What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan Forum
- BruceWayne
- Posts: 2034
- Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:36 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
[quote="paulinaporizkova"]In the amount of hustle I've undergone so far, I am 100% sure that my T14 law degree from the school I'm at, not in the region I'm looking into, gives me an advantage over all the lower ranked schools in the region I'm looking into, some of which are solid schools. I just don't understand your doom and gloom sometimes. We have talked before. You got a firm job. It worked out the way you wanted it to work out. And I also know that you go to a T14 that feeds directly into the region you're from and wanted to work in/got a job back in. So I don't think you should be giving strongly worded advice to people not in that position because you didn't go through our particular job application process. Rayiner, thanks for your input.
also, really good grades vs. below a 3.2? that leaves a lot of middle ground that you don't appear to account for, and that's the GPA range most people are in[/quote]
That's because your grades are fine, if you had ended up where you thought you would at one point you would be in a very different situation.
As far as my doom and gloom thing even though things worked out for me is concerned; you have to understand that I have the exact set of circumstances where I would recommend someone go to UVA at sticker. I am from the South. That puts me in a very different position than my classmates who got my grades and are NOT from the South. In essence you yourself pointed that fact out. The people I know with similar grades to mine who aren't from the South, by and large, struck out and are working unpaid summer jobs and/or don't lead to full time employment. The one's that I know who graduated this year and last year with my grades who aren't from the South are not working paid jobs. That's why I'm doom and gloom. Finally, a lot more people at UVA have a 3.2 and below than many would like you to believe. 3.3 is the MEAN GPA at UVA.
also, really good grades vs. below a 3.2? that leaves a lot of middle ground that you don't appear to account for, and that's the GPA range most people are in[/quote]
That's because your grades are fine, if you had ended up where you thought you would at one point you would be in a very different situation.
As far as my doom and gloom thing even though things worked out for me is concerned; you have to understand that I have the exact set of circumstances where I would recommend someone go to UVA at sticker. I am from the South. That puts me in a very different position than my classmates who got my grades and are NOT from the South. In essence you yourself pointed that fact out. The people I know with similar grades to mine who aren't from the South, by and large, struck out and are working unpaid summer jobs and/or don't lead to full time employment. The one's that I know who graduated this year and last year with my grades who aren't from the South are not working paid jobs. That's why I'm doom and gloom. Finally, a lot more people at UVA have a 3.2 and below than many would like you to believe. 3.3 is the MEAN GPA at UVA.
-
- Posts: 212
- Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2012 8:25 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
TLSers, thanks for the input. I'm an international student, so I don't have ties in any of them.
So I should not apply for UVA ED?
How's my shot at Penn if I ED there? 167, 170, gpa hasn't been evaluated by LSAC, but top 5% in class.
So I should not apply for UVA ED?
How's my shot at Penn if I ED there? 167, 170, gpa hasn't been evaluated by LSAC, but top 5% in class.
-
- Posts: 358
- Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:51 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
paulina loses credibility when she utters the magic word- NETWORK!
right, that's the only thing holding these kids back, a lack of gumption and networking skills. couldn't be the fact that there are 2 grads for every 1 job.
op needs to assume the worst. and not being in a favorable market, should the worst occur, is a bad place to be.
right, that's the only thing holding these kids back, a lack of gumption and networking skills. couldn't be the fact that there are 2 grads for every 1 job.
op needs to assume the worst. and not being in a favorable market, should the worst occur, is a bad place to be.
-
- Posts: 358
- Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:51 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
op- i wouldn't know about your situation as it pertains to acceptances. uva was the only school in that echelon to take me, but that was probably a function of other schools watching their yields (176 lsat). that cycle was nuts. in your case, treat your 170 like the crazy asset it is. make schools fight over you. i'd never, under any circumstances, ed to a school. 170s are scarce. take advantage and get a deal.
- skers
- Posts: 5230
- Joined: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:33 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
People actually want to live in Charlottesville.
Want to continue reading?
Register now to search topics and post comments!
Absolutely FREE!
Already a member? Login
-
- Posts: 2489
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:25 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
around median or better at Virginia or Michigan when you're trying to get a job in Portland, or Seattle, or Phoenix, or WHEREVER, is not a bad place to be. below median might not be bad either, i'm not sure. the problem sometimes is the people there are entitled and think jobs will fall into their laps when they go to t14s and so they are shocked and surprised when it doesn't happen. people with bad grades have hustled and made it happen. also there are thousands of grads from shitty law schools every year. but UM and UVa have some of the best job prospects in the country. you're trying to make it seem like even t14ers have a 1 in 2 chance of getting a good legal job. that's just not the case. quit being so fucking EMO everyone, MY GOD I hate law studentsze2151 wrote:paulina loses credibility when she utters the magic word- NETWORK!
right, that's the only thing holding these kids back, a lack of gumption and networking skills. couldn't be the fact that there are 2 grads for every 1 job.
op needs to assume the worst. and not being in a favorable market, should the worst occur, is a bad place to be.
