2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

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JD Janitor
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2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby JD Janitor » Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:37 pm

Law.com has published this little gem regarding law school admissions this year:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1

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banjo
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby banjo » Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:03 pm

Zearfoss said that one law school, which she declined to identify, offered half-tuition scholarships to each wait-list applicant they decided to offer admission. These offers can create discord within a law school class, she said, particularly when lower-performing students receive more scholarship money than students with better academic credentials.


Which school is this?

abc12345675
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby abc12345675 » Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:06 pm

banjo wrote:
Zearfoss said that one law school, which she declined to identify, offered half-tuition scholarships to each wait-list applicant they decided to offer admission. These offers can create discord within a law school class, she said, particularly when lower-performing students receive more scholarship money than students with better academic credentials.


Which school is this?


Don't know, but something similar happened to me last cycle. Got waitlisted to Case Western. Didn't accept my spot on the waitlist and never wrote them anything. 2 weeks before deposits were due, I got accepted off the waitlist. I didn't respond still. 3 weeks after deposits were due, I get an email saying they're offering me a $30,000 per year scholarship with only "good academic standing" stip.

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Teflon_Jeff
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby Teflon_Jeff » Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:11 pm

banjo wrote:
Zearfoss said that one law school, which she declined to identify, offered half-tuition scholarships to each wait-list applicant they decided to offer admission. These offers can create discord within a law school class, she said, particularly when lower-performing students receive more scholarship money than students with better academic credentials.


Which school is this?


Could be any number of schools. I've gotten 1/2 offers from a few schools off the waitlist so far.

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1776
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby 1776 » Mon Jun 25, 2012 4:12 pm

JD Janitor wrote:Law.com has published this little gem regarding law school admissions this year:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1


I received an inordinate amount of scholarships at places that I was at or below median. I'm glad I applied this cycle. When I applied to undergrad, it was the most competitive year in history (now it's not). I was able to get a nice package for the fall because of the drop in apps. Hopefully that results in less competition for jobs when I graduate!

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JD Janitor
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby JD Janitor » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:44 pm

With all of the negativity (deserved) regarding law schools, I am surprised that this has no more interest than it does. Very interesting. Maybe there is less to say regarding positive news.

PolySuyGuy
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby PolySuyGuy » Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:53 pm

Teflon_Jeff wrote:Could be any number of schools. I've gotten 1/2 offers from a few schools off the waitlist so far.



You do have an extremely high LSAT, especially for your GPA.

MrAnon
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby MrAnon » Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:06 pm

Pretty sure the law schools still come away the winners here. It would be awesome if going to law school meant something in an of itself. Unfortunately the degree is so utterly and completely worthless the schools will just take anyone nowadays and throw money at them to boot. I guess that's what the article is trying to sell? Its unclear.

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Teflon_Jeff
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby Teflon_Jeff » Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:17 pm

PolySuyGuy wrote:
Teflon_Jeff wrote:Could be any number of schools. I've gotten 1/2 offers from a few schools off the waitlist so far.



You do have an extremely high LSAT, especially for your GPA.


Thanks for noticing ;-)

Yeah, it seems they are buying up splitters pretty hungrily. I expect a busy summer for most applicants, as the domino effect will only continue as mid-tier schools start scrambling.

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hung jury
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby hung jury » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:41 am

Applicants should take advantage of the relaxed admissions standards and unusually deep pot of scholarship money while they can — there simply isn't enough money to keep doling out scholarships at this pace every year, said Sophia Sim, associate dean for admissions and financial aid at George Washington University Law School.


Except they aren't actual doling out money, they're simply reducing the cost of tuition they are charging you to attend -- given their fixed costs (faculty salaries, buildings, etc.), anybody they can put into a seat for even a small charge is better than nothing. And since the number of applicants is still in a downward spiral, and all the negative press regarding law school suggests it will continue, why should a student feel the need to rush to get in on the action? If a school might be folding or cutting its services (e.g. faculty layoffs) because it can't afford its current business model that is hardly a reason to rush into the school while one can.

In any event, if I was one of those students who agreed to full freight at the beginning of the cycle I'd be withdrawing pretty quickly. The schools are practically screaming that their degrees aren't worth full price. So why pay full price when the seat next to you is being subsidized with your tuition dollars?

