KU a good school?

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ANoor
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KU a good school?

Postby ANoor » Wed May 30, 2012 4:35 am

Is the university of Kansas a good school to go to? How much could someone expect to make after graduating? Assuming good ranking.

I know cost of living is low and tuition is one of the lowest. Definitely something to think about.

Thoughts?

GPA 3.3 LSAT 155 URM

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Easy-E
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby Easy-E » Wed May 30, 2012 8:54 am

ANoor wrote:Is the university of Kansas a good school to go to? How much could someone expect to make after graduating? Assuming good ranking.

I know cost of living is low and tuition is one of the lowest. Definitely something to think about.

Thoughts?

GPA 3.3 LSAT 155 URM



No ones gonna consider your question, retake the LSAT.

ineptimusprime
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby ineptimusprime » Wed May 30, 2012 9:10 am

Are you a resident? Did they offer you any money?

If you have one (preferably both) of those things going for you and you want to work in Kansas, I definitely think it's a fine choice.

Disclaimer: I'm attending KU in the fall.

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CincinnatusND
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby CincinnatusND » Wed May 30, 2012 9:52 am

You'll make enough for bottle service every night, that's for sure at least.

Also, it's fair to assume good ranking, especially with your incredible numbers, don't listen to people who say otherwise.

answer23
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby answer23 » Wed May 30, 2012 10:04 am

Only if you want to stay in Kansas afterwards. You should be competitive for some t30 schools depending on what type of URM. Retake the LSAT shoot for 165+ and enjoy the t14.

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JCFindley
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby JCFindley » Wed May 30, 2012 10:11 am

ineptimusprime wrote:Are you a resident? Did they offer you any money?

If you have one (preferably both) of those things going for you and you want to work in Kansas, I definitely think it's a fine choice.

Disclaimer: I'm attending KU in the fall.



Yupp, it is fine IF you are paying in state tuition and you are from KS and you definitely want to live in KS after you graduate and hopefully you get some money from them......

KU is king in the state but the legal market isn't very good in KS and the JD won't travel out of state. There is no big-law to speak of in the state so if you can attend without a huge amount of debt and will be perfectly happy working in the PD's office for 40K/yr in Garden City, or defending DUIs in Johnson County or Family Court Divorce Law in Wichita then sure.... (I know for a fact that my ex-wife's attorneys made a lot of money from me down in Wichita.....)

Nothing wrong with KU at all so long as it meets your end game goals and won't put you in debilitating debt.

JC

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TexasAggie13
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby TexasAggie13 » Wed May 30, 2012 10:14 am

--LinkRemoved--

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jenesaislaw
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby jenesaislaw » Wed May 30, 2012 10:31 am

--LinkRemoved--

A few things:

a) Don't assume good ranking. Consider what happens at different levels of ranking (say, top 5%, top 10%, top 33%, top half, bottom half). If you need to finish at the top of the class to get an outcome that meets your expectations and justifies the cost, then it's not a good idea to attend the school.
b) There were 168 grads in 2011 at KU. 92 reported a salary. The median was 50k, so we know that 27.4% of the class made that much. We know that 27.4% of the class did not make that much (half of that part made 42k, the other half less than 42k). We also know that 20.8% of the class were non-employed (with 1 or 2 of those having an unknown employment status). We don't know how much the other quarter of the class made, but things don't look good. http://law.ku.edu/careerservices/employmentstats/
c) 56.5% of the class had full-time legal jobs.
d) If you don't have a scholarship, and believe the cost of living estimates provided are reasonable for you, you will end up with ~120k of debt for when you begin repayment if you're in state and ~165k if you're out of state.
e) If you don't want to practice in Kansas or a neighboring state, don't go to KU.
f) If you're going to consider the school seriously, ask the school whether it funded jobs this year. For the class of 2010, they funded just .6% of the jobs. It's worth figuring out if the Kansas legal market was able to absorb these graduates or if the legal rate is bolstered by a new program that funds jobs for a short period of time.

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TexasAggie13
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby TexasAggie13 » Wed May 30, 2012 1:34 pm

jenesaislaw wrote:http://www.lawschooltransparency.com/clearinghouse/?school=kansas

A few things:

a) Don't assume good ranking. Consider what happens at different levels of ranking (say, top 5%, top 10%, top 33%, top half, bottom half). If you need to finish at the top of the class to get an outcome that meets your expectations and justifies the cost, then it's not a good idea to attend the school.
b) There were 168 grads in 2011 at KU. 92 reported a salary. The median was 50k, so we know that 27.4% of the class made that much. We know that 27.4% of the class did not make that much (half of that part made 42k, the other half less than 42k). We also know that 20.8% of the class were non-employed (with 1 or 2 of those having an unknown employment status). We don't know how much the other quarter of the class made, but things don't look good. http://law.ku.edu/careerservices/employmentstats/
c) 56.5% of the class had full-time legal jobs.
d) If you don't have a scholarship, and believe the cost of living estimates provided are reasonable for you, you will end up with ~120k of debt for when you begin repayment if you're in state and ~165k if you're out of state.
e) If you don't want to practice in Kansas or a neighboring state, don't go to KU.
f) If you're going to consider the school seriously, ask the school whether it funded jobs this year. For the class of 2010, they funded just .6% of the jobs. It's worth figuring out if the Kansas legal market was able to absorb these graduates or if the legal rate is bolstered by a new program that funds jobs for a short period of time.



