Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

final choice

Davis off wait list (25K per year 1/2 tuition)
7
50%
University of Arizona (28K per year or 2/3 tuition)
5
36%
Hastings (25k per year slightly >1/2 tuition)
2
14%
 
Total votes: 14

g-rauf
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Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Wed May 02, 2012 3:28 am

Just found out I was accepted to Davis off the waitlist. I was hoping to get just straight admitted because my numbers were competitive for them (165/3.8 ), but it is what it is. A lot of posts I read on here seem to feel Davis isn't a good idea at close to full price.

CA resident, but financially independent and married and wife will be working which makes establishing residency in AZ after a year possible as long as I transfer everything over. Never lived in AZ but lived in desert before so don't mind the heat and is still close enough to so cal to visit family over holidays and breaks.

purciate it
Last edited by g-rauf on Wed May 09, 2012 4:30 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Bronck
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Bronck » Wed May 02, 2012 3:57 am

Don't go to Davis at sticker.

Where do you want to work? Are you okay with living in Arizona for the rest of your career?

Have you considered retaking with that 3.8 GPA? You could get into some nice T14s if you got it around 170.

071816
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby 071816 » Wed May 02, 2012 4:02 am

Bronck wrote:Don't go to Davis at sticker.

Where do you want to work? Are you okay with living in Arizona for the rest of your career?

Have you considered retaking with that 3.8 GPA? You could get into some nice T14s if you got it around 170.

No get it right man. OP has an 8.3. Davis done fucked up.

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Wed May 02, 2012 4:59 am

ha , yes 3.8 too late to be posting on tls

CanadianWolf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed May 02, 2012 10:05 am

Since you applied late, you probably can do better with 4 years work experience & a 3.8/165. Arizona is a great deal if your target market is in the state of Arizona or you have strong law firm connections in California (your target market).

Consider retaking the LSAT & reapplying early in the next admissions cycle.

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Glock
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Glock » Wed May 02, 2012 11:59 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Since you applied late, you probably can do better with 4 years work experience & a 3.8/165. Arizona is a great deal if your target market is in the state of Arizona or you have strong law firm connections in California (your target market).

Consider retaking the LSAT & reapplying early in the next admissions cycle.



Emphasis on this. California is not a realistic target from AZ unless you have good connections and do well.

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Wed May 02, 2012 2:20 pm

i'm good with Arizona long term. smaller market but fewer lawyers per capita than CA. tucson and phoenix are both pretty fast growing cities and ASU and U of A graduate small classes each year. I decided U of A over Pepperdine and ASU because the employment prospects seem better upon graduation and I liked the feel better. BYU, Emory, and University of Illinois just seemed too far away.

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Glock
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Glock » Wed May 02, 2012 2:33 pm

g-rauf wrote:i'm good with Arizona long term. smaller market but fewer lawyers per capita than CA. tucson and phoenix are both pretty fast growing cities and ASU and U of A graduate small classes each year. I decided U of A over Pepperdine and ASU because the employment prospects seem better upon graduation and I liked the feel better. BYU, Emory, and University of Illinois just seemed too far away.



I am completely biased, but I do not think UA's employment prospects are better than ASU's, and I don't think they have been for several years. Neither are particularly good, obviously.

Reprisal
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Reprisal » Wed May 02, 2012 10:48 pm

Whoever said you can do better with a 3.8/165 is dreaming.

Davis is a reputable school with a strong CA OCI showing. Many firms in the region consider Davis with Stanford, Berkeley, UCLA, USC, and Hastings when they're deciding where to make the rounds. I'd go there with no qualms.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed May 02, 2012 10:51 pm

Not dreaming. You forgot to note OP's four years of work experience in addition to the 3.8/165 numbers. OP must have applied late or had another application quirk as his numbers are a shoe-in for UC-Davis based on a review of the data posted on lawschoolnumbers.com. In fact, on numbers alone, a 164/3.5 should result in good news from UC-Davis even without substntial work experience.
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Wed May 02, 2012 10:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Borhas
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Borhas » Wed May 02, 2012 10:57 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:
Consider retaking the LSAT & reapplying early in the next admissions cycle.


