Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

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hung jury
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby hung jury » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:31 pm

RVP11 wrote:I had no/few LA ties, went to MVP, and I would bet I had more callbacks at good LA firms than any person from UCLA/USC with equivalent grades (top quarter).

The idea that Berkeley will do better than CCNMVP (or D, or N) in LA is based on nothing more than "hey, they're both in California, bro!"


Not sure why u mad but:

The question is whether you would have had more callbacks with the same grades at Berkeley. You said absolutely nothing relevant to that point.

Also keep in mind that ties often become more important at the less grade heavy firms (where "fit" is more important), so extrapolating from one case of someone in the top 1/4 is pretty misleading.

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RVP11
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby RVP11 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:38 pm

hung jury wrote:
RVP11 wrote:I had no/few LA ties, went to MVP, and I would bet I had more callbacks at good LA firms than any person from UCLA/USC with equivalent grades (top quarter).

The idea that Berkeley will do better than CCNMVP (or D, or N) in LA is based on nothing more than "hey, they're both in California, bro!"


Not sure why u mad but:

The question is whether you would have had more callbacks with the same grades at Berkeley. You said absolutely nothing relevant to that point.

Also keep in mind that ties often become more important at the less grade heavy firms (where "fit" is more important), so extrapolating from one case of someone in the top 1/4 is pretty misleading.


(guy who ignores Berkeley's grading system and how every Berkeley OCI results thread is a bloodbath)

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hung jury
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby hung jury » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:44 pm

RVP11 wrote:
hung jury wrote:
RVP11 wrote:I had no/few LA ties, went to MVP, and I would bet I had more callbacks at good LA firms than any person from UCLA/USC with equivalent grades (top quarter).

The idea that Berkeley will do better than CCNMVP (or D, or N) in LA is based on nothing more than "hey, they're both in California, bro!"


Not sure why u mad but:

The question is whether you would have had more callbacks with the same grades at Berkeley. You said absolutely nothing relevant to that point.

Also keep in mind that ties often become more important at the less grade heavy firms (where "fit" is more important), so extrapolating from one case of someone in the top 1/4 is pretty misleading.


(guy who ignores Berkeley's grading system and how every Berkeley OCI results thread is a bloodbath)


Again, nothing your claiming suggests you understand what it would take to make a meaningful comparison across schools. The California market is competitive. It hurts B. But if slagging B makes you feel like "MVP" is more preftttigious go ahead.

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RVP11
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby RVP11 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:52 pm

I said the idea that Berkeley places better than comparable schools in LA is based on nothing more than the fact that Berkeley is in California. That's the only part of my post that related to Berkeley.

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hung jury
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby hung jury » Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:02 pm

RVP11 wrote:I said the idea that Berkeley places better than comparable schools in LA is based on nothing more than the fact that Berkeley is in California. That's the only part of my post that related to Berkeley.


Fair enough, I guess you were making two separate claims.

But the fact that Berkeley is in California is relevant to a decent chunk of firms. It doesn't seem to do the best in biglaw placement but if the aim is SoCal biglaw I really can't see a reason for going out east unless the financial aid is unequal, etc. If you were median at MVP I suspect lack of ties might have become more of an issue in trying to break into the market.

enigmabk
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby enigmabk » Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:06 pm

TCR is Berk? then CCN?

Real Madrid
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Real Madrid » Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:42 pm

RVP11 wrote:I said the idea that Berkeley places better than comparable schools in LA is based on nothing more than the fact that Berkeley is in California. That's the only part of my post that related to Berkeley.


Uh, yeah, that's kinda the point.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:54 pm

AssumptionRequired wrote:So much trolling in here. HYS>>CCNB>>MVP>>USC/UCLA

T14 schools are still higher on firms list than USC/UCLA even in LA. They know what the top schools are and they want those graduates. Plus its easy to snag grads from UCLA and USC being so close but those at HYCCNMVP are probably harder to come by in their market. They want to hire from ALL top schools, not just a couple and HYS. Oh, and no way is P>V>M in CA. (in any order, they will be seen as equals there)



I call bullshit.. No way PENN, Virginia, and Michigan trump UCLA/USC in home market. At best they are equal is my guess. Unless that is confirmed by personal experience with LA market mes thinks YDKWTFYATA.

But def willing to be proven wrong by someone WDKWTFTATA.
Last edited by Lawquacious on Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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BruceWayne
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby BruceWayne » Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:55 pm

From everything I've ever seen with legal hiring; all markets not named NYC work like this

HYS
The top 14 in the region
Every other top 14

I'm not sure why California would be any different. Especially considering they have a top 14 right in the state.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:57 pm

RVP11 wrote:The idea that Berkeley will do better than CCNMVP (or D, or N) in LA is based on nothing more than "hey, they're both in California, bro!"



Definitely disagree. But again, let's get someone who actually really knows the LA biglaw market in here..

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Tiago Splitter » Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:16 pm

Since you have to be roughly top third to get BigLaw from USC/UCLA one reading this thread would think you'd need top third from any non-HYS T14 (other than Berkeley apparently.) Has anyone landed LA BigLaw from lower than top third somewhere other than HYSB?

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Lawquacious
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:26 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:Since you have to be roughly top third to get BigLaw from USC/UCLA one reading this thread would think you'd need top third from any non-HYS T14 (other than Berkeley apparently.) Has anyone landed LA BigLaw from lower than top third somewhere other than HYSB?


Point well taken (although as of yet no one has posted, I think you may point out a valid metric that will in fact demonstrate that T14s are--at the very least--on par with or better than UCLA/USC for LA). But I really think that PENN, Virginia (and even NYU) and perhaps some other t14s don't place nearly as well in West/West Coast as many people think they do, and, as always, with biglaw a lot of it comes down to TIES, TIES, TIES in addition to good grades.