Preach

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed May 30, 2012 9:23 pm

KU is a fine school but I wouldn't go into more than 60k or so debt and I would never consider going there if I wasn't 100% sold on working in Kansas.

rad lulz
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby rad lulz » Wed May 30, 2012 9:27 pm

Enjoy mottles n baubles

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Birdnals
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby Birdnals » Wed May 30, 2012 9:35 pm

The biggest market for you to work in is Kansas city, which will have you competing with Mizzou and UMKC law schools, on top of anybody who is coming back after school. After that you have Wichita.

So if you want to be one of the two lawyers in a small country town (which isn't a terrible life-style for the country loving folks) then go to kU. If not, reconsider retaking the LSAT

Disclaimer: I am a Mizzou grad, and would be perfectly happy if I found out my fellow alumni marched on Lawrence to burn that mother down...again. So take my advice knowing that.

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2014
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby 2014 » Thu May 31, 2012 2:26 am

JCFindley wrote:
ineptimusprime wrote:Are you a resident? Did they offer you any money?

If you have one (preferably both) of those things going for you and you want to work in Kansas, I definitely think it's a fine choice.

Disclaimer: I'm attending KU in the fall.



Yupp, it is fine IF you are paying in state tuition and you are from KS and you definitely want to live in KS after you graduate and hopefully you get some money from them......

KU is king in the state but the legal market isn't very good in KS and the JD won't travel out of state. There is no big-law to speak of in the state so if you can attend without a huge amount of debt and will be perfectly happy working in the PD's office for 40K/yr in Garden City, or defending DUIs in Johnson County or Family Court Divorce Law in Wichita then sure.... (I know for a fact that my ex-wife's attorneys made a lot of money from me down in Wichita.....)

Nothing wrong with KU at all so long as it meets your end game goals and won't put you in debilitating debt.

JC

I wouldn't even go so far as to say KU is king in the state. For whatever reason Washburn, the TTTT that it is, holds basically the same reputation in the state. As described above the market for a grad from either school is small firms and solo practice and there seems to be just as many random Washburn lawyers and judges in the state as KU ones.

And this is coming from someone whose whole family either attended or taught at KU so I would love to say it is absolutely king of the state, but I can't in good faith do so.

OP the advice of everyone is still good though, it is worth it if you are alright working in Kansas, are paying very little, and have no expectation of getting picked up by a large firm even if you end up at the top of the class.

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PDaddy
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby PDaddy » Thu May 31, 2012 4:06 am

A URM who writes good essays and has good softs can go to a top-30 (I see it on a regular basis), so why go to UK? Besides, I know a lawyer who went there and he's a prick...very hated in this city and with good reason. He's unscrupulous and has just barely escaped disbarment too many times to count. Do not go to UK. I know I am citing an "unrepresentative sample" here, but my first argument still stands.

Your numbers can get you into Illinois, William & Mary, Wisconsin, UNC, W & L, Emory, Fordham, Ohio State, Tulane, Indiana, UC-Davis, UC-Hastings, Maryland, Wake Forest, Houston, Miami, Florida, Alabama, and other schools that are much better than UK. If you had a tough major, then you're looking at schools near the top-20 and possibly #15-20.

I say apply to #15-50 and nothing below. You should also put in one or two T14 applications (Duke and Cornell), and maybe three top-20's (pick from GWU, UCI, WUSTL, and Minnesota), and see what happens.

3.3/155 is good enough to get you into the top-50 and better - and with significant money (up to 50% Tuition) believe it or not. There's still a dearth of qualified URM attorneys, so URM's coming out of those schools get good jobs as long as they stay in the top-1/2 to top-1/3 of their class - depending on the school and year.