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dowu
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby dowu » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:46 am

Ive said this once and ill say it again. I hope this trend continues through next cycle. :)

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HarlandBassett
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby HarlandBassett » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:53 am

hung jury wrote:
Applicants should take advantage of the relaxed admissions standards and unusually deep pot of scholarship money while they can — there simply isn't enough money to keep doling out scholarships at this pace every year, said Sophia Sim, associate dean for admissions and financial aid at George Washington University Law School.


Except they aren't actual doling out money, they're simply reducing the cost of tuition they are charging you to attend -- given their fixed costs (faculty salaries, buildings, etc.), anybody they can put into a seat for even a small charge is better than nothing. And since the number of applicants is still in a downward spiral, and all the negative press regarding law school suggests it will continue, why should a student feel the need to rush to get in on the action? If a school might be folding or cutting its services (e.g. faculty layoffs) because it can't afford its current business model that is hardly a reason to rush into the school while one can.

In any event, if I was one of those students who agreed to full freight at the beginning of the cycle I'd be withdrawing pretty quickly. The schools are practically screaming that their degrees aren't worth full price. So why pay full price when the seat next to you is being subsidized with your tuition dollars?

GWU Law huh....interesting....

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/06/george-w ... e-funding/



on a side note, this feels like "hurry up and buy now! limited time offer!"
the offer may still be there 3 or 4 cycles later, and biglaw reverts down to 145k NYC scale.

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sunynp
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby sunynp » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:09 am

Note this thread from the weekend discusses this article as well:

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=187690

Also there is no sign that NYC biglaw salaries are going down. The biggest pressure on salaries in NYC is housing costs and other COL.

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HarlandBassett
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby HarlandBassett » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:16 am

sunynp wrote:Also there is no sign that NYC biglaw salaries are going down. The biggest pressure on salaries in NYC is housing costs and other COL.

just speculation on my part (based on, ironically, lowered housing prices)

http://usawatchdog.com/one-on-one-with- ... adowstats/

Williams says, “The next crash will be a lot worse (than 2008) because it will push us into the early stages of hyperinflation.” He predicts this will happen “by the end of 2014– at the latest.”

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minnbills
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby minnbills » Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:19 am

HarlandBassett wrote:
Williams says, “The next crash will be a lot worse (than 2008) because it will push us into the early stages of hyperinflation.” He predicts this will happen “by the end of 2014– at the latest.”


Nah, we're not going to have hyperinflation bro.

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PDaddy
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby PDaddy » Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:52 am

If enough people hear this, we could see a (return to 2008-2010 levels) glut of 2012/13 apps. That would NOT be good.

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sd5289
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby sd5289 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:47 pm

The trickle-down effect of competition for students may be hitting lower-tier schools the hardest. Sherolyn Hurst, assistant dean for admissions and scholarships at the unranked Texas Wesleyan University School of Law, acknowledged that her school has had a hard time competing.

"It's frustrating for me," she said. "I'm seeing colleagues offering scholarships to people they wouldn't have admitted last year. We don't have millions of dollars in an endowment, but we're trying to do right by our students."


Awww, it's "frustrating" for you after years of charging astronomical tuition rates combined with a never-ending increase in tuition and fees every single year?

There is no end to my sympathy for you... [/sarcasm]

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HarlandBassett
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Re: 2012: best year to apply to law screwol?

Postby HarlandBassett » Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:42 pm

HarlandBassett wrote:on a side note, this feels like "hurry up and buy now! limited time offer!"
the offer may still be there 3 or 4 cycles later, and biglaw reverts down to 145k NYC scale.


just read a comment (see below)...i might be posting this purely out of confirmation bias :D
http://insidethelawschoolscam.blogspot. ... mment-form

I'm sure you've read the law.com piece by now, LP, but one of the interesting things to come out it was echoed above: the new sales pitch of "get your reduced tuition this year while we can, because we won't have the money to do it again next year." One of the lines you now see on TLS is applicants hesitant to wait out a cycle because the money might not be there next year.

Of course, as long as trajectory in applicants is downward--and there has been ZERO evidence that it isn't still trending down or at worst leveling off, as evidenced by the February LSAT numbers--this simply isn't true. There is no doubt that next cycle will also see an intense struggle to retain students that match past year's admitted student body, but there is no reason to suspect that schools won't be equally competitive in trying to attract the best class it can. Given the incentives to maintain the same size student body (any money is better than nothing, even full scholarship applicants might contribute via post-graduation donations, a shrinking school size is a tacit recognition of drop in demand for the school, etc.), there will be more, rather than less, pressure on schools next cycle to attract as many students as they can while maintaining their USNews numbers.

See:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1




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