-
- Posts: 835
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 12:21 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
-
- Posts: 2489
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:25 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
u mad u got rejected?Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
- 2014
- Posts: 6028
- Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:53 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
I imagine Michigan did not appreciate its drop in ranks last year (or rather a failure to rise in ranks while everyone around them succeeded) and an easy solution would be to buy 170s.mr_toad wrote:Not necessarily true unless Michigan is trying to raise its median, which it hasn't shown any sign of doing. Otherwise, 170s are more valuable to UVA to maintain its current median, especially in a year where there are fewer test-takers and thus fewer 170s overall for Penn, Duke, Georgetown (the other 170-median schools off the top of my head).2014 wrote:Michigan's median is 169, UVA's is 170. By paying for 170s Michigan stands to gain, UVA does not.
-
- Posts: 451
- Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:59 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
LOL he mad Michigan had 75.46% in jobs requiring a JD. Should have just went to St. Mary's in Texas bro.Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
- BruceWayne
- Posts: 2034
- Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:36 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
I don't think you realize how many people in your class don't have median or better grades. Those below that threshold are in very dangerous territory (i.e half of the class). I'm not saying it's all doom and gloom or being "EMO", but I don't think you're as aware of the number of people struggling. This isn't 2007.paulinaporizkova wrote:around median or better at Virginia or Michigan when you're trying to get a job in Portland, or Seattle, or Phoenix, or WHEREVER, is not a bad place to be. below median might not be bad either, i'm not sure. the problem sometimes is the people there are entitled and think jobs will fall into their laps when they go to t14s and so they are shocked and surprised when it doesn't happen. people with bad grades have hustled and made it happen. also there are thousands of grads from shitty law schools every year. but UM and UVa have some of the best job prospects in the country. you're trying to make it seem like even t14ers have a 1 in 2 chance of getting a good legal job. that's just not the case. quit being so fucking EMO everyone, MY GOD I hate law students
- buckilaw
- Posts: 839
- Joined: Fri May 07, 2010 1:27 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
You can probably buy a properly cooked grit if you're at Virginia, I can't say the same about Ann Arbor.
Last edited by buckilaw on Wed Jul 11, 2012 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 451
- Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:59 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Who cares, as fucked as a T-14 grad without a job is, theres 20 more fucked non-T14 grads with just as much debt so you're best of the worse. People worry too much.
Register now!
Resources to assist law school applicants, students & graduates.
It's still FREE!
Already a member? Login
-
- Posts: 2489
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:25 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Which is why I made the disclaimer. Bottom third isn't gonna coast by. They will need OCS help. But if they hustle they can make it happen, in most cases I would say. SOMETHING will work out. Maybe it won't be big law, and that's an argument for keeping debt down wherever you go right now. But the adverse to bottom third not coasting by is that middle third is manageable and top third is cake, by and large.BruceWayne wrote:I don't think you realize how many people in your class don't have median or better grades. Those below that threshold are in very dangerous territory (i.e half of the class). I'm not saying it's all doom and gloom or being "EMO", but I don't think you're as aware of the number of people struggling. This isn't 2007.paulinaporizkova wrote:around median or better at Virginia or Michigan when you're trying to get a job in Portland, or Seattle, or Phoenix, or WHEREVER, is not a bad place to be. below median might not be bad either, i'm not sure. the problem sometimes is the people there are entitled and think jobs will fall into their laps when they go to t14s and so they are shocked and surprised when it doesn't happen. people with bad grades have hustled and made it happen. also there are thousands of grads from shitty law schools every year. but UM and UVa have some of the best job prospects in the country. you're trying to make it seem like even t14ers have a 1 in 2 chance of getting a good legal job. that's just not the case. quit being so fucking EMO everyone, MY GOD I hate law students
-
- Posts: 358
- Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:51 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
paulina- bottom third at uva is a bad, bad place to be based on the available data and based on anecdotal evidence i've gathered. no amount of "networking" is going to put you in the room if you don't have the keys to get in the room.
but no, i'm just being "emo" about the situation. b/c any time you have the opportunity to take out 150k dollars in loans with a 33 pct risk of no options and running from bill collectors for your entire adult life, you have to do it.
what you need to do, paulina, is stop kidding yourself that the lower top 14 is somehow insulated from the disaster. it isn't.
but no, i'm just being "emo" about the situation. b/c any time you have the opportunity to take out 150k dollars in loans with a 33 pct risk of no options and running from bill collectors for your entire adult life, you have to do it.
what you need to do, paulina, is stop kidding yourself that the lower top 14 is somehow insulated from the disaster. it isn't.
- rayiner
- Posts: 6145
- Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2008 11:43 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
paulinaporizkova wrote:Which is why I made the disclaimer. Bottom third isn't gonna coast by. They will need OCS help. But if they hustle they can make it happen, in most cases I would say. SOMETHING will work out. Maybe it won't be big law, and that's an argument for keeping debt down wherever you go right now.
As a C/O 2012 grad from another T14, I have to say that the "SOMETHING" is usually a quite undesirable outcome. Most of my class got big law or a clerkship, a few got a legitimate PI job. The rest didn't get a comfortable $85k small firm job. They have no options worth taking right now. Once you're outside the range of big law, you're off a cliff.
