Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

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ajax
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby ajax » Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:14 pm

HBBJohnStamos wrote:
iMisto wrote:Can Cornell please release medians already.... :evil:

I doubt our median dropped.


Care to elaborate? Cornell's 75% LSAT was 166 in 2003:

http://www.ilrg.com/rankings/law/index. ... THigh/2003

That same year there were quite a few more applications than there were this year:

http://www.lsac.org/lsacresources/data/ ... ummary.asp


But yeah, I doubt they drop. Dropping significantly would be suicide for a school. They have to figure something out. Maybe fudge the numbers a bit and say it was an honest mistake? A lot of that going on these days...

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VUSisterRayVU
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby VUSisterRayVU » Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:36 pm

ajax wrote:
HBBJohnStamos wrote:
iMisto wrote:Can Cornell please release medians already.... :evil:

I doubt our median dropped.


Care to elaborate? Cornell's 75% LSAT was 166 in 2003:

http://www.ilrg.com/rankings/law/index. ... THigh/2003

That same year there were quite a few more applications than there were this year:

http://www.lsac.org/lsacresources/data/ ... ummary.asp


But yeah, I doubt they drop. Dropping significantly would be suicide for a school. They have to figure something out. Maybe fudge the numbers a bit and say it was an honest mistake? A lot of that going on these days...


I think using 2003 for a historical basis is probably a bit misguided. Since Cornell's 75% wasn't 170, I don't think they'd have problems gaming it to maintain 169.

Real Madrid
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Real Madrid » Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:53 pm

ajax wrote:
Doorkeeper wrote:
soj wrote:
DaleCooper wrote:Unhelpful post:

NYU's LSAT split is 169/173 (down one point from last year), but they didn't tell us whether the median was 170 or 171.

Wat, I'd be shocked if they went from 172 to 170. Even 172 to 171 is huge.

Considering who Chicago and NYU was letting in come April, I'm shocked they were only hit by a 1 point drop...


It will be interesting to see which schools have the LSAC "certify" the numbers they report to the ABA for the fall 2012 entering class. http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/06/19/law ... at-scores/. Something is starting to smell quite fishy with many of these schools reporting almost identical class sizes as the entering fall 2011 class, and relatively the same medians as well after a 15% drop in applications.


I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.

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HBBJohnStamos
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby HBBJohnStamos » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:05 pm

ajax wrote:
HBBJohnStamos wrote:
iMisto wrote:Can Cornell please release medians already.... :evil:

I doubt our median dropped.


Care to elaborate? Cornell's 75% LSAT was 166 in 2003:

http://www.ilrg.com/rankings/law/index. ... THigh/2003

That same year there were quite a few more applications than there were this year:

http://www.lsac.org/lsacresources/data/ ... ummary.asp


But yeah, I doubt they drop. Dropping significantly would be suicide for a school. They have to figure something out. Maybe fudge the numbers a bit and say it was an honest mistake? A lot of that going on these days...


You do realize that the whole "reporting only the highest score" policy went into effect in 2006, right?

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danquayle
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby danquayle » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:38 pm

HBBJohnStamos wrote:
ajax wrote:
HBBJohnStamos wrote:
iMisto wrote:Can Cornell please release medians already.... :evil:

I doubt our median dropped.


Care to elaborate? Cornell's 75% LSAT was 166 in 2003:

http://www.ilrg.com/rankings/law/index. ... THigh/2003

That same year there were quite a few more applications than there were this year:

http://www.lsac.org/lsacresources/data/ ... ummary.asp


But yeah, I doubt they drop. Dropping significantly would be suicide for a school. They have to figure something out. Maybe fudge the numbers a bit and say it was an honest mistake? A lot of that going on these days...


You do realize that the whole "reporting only the highest score" policy went into effect in 2006, right?


and thus was triumphantly brought into this world:

retake /thread

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bernaldiaz
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby bernaldiaz » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:42 pm

OP has Notre Dame at a 161 LSAT median. That can't possibly be true, right?

