What's the skinny on BYU?

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 8:12 pm

wsj74 wrote:
Map Cat wrote:
wsj74 wrote:OP: Go to the U ... you're a 30 min drive from seven world-class ski resorts, 15 min from the airport and plus, Salt Lake City is great. I think when people from the east coast think of Denver, what they really have is Salt Lake in mind. All of this & not to mention the diversity that has come in since the Olympics.

And to the guy who loves Logan and hates everything south of Kaysville ... do you fuck sheep, or something?


Yeah, I love SLC too. But BYU is so cheap and ranked sky high. Plus, the network...


Sure, and maybe I am biased since I was raised in SLC and went to UG @ the U. So, I have always considered Provo the cesspool of the world. But if you can handle it for 3 years, by all means.

Sort of tangentially related, if you're interviewing at firms in the Salt Lake market be prepared for questions like "How did you finish UG so quickly?" or "Do you speak any foreign languages?" All thinly-veiled ways of asking if you served an LDS mission, or if you're a member of the church. Of course, you may not be exposed to this since you're a female, but just a heads up.


Ooh, that's really valuable info re: interviewing. Thanks very much!

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MormonChristian
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby MormonChristian » Thu May 17, 2012 8:43 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:BYU is the greatest if you are mormon,


False.

It is the greatest if you naturally share similar values. Deeply religious people and people whose priorities are families love it. In fact there are at least two faculty who are not Mormon who embrace the culture because they don't have generally worry about their children with drugs, pornography or sexual deviancy.

There is also no political correctness but there are problems that arise from no political correctness.

Bottom line is that if you are heavily devoted to family and service you will be able to look over any quirks, if not the many quirks will probably irk you bad.

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annet
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby annet » Thu May 17, 2012 9:53 pm

southwick wrote:A clarification on tuition: ineptimusprime is right that non-Mormon students don't get the full benefit of low tuition, but even the non-Mormon rate is $21,900 a year--less than half of most comparable schools.


I had no idea BYU was that cheap. I'm teetotal and could probably swear off the menfolk for 3 years. But my need for tea and my atheism might be an issue... I do have nuns who would vouch for me, though not in a "she loves Jesus" kind of way.

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MormonChristian
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby MormonChristian » Thu May 17, 2012 10:29 pm

annet wrote: But my need for tea and my atheism might be an issue..


Atheism really won't be a problem. I knew many atheists at BYU.

If you have an appreciation for another culture and/or country, you'll have a lot to talk about with others. Most of the Mormon Christians lived in another country for two years or so.

Can you drink herbal teas instead of green and black teas?

Also, call the admissions office and ask about drinking tea (I wouldn't give them your name). I am pretty sure they won't kick you out for drinking tea at home. Actually, I am going to call them and ask myself since I am curious.

You can also call and ask some of the non-LDS faculty about your circumstances.

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BearState
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby BearState » Fri May 18, 2012 9:30 am

2014 wrote:Given the prevalence of mormon missions interrupting UG, I imagine that BYU actually has one of the older law school student bodies.


Super true. From what I understand, a lot of LDS women attend BYU for the sole purpose of finding a husband amongst the older males who return from two year missions. Average age for BYU Law is 26, I think that's older than most other schools.

http://www.law2.byu.edu/page/categories ... le2011.pdf

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2014
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby 2014 » Fri May 18, 2012 2:31 pm

BearState wrote:
2014 wrote:Given the prevalence of mormon missions interrupting UG, I imagine that BYU actually has one of the older law school student bodies.


Super true. From what I understand, a lot of LDS women attend BYU for the sole purpose of finding a husband amongst the older males who return from two year missions. Average age for BYU Law is 26, I think that's older than most other schools.

http://www.law2.byu.edu/page/categories ... le2011.pdf


Most schools are 23-24 with the exception of Northwestern I believe.

jms1987
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby jms1987 » Fri May 18, 2012 4:13 pm

How would a non-Mormon Christian be accepted at BYU? I'm pretty conservative and already don't drink much, so the culture change would not be dramatic for me. (although I would miss coffee)

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BearState
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby BearState » Fri May 18, 2012 4:17 pm

You'd be welcomed, I'd bet. As long as you are in good standing with any church and will live by the honor code. I think the LDS church is eager to gain mainstream (or at least evangelical) acceptance.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Fri May 18, 2012 6:16 pm

BearState wrote:You'd be welcomed, I'd bet. As long as you are in good standing with any church and will live by the honor code. I think the LDS church is eager to gain mainstream (or at least evangelical) acceptance.


