Cornell vs. Texas

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lightswitch
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Cornell vs. Texas

Postby lightswitch » Tue Jun 19, 2012 1:57 pm

Texas is offering instate tuition (not a Texas resident) and 7k a year. Cornell is offering 7k a year flat. Difference in cost is ~25k a year, for an additional 75k in debt after graduation.

My question here is if attending Cornell is worth it if a) I want biglaw, and b) I'm not sure if I want to live in Texas. According to the stats I've looked at around 70% of Texas students end up working in Texas. Any help would be appreciated.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby Doorkeeper » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:19 pm

Cornell has a strong advantage for NYC biglaw, but the brand diminishes outside of New York. I would be wary of 75k more if you're not sure you want to go to NYC.

lightswitch
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby lightswitch » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:21 pm

I went to NYU undergrad. Liked it there, wouldn't mind living there after law school. Not sure about Texas at all. Anyone else have to make this choice? Is the differential in cost that large compared to the benefits?

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spleenworship
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby spleenworship » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:30 pm

I would go Texas.

1) Texas is actually an awesome state. They have all kinds of ecosystems there, the people are actually quite nice, there are beaches, camping, hunting, fishing, car racing, professional sports teams... the list goes on and on. And there are parts of the state that are quite liberal if that is one of your concerns.
2) Austin is filled with hotties of both sexes, has an amazing nightlife and club scene, and is just a great town to live in (Ithica has NONE of those things from everything I've heard).
3) $75,000 is still a crapton of money. And if you stay in Texas you will make nearly NYC money in biglaw, but your cost of living will be about half... which means less debt with more discretionary income. Oh, and there is no state income tax in Texas.
4) Biglaw placement is about the same, if I remember correctly.

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spleenworship
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby spleenworship » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:31 pm

lightswitch wrote:I went to NYU undergrad. Liked it there, wouldn't mind living there after law school. Not sure about Texas at all. Anyone else have to make this choice? Is the differential in cost that large compared to the benefits?


There are parts of the country that at quite nice that aren't on a coast. FYI.

crit_racer
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby crit_racer » Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:48 pm

spleenworship wrote:I would go Texas.

1) Texas is actually an awesome state. They have all kinds of ecosystems there, the people are actually quite nice, there are beaches, camping, hunting, fishing, car racing, professional sports teams... the list goes on and on. And there are parts of the state that are quite liberal if that is one of your concerns.
2) Austin is filled with hotties of both sexes, has an amazing nightlife and club scene, and is just a great town to live in (Ithica has NONE of those things from everything I've heard).
3) $75,000 is still a crapton of money. And if you stay in Texas you will make nearly NYC money in biglaw, but your cost of living will be about half... which means less debt with more discretionary income. Oh, and there is no state income tax in Texas.
4) Biglaw placement is about the same, if I remember correctly.


False.

Also, lots of people like TX, but even more hate it. As a UT studnet, I can tell you that your options will be somewhat limited coming from UT. If you aren't at least OK with living in TX, I would go to Cornell. Also, much better shot at biglaw in general coming from Cornell.

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T00L
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby T00L » Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:53 pm

crit_racer wrote:
spleenworship wrote:I would go Texas.

1) Texas is actually an awesome state. They have all kinds of ecosystems there, the people are actually quite nice, there are beaches, camping, hunting, fishing, car racing, professional sports teams... the list goes on and on. And there are parts of the state that are quite liberal if that is one of your concerns.
2) Austin is filled with hotties of both sexes, has an amazing nightlife and club scene, and is just a great town to live in (Ithica has NONE of those things from everything I've heard).
3) $75,000 is still a crapton of money. And if you stay in Texas you will make nearly NYC money in biglaw, but your cost of living will be about half... which means less debt with more discretionary income. Oh, and there is no state income tax in Texas.
4) Biglaw placement is about the same, if I remember correctly.


False.

Also, lots of people like TX, but even more hate it. As a UT studnet, I can tell you that your options will be somewhat limited coming from UT. If you aren't at least OK with living in TX, I would go to Cornell. Also, much better shot at biglaw in general coming from Cornell.


ya.... double false. If you were from texas, I would tell you to go there. Also, as nice as Austin is, you should think about how well you deal with distractions such as (1) and (2)...

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Ruxin1
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby Ruxin1 » Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:55 pm

T00L wrote:
crit_racer wrote:
spleenworship wrote:I would go Texas.

1) Texas is actually an awesome state. They have all kinds of ecosystems there, the people are actually quite nice, there are beaches, camping, hunting, fishing, car racing, professional sports teams... the list goes on and on. And there are parts of the state that are quite liberal if that is one of your concerns.
2) Austin is filled with hotties of both sexes, has an amazing nightlife and club scene, and is just a great town to live in (Ithica has NONE of those things from everything I've heard).
3) $75,000 is still a crapton of money. And if you stay in Texas you will make nearly NYC money in biglaw, but your cost of living will be about half... which means less debt with more discretionary income. Oh, and there is no state income tax in Texas.
4) Biglaw placement is about the same, if I remember correctly.


