Pepperdine vs. Loyola

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locthebloke
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby locthebloke » Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:37 am

GueritaPeloChino wrote: Is this the wise thing to do or am i somehow better off trying to ask for more money?


You are better off NOT GOING TO LAW SCHOOL.

OP, I hate to be inflammatory, but are either of these schools a *TOP 8* SCHOOL? NO. Do NOT go to law school if it is not a top 8 school or you have if you do not have friends/family/connections in the field who can secure a job for you upon graduation. I'm speaking as a former prospective law student who very recently became truly educated as to the nature of this scummy industry (I always knew it was bad out there, but was unaware of how bad it actually is).

Law schools use tricky and misleading employment and salary statistics to ensnare prospective students. Law professors make 6 figure salaries. How do they sleep at night knowing this and going into teach everyday facing countless students who will, in turn, be crippled with that many figures in non-dischargable debt and no job prospects.

The ABA are swine. They accredit these crapholes without requiring them to submit an independent audit of salary and employment figures. Have any of you thought about how truly, completely absurd it is to charge someone 45,000k for one year of legal "education"?? This madness HAS to stop. It must be fought. It starts by getting naive people like the OP from going to law school en masse and continuing to give these pigs sick amounts of money.

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SaintsTheMetal
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby SaintsTheMetal » Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:21 am

locthebloke wrote:
GueritaPeloChino wrote:
OP, I hate to be inflammatory, but are either of these schools a *TOP 8* SCHOOL? NO. Do NOT go to law school if it is not a top 8 school...


wtf is a top 8 school?

OP Pepperdine is definitely your best choice if you must go next semester. Otherwise just applying early in Sept/Oct, or even retaking will likely get you more scholarship money next year, although probably in at the same schools regardless what GPA you get being in Cali with a bad gpa.. this assuming you will not leave cali

Personally, I would tell Pepperdine that Loyola offered you 22k or something and try to get them to go to 22k. Try your absolute hardest to get the most $$$ you can, and then decide whether you are prepared to pay that amount. Going to Pepperdine at 1/2 tuition and no living expenses would not be a bad deal.

forty-two
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby forty-two » Mon Jun 04, 2012 6:43 am

SaintsTheMetal wrote:
Personally, I would tell Pepperdine that Loyola offered you 22k or something and try to get them to go to 22k. Try your absolute hardest to get the most $$$ you can, and then decide whether you are prepared to pay that amount. Going to Pepperdine at 1/2 tuition and no living expenses would not be a bad deal.


OP, please don't lie about scholarships from other schools. It's a terrible idea and schools can definitely check on these things.

Also, what's the stipulation on keeping your scholarship after the first year?

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flem
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby flem » Mon Jun 04, 2012 8:20 am

locthebloke wrote:
GueritaPeloChino wrote: Is this the wise thing to do or am i somehow better off trying to ask for more money?


You are better off NOT GOING TO LAW SCHOOL.

OP, I hate to be inflammatory, but are either of these schools a *TOP 8* SCHOOL? NO. Do NOT go to law school if it is not a top 8 school or you have if you do not have friends/family/connections in the field who can secure a job for you upon graduation. I'm speaking as a former prospective law student who very recently became truly educated as to the nature of this scummy industry (I always knew it was bad out there, but was unaware of how bad it actually is).

Law schools use tricky and misleading employment and salary statistics to ensnare prospective students. Law professors make 6 figure salaries. How do they sleep at night knowing this and going into teach everyday facing countless students who will, in turn, be crippled with that many figures in non-dischargable debt and no job prospects.

The ABA are swine. They accredit these crapholes without requiring them to submit an independent audit of salary and employment figures. Have any of you thought about how truly, completely absurd it is to charge someone 45,000k for one year of legal "education"?? This madness HAS to stop. It must be fought. It starts by getting naive people like the OP from going to law school en masse and continuing to give these pigs sick amounts of money.