I think it is less a PR move, and I don't think the LDS church cares about Evangelical acceptance, or they wouldn't be sending 50K of missionaries out yearly teaching that some evangelical doctrines are wrong.

Atheist students arevwelcome as well-- there are a lot of Chinese and Euro students at BYU.

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MormonChristian
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby MormonChristian » Fri May 18, 2012 6:42 pm

TaipeiMort wrote: or they wouldn't be sending 50K of missionaries out yearly teaching that some evangelical doctrines are wrong.


Mormon Christians missionaries are never taught any evangelical doctrines.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Sat May 19, 2012 12:55 pm

MormonChristian wrote:
TaipeiMort wrote: or they wouldn't be sending 50K of missionaries out yearly teaching that some evangelical doctrines are wrong.


Mormon Christians missionaries are never taught any evangelical doctrines.


Dude you need to stop being a creeper on these boards. You are clearly looking to pick a fight with your username and posts, and your attitude has a self-righteous flavor to it (eg. I'll check and see if you can drink tea and attend BYU).

Mormon missionaries do teach that evangelical doctrines are incorrect (read: Mormon teaching on apostasy).

Your posts may reinforce your belief in the bulletproofness of your religion, but they will do nothing to win over people who are currently not fans.

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MormonChristian
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby MormonChristian » Sat May 19, 2012 1:57 pm

TaipeiMort wrote:
MormonChristian wrote:
TaipeiMort wrote: or they wouldn't be sending 50K of missionaries out yearly teaching that some evangelical doctrines are wrong.


Mormon Christians missionaries are never taught any evangelical doctrines.


Dude you need to stop being a creeper on these boards. You are clearly looking to pick a fight with your username and posts, and your attitude has a self-righteous flavor to it (eg. I'll check and see if you can drink tea and attend BYU).

Mormon missionaries do teach that evangelical doctrines are incorrect (read: Mormon teaching on apostasy).

Your posts may reinforce your belief in the bulletproofness of your religion, but they will do nothing to win over people who are currently not fans.


What I say comes from first hand knowledge. Please leave answering the questions to people who have first hand knowledge. If we need internet rumors, I am sure you can be at the top of the list for answering.

I am sorry you can only say negative things.

I am not sure how verifying information is self-righteous flavor unless you are simply trying to flame me.

If so, please flame off.

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El_Gallo
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby El_Gallo » Sat May 19, 2012 2:23 pm

MormonChristian wrote:
TaipeiMort wrote:
MormonChristian wrote:
TaipeiMort wrote: or they wouldn't be sending 50K of missionaries out yearly teaching that some evangelical doctrines are wrong.


Mormon Christians missionaries are never taught any evangelical doctrines.


Dude you need to stop being a creeper on these boards. You are clearly looking to pick a fight with your username and posts, and your attitude has a self-righteous flavor to it (eg. I'll check and see if you can drink tea and attend BYU).

Mormon missionaries do teach that evangelical doctrines are incorrect (read: Mormon teaching on apostasy).

Your posts may reinforce your belief in the bulletproofness of your religion, but they will do nothing to win over people who are currently not fans.


What I say comes from first hand knowledge. Please leave answering the questions to people who have first hand knowledge. If we need internet rumors, I am sure you can be at the top of the list for answering.

I am sorry you can only say negative things.

I am not sure how verifying information is self-righteous flavor unless you are simply trying to flame me.

If so, please flame off.


Pretty sure TaipeiMort is Mormon. Also, doesn't Preach My Gospel have a section on the doctrine of other religions?

crit_racer
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby crit_racer » Sat May 19, 2012 2:55 pm

don't go to BYU if youre not mormon. Law school is stressful. Having to worry about getting thrown out b/c you needed to come home and have a beer or two or wanted to get down w/ your SO or have a cup of coffee before class sounds like hell.

Also, I'm skeptical that you could really cash in on the LDS network w/o being mormon, but maybe I'm wrong (as MormonChristian said).

Just go to CU or Utah or even DU.

Good luck

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MormonChristian
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby MormonChristian » Sat May 19, 2012 2:57 pm

El_Gallo wrote: Also, doesn't Preach My Gospel have a section on the doctrine of other religions?


The topic is Evangelical doctrine and no Preach My Gospel doesn't teach any Evangelical doctrine. Please check for yourself.

http://www.lds.org/library/display/0,49 ... -1,00.html

I couldn't even find the word Evangelical in the book.


It does however praise the Protestant religions and specifically the Protestant Reformations for their desires for an increase in religious freedom.