I would also strongly consider going to Howard if I were you. It provides some of the best job prospects (as good as T14's in many cases), and your scholarship will likely be at least 70% of the $23K, given your LSAT score and GPA. Can you make the top-20% at Howard? It could mean biglaw and $135K or more. If you want to go back to Kansas after law school, I am sure Howard can hook you up with Dorothy and Toto at OCI. :wink:

ANoor
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby ANoor » Thu May 31, 2012 4:42 am

Thanks for all the info. KU is offering a $10k scholarship. Also waitlisted at Illinois, Wisconsin, Pepperdine, Miami, Santa Clara, UOP, Marquette, Southwestern, Samford, Chapman and Nevada (UNLV)

JohnDorian
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby JohnDorian » Thu May 31, 2012 5:17 am

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Last edited by JohnDorian on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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flem
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby flem » Thu May 31, 2012 8:27 am

rad lulz wrote:Enjoy mottles n baubles


I'm greatly enjoying this schtick brah

TMC116
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby TMC116 » Thu May 31, 2012 2:46 pm

PDaddy wrote:A URM who writes good essays and has good softs can go to a top-30 (I see it on a regular basis), so why go to UK? Besides, I know a lawyer who went there and he's a prick...very hated in this city and with good reason. He's unscrupulous and has just barely escaped disbarment too many times to count. Do not go to UK. I know I am citing an "unrepresentative sample" here, but my first argument still stands.

Your numbers can get you into Illinois, William & Mary, Wisconsin, UNC, W & L, Emory, Fordham, Ohio State, Tulane, Indiana, UC-Davis, UC-Hastings, Maryland, Wake Forest, Houston, Miami, Florida, Alabama, and other schools that are much better than UK. If you had a tough major, then you're looking at schools near the top-20 and possibly #15-20.

I say apply to #15-50 and nothing below. You should also put in one or two T14 applications (Duke and Cornell), and maybe three top-20's (pick from GWU, UCI, WUSTL, and Minnesota), and see what happens.

3.3/155 is good enough to get you into the top-50 and better - and with significant money (up to 50% Tuition) believe it or not. There's still a dearth of qualified URM attorneys, so URM's coming out of those schools get good jobs as long as they stay in the top-1/2 to top-1/3 of their class - depending on the school and year.

I would also strongly consider going to Howard if I were you. It provides some of the best job prospects (as good as T14's in many cases), and your scholarship will likely be at least 70% of the $23K, given your LSAT score and GPA. Can you make the top-20% at Howard? It could mean biglaw and $135K or more. If you want to go back to Kansas after law school, I am sure Howard can hook you up with Dorothy and Toto at OCI. :wink:



I think this is very, very optimistic. Duke and Cornell are unquestionably out of reach. Period.

That said, send in LOCIs. You can get off a waitlist or two in this cycle (and probably get money)

Go to school w/ a solid rep in the immediate area you want to work. Good luck!

EDIT: I agree that Howard is a solid option. They have pretty good placement as far as I know, certainly not T14 good, but very respectable for Tier 3. Its low tuition also makes it an attractive choice

answer23
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby answer23 » Thu May 31, 2012 3:49 pm

Do not listen to any advice that says howard is a good choice. I’ll suggest you (cross)post your question at the urm sub-forum. Some of the people itt to not have your best interest at heart. You should be able to tell that from the sarcastic subtle racist post about bottle service from rad lulz, CincinnatusND and flem. Pray that you get off the waitlist at UIUC. If not you should definitely retake and shoot for a higher score. Apply early and blanket the t-30 minus the Bostons, UW and the California publics. Assume that you will be median at whatever school you go to. A median urm at a t-30 school is better off than a median at Howard.

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JCFindley
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Re: KU a good school?

Postby JCFindley » Thu May 31, 2012 4:59 pm

2014 wrote:
JCFindley wrote:
ineptimusprime wrote:Are you a resident? Did they offer you any money?

If you have one (preferably both) of those things going for you and you want to work in Kansas, I definitely think it's a fine choice.

Disclaimer: I'm attending KU in the fall.



Yupp, it is fine IF you are paying in state tuition and you are from KS and you definitely want to live in KS after you graduate and hopefully you get some money from them......

KU is king in the state but the legal market isn't very good in KS and the JD won't travel out of state. There is no big-law to speak of in the state so if you can attend without a huge amount of debt and will be perfectly happy working in the PD's office for 40K/yr in Garden City, or defending DUIs in Johnson County or Family Court Divorce Law in Wichita then sure.... (I know for a fact that my ex-wife's attorneys made a lot of money from me down in Wichita.....)

Nothing wrong with KU at all so long as it meets your end game goals and won't put you in debilitating debt.

JC

I wouldn't even go so far as to say KU is king in the state. For whatever reason Washburn, the TTTT that it is, holds basically the same reputation in the state. As described above the market for a grad from either school is small firms and solo practice and there seems to be just as many random Washburn lawyers and judges in the state as KU ones.

And this is coming from someone whose whole family either attended or taught at KU so I would love to say it is absolutely king of the state, but I can't in good faith do so.

OP the advice of everyone is still good though, it is worth it if you are alright working in Kansas, are paying very little, and have no expectation of getting picked up by a large firm even if you end up at the top of the class.


Yeah, you are right and Washburn is one of those TTTT's that actually could be worth attending if you in fact want to work in Topeka.... (Or elsewhere in the state....)

I retired from the KS Air Guard and have very strong ties to the state but didn't even try KU because it basically limits you to the state of KS and maybe the KC area of MO. (Not entirely but for the most part....)




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