+1

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Wed May 02, 2012 11:38 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:Not dreaming. You forgot to note OP's four years of work experience in addition to the 3.8/165 numbers. OP must have applied late or had another application quirk as his numbers are a shoe-in for UC-Davis based on a review of the data posted on lawschoolnumbers.com. In fact, on numbers alone, a 164/3.5 should result in good news from UC-Davis even without substntial work experience.




I applied mid-late january (so late). After my WL decision I went back and looked at my submitted aplication on LSAC and I had submitted a version of my PS that said "I have a strong desire to help other" instead of others or other people. So I can blame it on that because typos kill, or just accept the fact that overall my personal statement wasn't what they were looking for. If I was looking at a stack of applicants who all had similar numbers and one dumbass had a typo in theirs I would probably pass on it too. At least to the point of no $. Kind of shot myself in the foot...

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Lawquacious
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Lawquacious » Wed May 02, 2012 11:50 pm

Of these options and given what you generally said in post, Arizona Law by a long shot.

timbs4339
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby timbs4339 » Thu May 03, 2012 1:06 am

You might have a lot better options in CA with a retake. A few points could get you UCLA/USC or the T14.

Barring that, Arizona. UC Davis in-state tuition is $46,000!?! JFC.

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Thu May 03, 2012 3:35 pm

actually Davis in state is now 50K.


Estimated Cost of Attendance
Basic Living $14,336.00
Books and Supplies $1,014.00
Tuition $50,301.00
Transportation $1,682.00
Out of State $0.00
Summer $0.00
Other $0.00
Total Cost of Attendance $67,333.00



I found out that I qualify for 25K in grants. Does this make it more worth it, or still not really?

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Wed May 09, 2012 4:32 pm

reset poll now that I got similar offer from Hastings. I am not going to die if I don't work in San Francisco, though I understand that's where the better private sector jobs are. Just what I read about the Hastings area kind of freaks me out, but I'm flying up tomorrow to visit both schools.

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sundance95
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby sundance95 » Thu May 10, 2012 1:02 am

Reprisal wrote:Whoever said you can do better with a 3.8/165 is dreaming.

Davis is a reputable school with a strong CA OCI showing. Many firms in the region consider Davis with Stanford, Berkeley, UCLA, USC, and Hastings when they're deciding where to make the rounds. I'd go there with no qualms.

wtf are you talking about? who cares where they 'decide to make the rounds?' op should be worried about where they 'hire.' and if you would go to davis at sticker w/no qualms whatsoever you are a fool.

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Mon May 21, 2012 1:11 am

i received a merit scholarship from davis for 10K a year. so 35K in need based/merit based aid. So i'm going to go. thanks for everyone's input

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Veyron
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Veyron » Mon May 21, 2012 1:16 am

Glock wrote:
g-rauf wrote:i'm good with Arizona long term. smaller market but fewer lawyers per capita than CA. tucson and phoenix are both pretty fast growing cities and ASU and U of A graduate small classes each year. I decided U of A over Pepperdine and ASU because the employment prospects seem better upon graduation and I liked the feel better. BYU, Emory, and University of Illinois just seemed too far away.



I am completely biased, but I do not think UA's employment prospects are better than ASU's, and I don't think they have been for several years. Neither are particularly good, obviously.


While it is correct that U of A's employment prospects are about the same as ASU's both have better placement than your typical T1 like Davis because of the factors that OP identified, namely, that they are the only law schools (not counting PCOL) that serve two large metro areas.

g-rauf
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby g-rauf » Mon May 21, 2012 3:31 am

Veyron wrote:
Glock wrote:
g-rauf wrote:i'm good with Arizona long term. smaller market but fewer lawyers per capita than CA. tucson and phoenix are both pretty fast growing cities and ASU and U of A graduate small classes each year. I decided U of A over Pepperdine and ASU because the employment prospects seem better upon graduation and I liked the feel better. BYU, Emory, and University of Illinois just seemed too far away.