It also says some religions believe things we believe are false and that some religious teachers were bad people or taught false things, but if offers no specifics and no "Evangelical doctrine" is taught.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby JamMasterJ » Sat May 19, 2012 3:09 pm

It seemed like this got missed the first time, and I didn't read page two or three, but:

YOU DO NOT GET THE TUITION CUT IF YOU'RE NOT A MORMON

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Sat May 19, 2012 7:26 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:It seemed like this got missed the first time, and I didn't read page two or three, but:

YOU DO NOT GET THE TUITION CUT IF YOU'RE NOT A MORMON


No, it didn't get missed. I didn't say anything about a "tuition cut". The regular tuition is outrageously low for non-Mormons, and discounted further for Mormons. From the BYU Law website:

Tuition
LDS $10,950/year ($5,475/semester)
Non-LDS $21,900/year ($10,950/semester)


So when I said the low tuition made me curious, I was referring to the non-Mormon rate.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Sat May 19, 2012 8:46 pm

Map Cat wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:It seemed like this got missed the first time, and I didn't read page two or three, but:

YOU DO NOT GET THE TUITION CUT IF YOU'RE NOT A MORMON


No, it didn't get missed. I didn't say anything about a "tuition cut". The regular tuition is outrageously low for non-Mormons, and discounted further for Mormons. From the BYU Law website:

Tuition
LDS $10,950/year ($5,475/semester)
Non-LDS $21,900/year ($10,950/semester)


So when I said the low tuition made me curious, I was referring to the non-Mormon rate.


All tuition is low at BYU because member donations have paid for much of the facilities and prof salaries. Profs also take pay cuts far below median salary to live and work at BYU (60-70% of market). BYU is not-for-profit, so they won't be pocketing non-Mormon cash.

Overall, BYU is a pretty good option if you are choosing between peers, but Utah instate or DU large scholarship are awesome too.

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skers
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby skers » Sat May 19, 2012 8:48 pm

Taipei served a mission. I did as well. We were taught some evangelical doctrines.

Even without the Mormon discount, tuition/Utah are cheap.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Sat May 19, 2012 10:29 pm

EdgarWinter wrote:I wouldn't go to BYU if they paid me $100k a year. Not being associated with a bigoted and evil force in society is too important to me.


Flame?

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fanmingrui
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby fanmingrui » Sat May 19, 2012 11:11 pm

EdgarWinter wrote:I wouldn't go to BYU if they paid me $100k a year. Not being associated with a bigoted and evil force in society is too important to me.

Stay classy, bud.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Sun May 20, 2012 2:31 am

fanmingrui wrote:
EdgarWinter wrote:I wouldn't go to BYU if they paid me $100k a year. Not being associated with a bigoted and evil force in society is too important to me.

Stay classy, bud.


Pathetic thing is that the mods don't care.

If I posted that I wouldn't attend Yeshiva because "Jews are an evil, greedy force to destroy the modern world," I probably would be banned.

Attack all Mormons, white, black, gay, straight, with some innacurate screed, no problem.

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Corsair
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Corsair » Sun May 20, 2012 3:05 am

..

Badidea
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Badidea » Sun May 20, 2012 4:00 am

Ex-mormon BYU (UG) grad here, born and raised in Utah. I would strongly recommend not attending BYU law if you are anything other than a believing Mormon. BYU's primary employment advantage is the LDS "old boys club," to which you will not have access. The school doesn't feed into a major market, and grads depend on the Mormon network to get them jobs across the country. Without it, you'll be left competing for jobs with only the school's rank, which, while not bad, isn't all that great either. Other downsides off the top of my head:

The student body at BYU law is known as one of the most competitive (if not the most competitive) in the country. Classes will be mostly filled with older married men whose children will starve if they don't get a job.

Setting aside the Honor Code (which they take very seriously), don't underestimate the culture shock. BYU and Provo can be unpleasant for liberal/less-orthodox Mormons, let alone someone like you. On top of the joy of just living there, you'll get to enjoy fending off missionary efforts for the duration of your stay.

Consider the social/networking consequences of being an outsider. While you surely won't be shunned, you likely won't enjoy the kind of camaraderie you might find at other, less homogeneous/insular schools.

Why associate yourself with an organization that has alienated people who might be reading your resume? Would being a BYU grad bump you to the bottom of the resume pile on a gay hiring partner's desk? This is obviously hard to quantify, but why take the risk?

Then again, the mountains are gorgeous and the skiing is fantastic.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Sun May 20, 2012 12:06 pm

Above is right on.

Do not go to BYU if you are not a morman. /thread




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