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justonemoregame
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby justonemoregame » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:51 pm

I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.[/quote]


lolplummet Still grinding that uva axe? Their 25ths are same as Berkeley, which seems to do fine with a 167 median

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Nova
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Nova » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:58 pm

bernaldiaz wrote:OP has Notre Dame at a 161 LSAT median. That can't possibly be true, right?

Damn, it was 167 just 2 years ago...

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bernaldiaz
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby bernaldiaz » Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:16 pm

Nova wrote:
bernaldiaz wrote:OP has Notre Dame at a 161 LSAT median. That can't possibly be true, right?

Damn, it was 167 just 2 years ago...


Yeah that has to be a typo

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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Real Madrid » Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:20 pm

justonemoregame wrote:I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.


lolplummet Still grinding that uva axe? Their 25ths are same as Berkeley, which seems to do fine with a 167 median


I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.
Last edited by Real Madrid on Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby JamMasterJ » Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:22 pm

VUSisterRayVU wrote:
DaleCooper wrote:Unhelpful post:

NYU's LSAT split is 169/173 (down one point from last year), but they didn't tell us whether the median was 170 or 171.


This is helpful and good news. Splits are more useful for some of us than straight medians.

It was kinda weird that they didn't tell us the actual medians.
Anyway our 25th gpa was 3.54, and I believe our 75th gpa was 3.84

Real Madrid
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Real Madrid » Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:26 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
VUSisterRayVU wrote:
DaleCooper wrote:Unhelpful post:

NYU's LSAT split is 169/173 (down one point from last year), but they didn't tell us whether the median was 170 or 171.


This is helpful and good news. Splits are more useful for some of us than straight medians.

It was kinda weird that they didn't tell us the actual medians.
Anyway our 25th gpa was 3.54, and I believe our 75th gpa was 3.84


Is that an improvement or is that down from a year ago?

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stillwater
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby stillwater » Fri Aug 24, 2012 8:15 pm

bernaldiaz wrote:
Nova wrote:
bernaldiaz wrote:OP has Notre Dame at a 161 LSAT median. That can't possibly be true, right?

Damn, it was 167 just 2 years ago...


Yeah that has to be a typo


I was curious about that too. Their website has the new data for the Class of 2015 up and 161 is their 25th percentile. Median is 166.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby JamMasterJ » Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:56 pm

Real Madrid wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
VUSisterRayVU wrote:
DaleCooper wrote:Unhelpful post:

NYU's LSAT split is 169/173 (down one point from last year), but they didn't tell us whether the median was 170 or 171.


This is helpful and good news. Splits are more useful for some of us than straight medians.

It was kinda weird that they didn't tell us the actual medians.
Anyway our 25th gpa was 3.54, and I believe our 75th gpa was 3.84


Is that an improvement or is that down from a year ago?

Both down, IIRC

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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby jmoney » Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:24 am

Real Madrid wrote:
justonemoregame wrote:I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.


lolplummet Still grinding that uva axe? Their 25ths are same as Berkeley, which seems to do fine with a 167 median


I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.

This is on point.

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spicyyoda17
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby spicyyoda17 » Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:03 am

jmoney wrote:
Real Madrid wrote:
justonemoregame wrote:I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.


lolplummet Still grinding that uva axe? Their 25ths are same as Berkeley, which seems to do fine with a 167 median


I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.

This is on point.


For those of us new to this game, what is it about UVA admissions that is so bad?

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top30man
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby top30man » Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:07 am

spicyyoda17 wrote:
jmoney wrote:
Real Madrid wrote:
justonemoregame wrote:I think it will be possible for the top schools to maintain medians for a little while. What could very well happen is that schools like Chicago, Penn, Duke and Michigan - each of which often don't take splitters and reverse-splitters that usually have no place to go in the T-14 but UVA, GULC and Northwestern - could start accepting more of those students. That way, they can maintain medians at the expense of their 25th percentiles. If USNWR would consider 25/75 splits in their rankings, schools like UVA would plummet, but as it stands they have no motivation to keep reasonable 25ths.


lolplummet Still grinding that uva axe? Their 25ths are same as Berkeley, which seems to do fine with a 167 median


I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.

This is on point.