Sup Nando

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rickgrimes69
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby rickgrimes69 » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:31 pm

forty-two wrote:
SaintsTheMetal wrote:
Personally, I would tell Pepperdine that Loyola offered you 22k or something and try to get them to go to 22k. Try your absolute hardest to get the most $$$ you can, and then decide whether you are prepared to pay that amount. Going to Pepperdine at 1/2 tuition and no living expenses would not be a bad deal.


OP, please don't lie about scholarships from other schools. It's a terrible idea and schools can definitely check on these things.



Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.

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top30man
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby top30man » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:16 pm

rickgrimes69 wrote:
forty-two wrote:
SaintsTheMetal wrote:
Personally, I would tell Pepperdine that Loyola offered you 22k or something and try to get them to go to 22k. Try your absolute hardest to get the most $$$ you can, and then decide whether you are prepared to pay that amount. Going to Pepperdine at 1/2 tuition and no living expenses would not be a bad deal.


OP, please don't lie about scholarships from other schools. It's a terrible idea and schools can definitely check on these things.



Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.

Yeah this is terrible advice. Never lie about something like that. Also, retake.

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SaintsTheMetal
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby SaintsTheMetal » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:47 pm

rickgrimes69 wrote:Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.


LOL unethical?? It's called negotiating.

Are you going to go into a car dealership and not try to talk them down? No - you're going to tell them you think you can get this new F150 from the dealership across the street for $2k less. Amazing how sheltered some people on this board are.

If the scholarship is not big enough to attend without a larger scholarship, you have nothing to lose by trying to talk them down on the price more. I've been around on this board a while and I've never heard of them requiring you to fax over a copy of your scholarship info lol..if you're that worried about it go tell the Dean in person so you put him on the spot. unless you have a shitty poker face
Last edited by SaintsTheMetal on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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flem
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby flem » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:49 pm

SaintsTheMetal wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.


LOL unethical?? It's called negotiating.

Are you going to go into a car dealership and not try to talk them down? No - you're going to tell them you think you can get this new F150 from the dealership across the street for $2k less. Amazing how sheltered some people on this board are


Image

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basilseal
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby basilseal » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:10 pm

New scholarship negotiation tactics and the T8! One learns new things every day.

005618502
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby 005618502 » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:20 pm

Does anyone remember where to find the link to the kid who got into Michigan and lied about Schollies from other schools and not only lost admission but ended up at a much lesser school?

OP, never lie about money. Only tell true info, its not worth 20K to lose all acceptances and never have a chance at those schools again.

To the dude who said we are to "sheltered" you are an idiot. and wtf is a top 8 school?

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flem
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby flem » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:21 pm

AssumptionRequired wrote:To the dude who said we are to "sheltered" you are an idiot. and wtf is a top 8 school?


Please see:

http://www.thirdtierrealityDOTblogspotDOTcom

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rickgrimes69
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby rickgrimes69 » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:38 pm

SaintsTheMetal wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.


LOL unethical?? It's called negotiating being a lying little shit.


FTFY

Are you going to go into a car dealership and not try to talk them down? No - you're going to tell them you think you can get this new F150 from the dealership across the street for $2k less. Amazing how sheltered some people on this board are.


There's a difference between bluffing and saying "lower your price to X or I'll buy Y" and "you should lower your price to X because Y offered me this." The first is negotiating, the second, if untrue, is fraud.

If the scholarship is not big enough to attend without a larger scholarship, you have nothing to lose by trying to talk them down on the price more. I've been around on this board a while and I've never heard of them requiring you to fax over a copy of your scholarship info lol..if you're that worried about it go tell the Dean in person so you put him on the spot. unless you have a shitty poker face


Every single school I negotiated with asked me for proof. Every one. And I negotiated with every school I was interested in (lower T14s to T20).

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splitsplat
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby splitsplat » Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:21 pm

Although I am on your side that lying about offers is retarded. I negotiated with several schools and was never asked to provide proof of offers so I don't think your experience was typical.

