What's the skinny on BYU?

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Map Cat
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What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 12:45 pm

Just wondering how crazy it is for non-LDS to consider it? The location (want to live in the CO/UT area 5ever), the price, and the ranking make me curious. I'm not religious, but I'll gladly bow my head at graduation to have <$100K in debt. Can anyone with experience/knowledge of the school give me a little info? Would me and my "dirty mouth" be too far out of our element?

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laxbrah420
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby laxbrah420 » Thu May 17, 2012 12:48 pm

I don't know, but it didnt work well for Brandon Davies

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 12:56 pm

I didn't know who that was. Googled. This was in the first article:

BYU's honor code also requires students to be honest; abstain from alcoholic beverages, tobacco, tea, coffee and substance abuse; and attend church regularly.



:shock: ... was blind, but now I see...

gravityrides0
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby gravityrides0 » Thu May 17, 2012 1:46 pm

Map Cat wrote:I didn't know who that was. Googled. This was in the first article:

BYU's honor code also requires students to be honest; abstain from alcoholic beverages, tobacco, tea, coffee and substance abuse; and attend church regularly.



:shock: ... was blind, but now I see...


OH FUCK NO.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Thu May 17, 2012 1:48 pm

Going to a law school where caffeine is banned seems baffling. You think people take hits off 5-hour energies in the library's bathroom stalls during finals time for that extra leg-up?

gravityrides0
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby gravityrides0 » Thu May 17, 2012 1:50 pm

no caffeine at BYU ----> adderall prescription

gravityrides0
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby gravityrides0 » Thu May 17, 2012 1:50 pm

regular church attendance at BYU ----> suicide

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lisjjen
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby lisjjen » Thu May 17, 2012 2:00 pm

If you like that area, have you considered the University of Utah or Colorado Boulder? I grew up in the Mountain West so I definitely love the area as well.

Mormons are extremely nice people, but the whole no caffeine thing would drive me crazy and I don't even drink coffee very much. I have met a few lawyers from BYU and Idaho even has a congressman who went to law school there. Have you visited at all?

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El_Gallo
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby El_Gallo » Thu May 17, 2012 2:07 pm

I went to BYU for UG. You are allowed to drink caffine, just no coffee specifically. I'm not sure what the rules are on those little 5 hour energy bottles.

BYU has slightly better placement power than its ranking would suggest. However, I think this is mostly due to the "Mormon Mafia." If you are not LDS, you will miss out on that very large advantage of BYU.

That said, it is one of the few reasonably priced schools in the T1. If you are looking to practice in the Rocky Moutain West and can endure 3 years of the honor code, it might be worth it.

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SilverE2
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby SilverE2 » Thu May 17, 2012 2:23 pm

El_Gallo wrote:I went to BYU for UG. You are allowed to drink caffine, just no coffee specifically. I'm not sure what the rules are on those little 5 hour energy bottles.

BYU has slightly better placement power than its ranking would suggest. However, I think this is mostly due to the "Mormon Mafia." If you are not LDS, you will miss out on that very large advantage of BYU.

That said, it is one of the few reasonably priced schools in the T1. If you are looking to practice in the Rocky Moutain West and can endure 3 years of the honor code, it might be worth it.


Wait wtf. Why no to coffee but yes to caffeine? So I assume a red bull would be allowed, but decaffeinated coffee would not?

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 2:31 pm

lisjjen wrote:If you like that area, have you considered the University of Utah or Colorado Boulder? I grew up in the Mountain West so I definitely love the area as well.

Mormons are extremely nice people, but the whole no caffeine thing would drive me crazy and I don't even drink coffee very much. I have met a few lawyers from BYU and Idaho even has a congressman who went to law school there. Have you visited at all?


CU-Boulder is my top choice for the location. Also considering Utah and DU. I even thought about Wyoming, just to give you an idea of how badly I want the Mountain West.

I haven't visited, I was just curious if it was an actual religious school or just a school with an affiliation (like Tulane). I don't know if I could handle no alcohol for three years, though.

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 2:38 pm

El_Gallo wrote:I went to BYU for UG. You are allowed to drink caffine, just no coffee specifically. I'm not sure what the rules are on those little 5 hour energy bottles.