For those of us new to this game, what is it about UVA admissions that is so bad?

Nothing is bad, but people get frustrated with how numbers oriented it is. To achieve their medians with a large class they rely on splitter ED applicants. You are almost automatically admitted if one of your two numbers is at or above median. However, pretty much every T14 is numbers focused to a degree.

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soj
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby soj » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:22 am

top30man wrote:
spicyyoda17 wrote:For those of us new to this game, what is it about UVA admissions that is so bad?

Nothing is bad, but people get frustrated with how numbers oriented it is. To achieve their medians with a large class they rely on splitter ED applicants. You are almost automatically admitted if one of your two numbers is at or above median. However, pretty much every T14 is numbers focused to a degree.

This. It seems unfair to many people that a 3.04/171 (below one median, above another, a lock for ED UVA) has a better chance of getting into UVA than a 3.82/169 (below both medians, most likely WL at best). Like top30 said, UVA is not the only school that does this, though.

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Tom Joad
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Tom Joad » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:26 am

Real Madrid wrote:I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.

On a scale of 1 (ate turkey sandwiches all day) to 10 (ate Flamin' Hot Cheetos™ all day) how butthurt are you that the top public school in the nation dinged you?

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HBBJohnStamos
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby HBBJohnStamos » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:36 am

Back to post that? You're better than that.

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Tom Joad
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Tom Joad » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:39 am

HBBJohnStamos wrote:Back to post that? You're better than that.

I had a few other posts and that tard is the definition of a one trick pony. That Red Sox Dodgers trade is nuts though. Talked to a big time Sox fan that was in favor of it though. I told him you don't trade A-Gon.

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HarlandBassett
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby HarlandBassett » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:40 am

soj wrote:
top30man wrote:
spicyyoda17 wrote:For those of us new to this game, what is it about UVA admissions that is so bad?

Nothing is bad, but people get frustrated with how numbers oriented it is. To achieve their medians with a large class they rely on splitter ED applicants. You are almost automatically admitted if one of your two numbers is at or above median. However, pretty much every T14 is numbers focused to a degree.

This. It seems unfair to many people that a 3.04/171 (below one median, above another, a lock for ED UVA) has a better chance of getting into UVA than a 3.82/169 (below both medians, most likely WL at best). Like top30 said, UVA is not the only school that does this, though.

how does the timing of the 3.04/171 admit affect scholly money? (b/c i read somewhere LSs toss more money for waitlisted-then-accepted students)

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soj
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby soj » Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:42 am

HarlandBassett wrote:how does the timing of the 3.04/171 admit affect scholly money? (b/c i read somewhere LSs toss more money for waitlisted-then-accepted students)

ED: no money.
RD: Some money. It may be that students accepted later get more money, but the opposite could also be true. No idea. Definitely a greater risk of not getting in.

Real Madrid
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby Real Madrid » Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:47 am

Tom Joad wrote:
Real Madrid wrote:I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Berkeley is a T10 school despite its medians whereas UVa is a T10 school because of them. (Berkeley's LSAT medians and 25th LSATs are the lowest in the T14, so that comparison doesn't exactly make UVA look good. Nevertheless, Berk's 25th GPA is almost two-tenths of a point higher - a pretty big difference when it comes to GPAs.)

Regardless, though I feel embarrassed for UVa because of their admissions practices, it's really all USNWR's fault and I totally understand why they do it.

On a scale of 1 (ate turkey sandwiches all day) to 10 (ate Flamin' Hot Cheetos™ all day) how butthurt are you that the top public school in the nation dinged you?


On a scale of 1 (mildly uneducated) to 10 (Sarah Palin), how stupid does one have to be to think UVA is the top public school in the world?

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smaug_
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Re: Class sizes and medians (c/o 2015)

Postby smaug_ » Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:53 am

On a scale of 1 (ate turkey sandwiches all day) to 10 (ate Flamin' Hot Cheetos™ all day) how butthurt are you that the top public school in the nation dinged you?


On a scale of 1 (mildly uneducated) to 10 (Sarah Palin), how stupid does one have to be to think UVA is the top public school in the world?


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