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SaintsTheMetal
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby SaintsTheMetal » Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:03 pm

If you won't be attending anyways, what do you have to lose? You're not going to get charged with fraud for bluffing about other schools' scholarships :roll: Hey no skin off my back though

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twenty
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby twenty » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:06 pm

There was a guy on TLS who tried "negotiating" that way. He ended up on Michigan's F-you blog, LSAC's blacklist, and last I checked, he was desperately trying to get into GULC/Cornell (after throwing away 105k at Michigan because of that little stunt.)

There are two really, really bad ideas when it comes to law school admissions. Not reporting all (i.e, your 2.5 you had at CC that didn't actually transfer over to your four-year) your transcripts, and lying about scholarship money. Both are so very easily verifiable, and both will get you in tons and tons of trouble.

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padawanphil
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby padawanphil » Tue Jun 05, 2012 1:09 pm

SaintsTheMetal wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.

If the scholarship is not big enough to attend without a larger scholarship, you have nothing to lose by trying to talk them down on the price more. I've been around on this board a while and I've never heard of them requiring you to fax over a copy of your scholarship info lol..if you're that worried about it go tell the Dean in person so you put him on the spot. unless you have a shitty poker face

Looks at join date...





GTFO

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JDizzle2015
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby JDizzle2015 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 1:48 pm

SaintsTheMetal wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Agreed. Besides the fact that it's unethical, the first thing they'll do is ask for a letter proving it.


LOL unethical?? It's called negotiating.

Are you going to go into a car dealership and not try to talk them down? No - you're going to tell them you think you can get this new F150 from the dealership across the street for $2k less. Amazing how sheltered some people on this board are.

Like rickgrimes said, there's a difference between direct misrepresention and negotiating.

Even ignoring the blatant ethical issues, you need to understand that the law school (and the general legal) community is tiny and admissions officers weren't born yesterday. Especially when it comes to local regional schools like Pepp and Loyola, I can guarantee you those offices communicate fairly regularly. Lying about scholarship offers comes with the real possibility of disqualifying yourself from law school. I apologize for preaching, but if your character is so easily shaken you should really think carefully before pursuing a profession where one unethical mistake can jeopardize decades of work, hundreds of thousands of dollars or more, and the many interests of your future clients.

AssumptionRequired, this is the link: http://www.law.umich.edu/connection/a2z ... aspx?ID=17

IIRC, the student Dean Z wrote about even started a thread on TLS this last cycle asking for advice after putting his/her life on hold for years to try to go back to law school.

Do not lie about scholarship offers.

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diegoforlan10
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby diegoforlan10 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 2:26 pm

Thanks for the link. I would LOVE to see what happened to him after that!

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JDizzle2015
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby JDizzle2015 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:04 pm

diegoforlan10 wrote:Thanks for the link. I would LOVE to see what happened to him after that!

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=172157

This is the poster from earlier this cycle that may have been the same person Dean Z blogged about.

This was his response to the whole ordeal:
humbled2010 wrote:Thank you all for your posts, it has been eye opening to see what I will face as I begin my future career.

All I can do is show through my future actions that one bad act will not define who I am as a person, and yes, I assume the article by Dean Z is about me, while I have never conversed with her about it or made aware of its existence in any official capacity, it sure sounds like it was about me.

Just please, everyone reading this, take away one learning point, your integrity is all you have as a young man/woman, and it can be lost in one second, and it takes a lot more to recapture it than it took to lose it. It is easy to kick someone when they are down on a public message board, but the people who have sent me private messages of support... Know your words mean more than you can imagine.

As an update I was wait listed at Michigan, I am still deciding whether or not to place myself on the list, I think it might be best for me to start completely fresh at another school without my past actions hanging over my head, but that is a decision I will make myself. I do plan on contacting the Bar association of the state my law school is in as soon as I make a choice to inform them of what I did and while I am sure I will face questions, I am more sure of my ability to prove that I am a changed person to that aforementioned Bar association.

Again, do not lie -- especially when it comes to law school scholarship negotiation.

GueritaPeloChino
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Re: Pepperdine vs. Loyola

Postby GueritaPeloChino » Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:35 pm

The scholarship stipulation for Pepperdine is "good academic standing".

Does anyone have any advice on how to negotiate more money by using an offer of admission to a higher ranked school as leverage?




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