-
- Posts: 239
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:43 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
im sure hes furious, every other post of his has been filled with UVa hate ever since receiving that rejection letter.paulinaporizkova wrote:u mad u got rejected?Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
looking at his post history is like DVRing chappelles player hater ball. HATEHATEHATE
Get unlimited access to all forums and topics
Register now!
I'm pretty sure I told you it's FREE...
Already a member? Login
-
- Posts: 835
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 12:21 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
paulinaporizkova wrote:u mad u got rejected?Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
More like bewildered that a "top 10" school lets in 162, 3.9 sociology majors for the sheer sake of maintaining its "170, 3.85" median. Also glad that I won't be attending the second worst T14 employability-wise according to rayiner's research.
-
- Posts: 835
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 12:21 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
I did get rejected, but I also got rejected from Penn and Chicago, and I have nothing against those two schools. I just find UVa's admissions policies to be so blatantly stupid and pathetic that I'm actually embarrassed for the school.barneytrouble wrote:im sure hes furious, every other post of his has been filled with UVa hate ever since receiving that rejection letter.paulinaporizkova wrote:u mad u got rejected?Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
looking at his post history is like DVRing chappelles player hater ball. HATEHATEHATE
Who knows; maybe if they were a tad bit more holistic they wouldn't be placing one fifth of their graduates in school-funded jobs.
-
- Posts: 451
- Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:59 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Again, who the fuck cares. T14 is better than about ~200 law schools give or take with many who probably have nearly as much debt, if not more. They're fucked, you may be fucked, who cares.
Attending law school is probably a moral hazard in the sense theres a good chance you'll have debt you can't repay, but you'll never have to pay for that dumb decision - someone will step in the way and bail you out in this country, because thats just the way things are now.
Attending law school is probably a moral hazard in the sense theres a good chance you'll have debt you can't repay, but you'll never have to pay for that dumb decision - someone will step in the way and bail you out in this country, because thats just the way things are now.
- JamMasterJ
- Posts: 6649
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:17 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Not sure if anyone mentioned this, but on top of this, some of the most selective schools give out a shit-ton of money. See, for instance, H vs Yrayiner wrote:Why would the first part of your post have anything to do with the second part? Within the T14, admissions selectivity is only loosely correlated with placement.Just wrote:From what I heard, it seems to be hard to get scholarship from UVA with a 170, but for Umich, a 170 can get you at least some money. Is this correct?
So, what's the edge of UVA over umich, except clerkship? Does UVA place better in NYC big laws recently?
Thanks!
Communicate now with those who not only know what a legal education is, but can offer you worthy advice and commentary as you complete the three most educational, yet challenging years of your law related post graduate life.
Register now, it's still FREE!
Already a member? Login
- rayiner
- Posts: 6145
- Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2008 11:43 am
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Michigan is pretty holistic and it doesn't seem to be working that great for them.Real Madrid wrote:
Who knows; maybe if they were a tad bit more holistic they wouldn't be placing one fifth of their graduates in school-funded jobs.
UVA's problem isn't that it's taking splitters, it's that it isn't taking engineer splitters. Every 172/2.8 engineer that NU takes is a sticker-paying student that's going to pump up the employment stats because he's IPSECURE.
Last edited by rayiner on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 239
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:43 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
What can I say about your posts that hasn't been said about Afghanistan?Real Madrid wrote:I did get rejected, but I also got rejected from Penn and Chicago, and I have nothing against those two schools. I just find UVa's admissions policies to be so blatantly stupid and pathetic that I'm actually embarrassed for the school.barneytrouble wrote:im sure hes furious, every other post of his has been filled with UVa hate ever since receiving that rejection letter.paulinaporizkova wrote:u mad u got rejected?Real Madrid wrote:Its main advantage is that it's much better at gaming the shit out of USNWR's ranking system by accepting tons of splitters and reverse splitters so that it can maintain its wildly inflated medians. Oh, and it's also better at providing shit tons of graduates with school-funded jobs to game the rankings on the back end.
Otherwise, it's more or less equal.
looking at his post history is like DVRing chappelles player hater ball. HATEHATEHATE
Who knows; maybe if they were a tad bit more holistic they wouldn't be placing one fifth of their graduates in school-funded jobs.
- JamMasterJ
- Posts: 6649
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:17 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
except crumpetsandtea, though she's biglaw securerayiner wrote:Michigan is pretty holistic and it doesn't seem to be working that great for them.Real Madrid wrote:
Who knows; maybe if they were a tad bit more holistic they wouldn't be placing one fifth of their graduates in school-funded jobs.
UVA's problem isn't that it's taking splitters, it's that it isn't taking engineer splitters. Every 172/2.8 engineer that NU takes is a sticker-paying student that's going to pump up the employment stats because he's IPSECURE.
- soj
- Posts: 7888
- Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:10 pm
Re: What's Virginia's advantage over Michigan
Aren't you going to Berkeley?Real Madrid wrote:More like bewildered that a "top 10" school lets in 162, 3.9 sociology majors for the sheer sake of maintaining its "170, 3.85" median.
Seriously? What are you waiting for?
Now there's a charge.
Just kidding ... it's still FREE!
Already a member? Login