7 wrote:I wonder who wrote the 136 page feasibility study and how long it took them.


Link to this?




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