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FlightoftheEarls
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby FlightoftheEarls » Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:23 pm

Lawquacious wrote:I call bullshit.. No way PENN, Virginia, and Michigan trump UCLA/USC in home market. At best they are equal is my guess. Unless that is confirmed by personal experience with LA market mes thinks YDKWTFYATA.

But def willing to be proven wrong by someone WDKWTFTATA.

I think you're wrong here, unfortunately. Michigan's average offer GPA for a decent number of LA biglaw firms is around (or even below) median, and the typical acceptance rate naturally tends to be lower than the average offer rate. The average person landing offers at many of LA's top firms tends to be around top 25% at Michigan.

I'm willing to bet that it's a tad bit tougher to get LA's most selective biglaw firms from USC/UCLA (and LA biglaw in general). Add in the fact that you're competing against nearly all of your class (plus the other school) for those 6-8 spots taken by local schools, and I would take a school like Michigan every day of the week.

Tiago Splitter wrote:Since you have to be roughly top third to get BigLaw from USC/UCLA one reading this thread would think you'd need top third from any non-HYS T14 (other than Berkeley apparently.) Has anyone landed LA BigLaw from lower than top third somewhere other than HYSB?

Yes - Los Angeles is certainly the second easiest market at Michigan (GPA-wise) following New York. The GPA requirements between New York and Los Angeles are pretty comparable for the majority of firms.

Finally, I have yet to see anything thing to verify that CCN has any advantage over other T14 in non-New York biglaw hiring. I might believe that Chicago could be easier to land from just because of the small class size and firm's desire to just snag one Chicago student for their summer class, but that's it. Outside of NY, it's generally HYS>all. Some of the posturing on here based on USNews rankings is legitimately getting out of control.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:41 pm

FlightoftheEarls wrote:
Lawquacious wrote:I call bullshit.. No way PENN, Virginia, and Michigan trump UCLA/USC in home market. At best they are equal is my guess. Unless that is confirmed by personal experience with LA market mes thinks YDKWTFYATA.

But def willing to be proven wrong by someone WDKWTFTATA.

I think you're wrong here, unfortunately. Michigan's average offer GPA for a decent number of LA biglaw firms is around (or even below) median, and the typical acceptance rate naturally tends to be lower than the average offer rate. The average person landing offers at many of LA's top firms tends to be around top 25% at Michigan.

I'm willing to bet that it's a tad bit tougher to get LA's most selective biglaw firms from USC/UCLA (and LA biglaw in general). Add in the fact that you're competing against nearly all of your class (plus the other school) for those 6-8 spots taken by local schools, and I would take a school like Michigan every day of the week.


If you see my second post, you'll notice I didn't name Michigan, in part because I understand Michigan to place stronger than a number of the East Coast T14s into California. But I did mention it in the post you copied here, and your points are well taken. I really am just speculating on the LA market, but I think most ppl ITT are as well--it would be nice to have someone in LA biglaw hiring to actually comment.

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FlightoftheEarls
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby FlightoftheEarls » Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:20 pm

Lawquacious wrote:
FlightoftheEarls wrote:
Lawquacious wrote:I call bullshit.. No way PENN, Virginia, and Michigan trump UCLA/USC in home market. At best they are equal is my guess. Unless that is confirmed by personal experience with LA market mes thinks YDKWTFYATA.

But def willing to be proven wrong by someone WDKWTFTATA.

I think you're wrong here, unfortunately. Michigan's average offer GPA for a decent number of LA biglaw firms is around (or even below) median, and the typical acceptance rate naturally tends to be lower than the average offer rate. The average person landing offers at many of LA's top firms tends to be around top 25% at Michigan.

I'm willing to bet that it's a tad bit tougher to get LA's most selective biglaw firms from USC/UCLA (and LA biglaw in general). Add in the fact that you're competing against nearly all of your class (plus the other school) for those 6-8 spots taken by local schools, and I would take a school like Michigan every day of the week.


If you see my second post, you'll notice I didn't name Michigan, in part because I understand Michigan to place stronger than a number of the East Coast T14s into California. But I did mention it in the post you copied here, and your points are well taken. I really am just speculating on the LA market, but I think most ppl ITT are as well--it would be nice to have someone in LA biglaw hiring to actually comment.

Yeah, that's entirely fair. My only experience is with NY/SF, and obviously I can only comment on Michigan and not other schools.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Jun 30, 2012 10:20 am

UCal-Berkeley.

EdgarWinter
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby EdgarWinter » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:28 pm

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Last edited by EdgarWinter on Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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moonman157
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby moonman157 » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:45 pm

EdgarWinter wrote:Just because Berkeley places a lot of people in LA does not mean that it is actually better at that placement than other schools. There's a huge self-selection thing. Lots of people at Berkeley want LA, the same is not true for other schools. Since at OCI you are competing against classmates, not really against other schools, I'd bet that it is harder for a given student at Berkeley to land LA than it would be if said student had gone to Columbia or Chicago (where relatively few people want LA and competition is ergo relatively light).


Self-selection, though, also means that there will be less LA firms at non-Berk OCIs

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Redamon1
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Re: Best school for LA BIGLAW outside of HYS

Postby Redamon1 » Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:30 pm

EdgarWinter wrote:Just because Berkeley places a lot of people in LA does not mean that it is actually better at that placement than other schools. There's a huge self-selection thing. Lots of people at Berkeley want LA, the same is not true for other schools. Since at OCI you are competing against classmates, not really against other schools, I'd bet that it is harder for a given student at Berkeley to land LA than it would be if said student had gone to Columbia or Chicago (where relatively few people want LA and competition is ergo relatively light).


Right, just like we can never be sure that NYU places better in NYC that other T14...




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