I am completely biased, but I do not think UA's employment prospects are better than ASU's, and I don't think they have been for several years. Neither are particularly good, obviously.


While it is correct that U of A's employment prospects are about the same as ASU's both have better placement than your typical T1 like Davis because of the factors that OP identified, namely, that they are the only law schools (not counting PCOL) that serve two large metro areas.



I say it's different based on what I could tell. Both Davis and ASU had around 10% students in law school funded positions at the time the reporting is done, so both their reported numbers already appear a little overly optimistic. Arizona has much fewer bigger law firms, fewer corporations have their headquarters there, IP is not a huge field there, I don't know. I have several factors like family that I would probably prefer to tough it out in CA if I could get a reasonable job. Davis still has a slight better chance at get biglaw if you finish top 10%, Arizona and ASU were less. But none of the schools are great for this. There seemed to still be some chance of working at a firm of 100+ attorneys in Sacramento if one does alright, and I have family in the area. Davis and Arizona both have good networks for public/government work if I totally fall in love with that instead. I really like Arizona a lot and was going to go, but I think Davis is still an alright option if you can finish in the top half or so and network well. Both areas are really cool towns and I could enjoy living either place. I've never lived in AZ before and no family there. Though Tucson is around the same distance from Southern California as Davis is.

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Veyron
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Re: Davis (off WL) or University of Arizona (2/3 tuition)

Postby Veyron » Mon May 21, 2012 4:47 am

g-rauf wrote:
Veyron wrote:
Glock wrote:
g-rauf wrote:i'm good with Arizona long term. smaller market but fewer lawyers per capita than CA. tucson and phoenix are both pretty fast growing cities and ASU and U of A graduate small classes each year. I decided U of A over Pepperdine and ASU because the employment prospects seem better upon graduation and I liked the feel better. BYU, Emory, and University of Illinois just seemed too far away.



I am completely biased, but I do not think UA's employment prospects are better than ASU's, and I don't think they have been for several years. Neither are particularly good, obviously.


While it is correct that U of A's employment prospects are about the same as ASU's both have better placement than your typical T1 like Davis because of the factors that OP identified, namely, that they are the only law schools (not counting PCOL) that serve two large metro areas.



I say it's different based on what I could tell. Both Davis and ASU had around 10% students in law school funded positions at the time the reporting is done, so both their reported numbers already appear a little overly optimistic. Arizona has much fewer bigger law firms, fewer corporations have their headquarters there, IP is not a huge field there, I don't know. I have several factors like family that I would probably prefer to tough it out in CA if I could get a reasonable job. Davis still has a slight better chance at get biglaw if you finish top 10%, Arizona and ASU were less. But none of the schools are great for this. There seemed to still be some chance of working at a firm of 100+ attorneys in Sacramento if one does alright, and I have family in the area. Davis and Arizona both have good networks for public/government work if I totally fall in love with that instead. I really like Arizona a lot and was going to go, but I think Davis is still an alright option if you can finish in the top half or so and network well. Both areas are really cool towns and I could enjoy living either place. I've never lived in AZ before and no family there. Though Tucson is around the same distance from Southern California as Davis is.


There are a few things wrong with this analysis. The first is that you are trusting the numbers that the schools are providing, which is stupid. The second is that Arizona biglaw jobs will often not show up in "biglaw" stats. Many of the state's high paying firms are too small to be NLJ 250 firms, but at top 10% at U of A a six figure job is yours to lose. Lots of corporations have headquarters in Arizona (US Air, SRP, APS, Dial, Freeport McMoran etc..). Not as many as CA but it doesn't have close to as many law schools either. In house is indeed a common route for ASU/U of A grads. Over all, I would worry about securing any sort of full time legal employment from Davis outside of the top 20% or so and I wouldn't necessarily have that concern with Arizona. Again, its just an issue of supply and demand. At the very least, with Davis you will be paying more for inferior prospects. As to your personal considerations well, I can't speak to those.




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