BYU has slightly better placement power than its ranking would suggest. However, I think this is mostly due to the "Mormon Mafia." If you are not LDS, you will miss out on that very large advantage of BYU.

That said, it is one of the few reasonably priced schools in the T1. If you are looking to practice in the Rocky Moutain West and can endure 3 years of the honor code, it might be worth it.


How strict is the honor code? I'd be living with my boyfriend and I know the honor code says no happy fun time pre-marriage. If someone finds out, are they going to report me or something?

I'm okay with not chugging Monsters or letting my tits hang out on campus, I just don't want the honor code to follow me home at the end of the day.

JasonR
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby JasonR » Thu May 17, 2012 2:51 pm

Map Cat wrote:
El_Gallo wrote:I went to BYU for UG. You are allowed to drink caffine, just no coffee specifically. I'm not sure what the rules are on those little 5 hour energy bottles.

BYU has slightly better placement power than its ranking would suggest. However, I think this is mostly due to the "Mormon Mafia." If you are not LDS, you will miss out on that very large advantage of BYU.

That said, it is one of the few reasonably priced schools in the T1. If you are looking to practice in the Rocky Moutain West and can endure 3 years of the honor code, it might be worth it.


How strict is the honor code? I'd be living with my boyfriend and I know the honor code says no happy fun time pre-marriage. If someone finds out, are they going to report me or something?

I'm okay with not chugging Monsters or letting my tits hang out on campus, I just don't want the honor code to follow me home at the end of the day.


I don't think they're only intending to cover on-campus sex. I'm pretty sure your living situation would be a problem if the wrong people found out. It would be pretty tough to keep that a secret for three years, too. Remember that at least a few of your classmates at any law school are going to be sociopaths.

ineptimusprime
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby ineptimusprime » Thu May 17, 2012 2:55 pm

Haha, living in Utah would be absolute hell for someone who isn't Mormon.

Hell, Utah is hell for me and I AM Mormon. The only place in Utah that doesn't make me want to slit my wrists is Logan (where I currently live).

Oh, and to the live-in boyfriend thing, see the Brandon Davies example of what happens if you get caught. Do you like that your academic future is in jeopardy if you get caught?

Plus, the non-LDS don't benefit from the ridiculously cheap tuition.

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El_Gallo
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby El_Gallo » Thu May 17, 2012 2:58 pm

SilverE2 wrote:
El_Gallo wrote:I went to BYU for UG. You are allowed to drink caffine, just no coffee specifically. I'm not sure what the rules are on those little 5 hour energy bottles.

BYU has slightly better placement power than its ranking would suggest. However, I think this is mostly due to the "Mormon Mafia." If you are not LDS, you will miss out on that very large advantage of BYU.

That said, it is one of the few reasonably priced schools in the T1. If you are looking to practice in the Rocky Moutain West and can endure 3 years of the honor code, it might be worth it.


Wait wtf. Why no to coffee but yes to caffeine? So I assume a red bull would be allowed, but decaffeinated coffee would not?


Since the founding or Mormonism, the rule has been that you can't drink coffee. The reason for that is probably the large amount of caffeine. That is why a lot of LDS folk don't drink red bull or coke. However, the official rule only prohibits alcohol, coffee, and certain types of tea.

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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby ineptimusprime » Thu May 17, 2012 3:04 pm

SilverE2 wrote:Wait wtf. Why no to coffee but yes to caffeine? So I assume a red bull would be allowed, but decaffeinated coffee would not?


As a mormon, I've asked myself this question for a while. The Word of Wisdom (which is the LDS health code) is found in D&C 89 (an LDS book of scripture). It outlaws the use of "Hot drinks," so I guess it's cool if your caffeine is cold.

Mormons drink hot chocolate all the time (though it is a "hot drink" and contains a little caffeine). Black Tea and Green Tea are no-gos, but herbal teas are fine.

I know, it doesn't make any sense to me either.

(Edit: Iced Tea is a no-go, even though it isn't a "hot drink.")

Also, here it is straight from the horses mouth: http://www.lds.org/study/topics/word-of-wisdom?lang=eng

gravityrides0
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby gravityrides0 » Thu May 17, 2012 3:12 pm

omg.

southwick
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby southwick » Thu May 17, 2012 3:17 pm

A clarification on tuition: ineptimusprime is right that non-Mormon students don't get the full benefit of low tuition, but even the non-Mormon rate is $21,900 a year--less than half of most comparable schools.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby TaipeiMort » Thu May 17, 2012 3:18 pm

Couple things on BYU.