False.

Also, lots of people like TX, but even more hate it. As a UT studnet, I can tell you that your options will be somewhat limited coming from UT. If you aren't at least OK with living in TX, I would go to Cornell. Also, much better shot at biglaw in general coming from Cornell.


ya.... double false. If you were from texas, I would tell you to go there. Also, as nice as Austin is, you should think about how well you deal with distractions such as (1) and (2)...


No ties to TX pretty much eliminates any placement advantages the school has.

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:00 pm

This. OP - Your chances of making $100K (not just including 50+ attorney firms) a year immediately after graduation are dramatically higher at Cornell. While it's true that your money goes farther in Texas, your chances of getting a high paying job are are a lot lower in Texas as compared to New York.

It's like this: controlling for where you have ties to, I wouldn't go to Texas if I didn't want Texas and I wouldn't go to Cornell if I didn't want NYC. If you are targeting secondary locations where you have ties to, I imagine that having Cornell on your resume would get you more interviews/call backs/offers. While there is no evidence as to whether or not that is true, Cornell's natural relative dominance in large firms is fair circumstantial evidence of this.

However, $75,000 is not exactly pocket change for someone in their 20's. But - how much is the added chances of big law? I know that Cornell, over the last 5 years, averages around ~25% more of the class in NLJ firms. But is that worth $75,000? Who knows.

scaredofdebt
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby scaredofdebt » Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:18 pm

If you are not from texas or sure you want to be there (most likely houston or Dallas) long term then go to cornell.

lightswitch
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby lightswitch » Thu Jun 21, 2012 1:37 am

In terms of biglaw prospects, I thought UT has the Houston and Dallas market pretty much locked down. Do those biglaw firms pay significantly less than NYC firms? Also, does Cornell actually have a higher chance of biglaw?

CanadianWolf
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:19 am

If you don't want to live in Texas, then Cornell is the better option since you like NYC.

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dpk711
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby dpk711 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:28 am

If you have any doubts about TX then I recommend Cornell.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:33 am

Law school is not a good time to experiment living in an unfamiliar region of the country. It's a time to build professional contacts & relationships in the geographic area in which you plan to live & practice.

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jenesaislaw
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby jenesaislaw » Thu Jun 21, 2012 9:48 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Law school is not a good time to experiment living in an unfamiliar region of the country. It's a time to build professional contacts & relationships in the geographic area in which you plan to live & practice.


Sound advice. Texas is a great place to be in my opinion, but I've also lived there twice in my life.

The OP should be hesitant about UT then, but OP should also be hesitant about Cornell. I also think the numbers used seem a bit off.

Here is my analysis:

UT Resident Tuition (no annual increase, flat-rate tuition structure): $33,162 + $33,162 + $33,162
...with scholarship: $26,162 + $26,162 + $26,162
COL (2% increase each year): $16,412 + $16,740 + $17,075
Total Borrowed: $128,713
Interest accumulates every day from disbursement (straight line, not compound, during school), so this number is likely about 22k (mental math, don't rely on this).
Total Owed at First Payment: ~$150k

Cornell Tuition (3% annual increase, was 3.9% this year though): $55,220 + $56,877 + $58,583
...with scholarship: $48,220 + $49,877 + $51,583
COL (2% increase each year): $19,460 + $19,849 + $20,246
Total: $209,235
Interest estimate (again, do it yourself) is 35k.
Total Owed at First Payment: ~$245k

That's a 95k difference, not 75k. Back of the envelope, this is $1100 difference per month (be sure to use the right weighted interest rate, which will be much higher at Cornell).

Is Cornell worth that much more? I really don't think so. Is UT a good option for you? Ehhh, doesn't seem like it. Hope these numbers help.




For what it's worth, Cornell matched my UT scholarship in 2008, though I ultimately ended up at Vandy.

abc12345675
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby abc12345675 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 9:53 am

Austin sucks and it's nothing like the rest of the state. "Keep Austin weird" is their slogan. Then again, living in the Village for undergrad, you'd probably feel right at home.

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T00L
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby T00L » Thu Jun 21, 2012 10:15 am

abc12345675 wrote:it's nothing like the rest of the state.


This is credited.

abc12345675 wrote:Austin sucks


This is not.

abc12345675
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Re: Cornell vs. Texas

Postby abc12345675 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 10:19 am

T00L wrote:
abc12345675 wrote:it's nothing like the rest of the state.


This is credited.

abc12345675 wrote:Austin sucks


This is not.


I was going to say something mean, but never mind. OP just make sure you like Austin is all I'm saying. Then again, make sure you like either Dallas or Houston, since this is where you'll most likely want to move for a job.




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