1) If you are a girl, you get a HUGE employment boost. I mean HUGE. BYU struggles to find women, and those that get accepted are generally further down the curve (155 LSATs versus 165 for men), and have babies and other issues. If you dominate these women, there are going to be mid and biglaw opportunities for you.

2) The BYU network is nationwide, but you may need to conceal that you aren't mormon for some of these people to assist you with wherever you want to end up.

3) If you are going to be living a non-mormon lifestyle, live far away from campus and you will be fine (I know people who commute from Park City and SLC). Most Mormons would be chill (85%), but some are demented nazi sickos (15%) who would love to screw up your life by reporting you. You can probably tell these because they will be pretty aspie. BYU will enforce if they find out.

ineptimusprime
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby ineptimusprime » Thu May 17, 2012 3:24 pm

southwick wrote:A clarification on tuition: ineptimusprime is right that non-Mormon students don't get the full benefit of low tuition, but even the non-Mormon rate is $21,900 a year--less than half of most comparable schools.


Not that I endorse this course of action, but you could always "convert" and get baptized just for the tuition break. Totally shady and unethical, but then again, it would also be shady and unethical to sign the honor code and still have a live-in boyfriend -- caught or not.

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BearState
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby BearState » Thu May 17, 2012 3:29 pm

To even apply don't you need a letter from a religious leader stating you are in good standing?

ineptimusprime
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby ineptimusprime » Thu May 17, 2012 3:33 pm

BearState wrote:To even apply don't you need a letter from a religious leader stating you are in good standing?


I believe so. I know this is the case for LDS applicants. This, my way below median LSAT score, and the fact that I hate everything in Utah south of Kaysville were the reasons I didn't even bother applying.

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 3:39 pm

. double post.
Last edited by Map Cat on Thu May 17, 2012 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Map Cat
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby Map Cat » Thu May 17, 2012 3:42 pm

southwick wrote:A clarification on tuition: ineptimusprime is right that non-Mormon students don't get the full benefit of low tuition, but even the non-Mormon rate is $21,900 a year--less than half of most comparable schools.


Seriously. BYU is the one school where I'd be just fine--even grateful--to pay sticker.

BearState wrote:To even apply don't you need a letter from a religious leader stating you are in good standing?


That's kinda what I gathered from the website. I'm good friends with a pastor--think that would fly?

TaipeiMort wrote:That's kinda what I gathered from their website. I'm good friends with a pastor... think that would fly?

Couple things on BYU.

1) If you are a girl, you get a HUGE employment boost. I mean HUGE. BYU struggles to find women, and those that get accepted are generally further down the curve (155 LSATs versus 165 for men), and have babies and other issues. If you dominate these women, there are going to be mid and biglaw opportunities for you.

2) The BYU network is nationwide, but you may need to conceal that you aren't mormon for some of these people to assist you with wherever you want to end up.

3) If you are going to be living a non-mormon lifestyle, live far away from campus and you will be fine (I know people who commute from Park City and SLC). Most Mormons would be chill (85%), but some are demented nazi sickos (15%) who would love to screw up your life by reporting you. You can probably tell these because they will be pretty aspie. BYU will enforce if they find out.


Thanks for the info! I’m female with no babies and a shot at Biglaw brings a tear to my eye. I can definitely leave the non-Mormon part out. Hell, I live in the Bible belt and I’ve been leaving the atheist part out since I moved here five years ago.

I’m actually okay with the honor code for the most part. I don’t use “substances” or tobacco. Boyfriend is a recovering pickle so I rarely drink anyway. I will miss my short shorts, though. Boyfriend and I have been together quite a while, and I wouldn't go out there unmarried. Too risky.

edit: formatting, how does it work?
Last edited by Map Cat on Thu May 17, 2012 3:57 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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BearState
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Re: What's the skinny on BYU?

Postby BearState » Thu May 17, 2012 3:53 pm

If you're a member of the church in good standing, yea, that sounds fine. It may be worth it to talk to BYU alum and see if the hiring bonus rubs off on non-LDS grads. I'd be stressed at living with a sword of Damocles over my head for three years, however.




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