Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Good or Better?

Chicago
72
50%
NYU
73
50%
 
Total votes: 145

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Doorkeeper » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:08 pm

Go to NYU. 50k isn't worth three years of happiness when you have nearly identical biglaw prospects.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:17 pm

Doorkeeper wrote:Go to NYU. 50k isn't worth three years of happiness when you have nearly identical biglaw prospects.


When you consider how long that 50K takes to repay, yes it is worth it.

$$$$$$
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby $$$$$$ » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:21 pm

Honestly, the amount of networking you could do in NYC is probably worth the $50K more you'll spend. YOu could get lunch with big law partners every week. If you want NYC, go to NYU.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:23 pm

$$$$$$ wrote:Honestly, the amount of networking you could do in NYC is probably worth the $50K more you'll spend. YOu could get lunch with big law partners every week. If you want NYC, go to NYU.



Really? ...

Can someone comment on this...?

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Bildungsroman » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:24 pm

GoodFood wrote:
$$$$$$ wrote:Honestly, the amount of networking you could do in NYC is probably worth the $50K more you'll spend. YOu could get lunch with big law partners every week. If you want NYC, go to NYU.



Really? ...

Can someone comment on this...?

It's true. I often email random biglaw partners asking them to have lunch with me, a law student they have no reason to know or care about. The email I get back is always the same: "Maybe if you went to NYU." :(

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:32 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
GoodFood wrote:
$$$$$$ wrote:Honestly, the amount of networking you could do in NYC is probably worth the $50K more you'll spend. YOu could get lunch with big law partners every week. If you want NYC, go to NYU.



Really? ...

Can someone comment on this...?

It's true. I often email random biglaw partners asking them to have lunch with me, a law student they have no reason to know or care about. The email I get back is always the same: "Maybe if you went to NYU." :(

:lol: :lol:

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Doorkeeper » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:38 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Doorkeeper wrote:Go to NYU. 50k isn't worth three years of happiness when you have nearly identical biglaw prospects.


When you consider how long that 50K takes to repay, yes it is worth it.


I really don't think so. People do better academically when they're in a positive mental state. Depressed -> Low grades -> No job.

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:39 pm

Doorkeeper wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
Doorkeeper wrote:Go to NYU. 50k isn't worth three years of happiness when you have nearly identical biglaw prospects.


When you consider how long that 50K takes to repay, yes it is worth it.


I really don't think so. People do better academically when they're in a positive mental state. Depressed -> Low grades -> No job.

People aren't depressed during 1L? That was just me?

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:14 am

What is this bitchmade sad sack, "I can't be happy unless I'm where I want to be." Nut up son.

Manhattan smells like a toilet.

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IAFG
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby IAFG » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:20 am

GoodFood wrote:
$$$$$$ wrote:Honestly, the amount of networking you could do in NYC is probably worth the $50K more you'll spend. YOu could get lunch with big law partners every week. If you want NYC, go to NYU.



Really? ...

Can someone comment on this...?

I mean it's true to a point. I met with a few jr associates in Chicago. Of course, most of that was during my 1L summer. But jr associates don't have much pull, so I can't imagine it's all that super helpful.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:24 am

Desert Fox wrote:What is this bitchmade sad sack, "I can't be happy unless I'm where I want to be." Nut up son.

Manhattan smells like a toilet.


Yeah I'm pretty sure I could make this situation work. I wasn't expecting this to become a "what about you're SO" thread to be honest. I thought the overarching consensus would have been to take Chicago because it's a peer school at the very least but 50k cheaper.

Can people comment on getting a 1L summer job from UChicago but in NY? I know it's tough to get a firm job, but there are a lot of other opportunities in NY obviously. Does anyone think I can pull this off, or would it be too difficult?

fakehunter
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby fakehunter » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:34 am

I voted NYU. Mostly for the SO reason - but I have a question. Do you see yourself marrying her within three years? If you want it to be sooner rather than later, it would make sense to stay together full-time. Also could you live together (assuming that's not against your personal beliefs) and save some money that way?

chasgoose
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby chasgoose » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:26 am

I definitely think NYU here. Chicago isn't for everyone, Hyde Park is a drastic difference from NYC (isolated, there seems to be nothing to do within a half mile radius of the law school, etc.) if you already have qualms about it, it's probably not going to make your 3 years very enjoyable. Yes, you don't have to live in Hyde Park, but then you need to commute to school and you still are going to be spending a lot of time there.

Obviously, the schools are pretty much equal in every important respect for post-graduate options and educational quality, but quality of life is also important too. You are going to be spending 3 years at whatever law school you choose, law school itself is pretty miserable, you don't want the non-law-school aspects of your life to be miserable as well. $16k per year when you have pretty compelling reasons to demonstrate that you would be happier at NYU and in NYC is not ridiculous at all. Also, for the most part, people who do well in law school are the people who are happy. If you end up hating Chicago, that will translate into your performance grade-wise and probably be more detrimental than the risk of distractions at NYU. Happiness is important and has a decent subjective value.

When comparing CCN schools, Chicago should be a special case. If CLS offers you $10-15k more than NYU there are very few legitimate reasons for taking NYU or vice versa since they are so similar in almost every respect (prestige, job placement, academic quality, AND environment), you can make a case for taking NYU/CLS over Chicago or vice versa for up to about $50k since they are drastically different on the last count. I think your specific reasons for choosing NYU justify the price difference.

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cjcregg
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby cjcregg » Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:41 am

I recently was in your position. At sticker, I was completely undecided between Chicago and NYU. I definitely gave NYU the edge in QoL. I am in love w/ Greenwich village and found Hyde Park disturbingly depressing. Still, you have to keep in mind that at least during their 1L years, NYU students don't have a lot of time to enjoy the city anyway. Nevertheless, after Chicago's ASW I leaned slightly towards Chicago. The main reason was the supply and demand argument for Big Law jobs. 350 firms on campus for 2L OCI and less than 200 2Ls looking for a job. Your main competition in the Chicago market are NW students. NW also has a fairly small class. In NYC, you are vying against the other 350 or so NYU students looking for an SA job, 350 Columbia students, a bunch from Harvard, Yale, and Stanford, Cornell, and the cream-of-the-crop of all the other t-14 schools.

Despite this, even if you go to Chicago you want to do Big Law in NYC. I just felt NYU didn't give me enough of a guaranteed pass. I know of several capable NYU students who weren't able to snag NYC Big Law jobs. I think Chicago offers a much higher probability of finding a Big Law job. I think Chicago's a safer bet to access a prestigious firm. NYU is probably a safer bet to access a NYC firm, but you'll probably need to broaden your search to medium to small firms.

So at sticker, NYU definitely leads in terms of QoL and Chicago leads in terms of buying yourself an insurance policy in case grades/interviews don't work out. At Chicago's ASW I was mainly interested to see how bad the QoL would be. And it isn't terrible. Many of Chicago's students are approachable and warm-hearted. The tiny class seems to discourage brinkmanship. Not only were current students friendly to the 0Ls, they seemed to be close to each other. The professors also seemed to engage more closely w/ students. While Hyde Park is pretty awful in terms of things to do, there are scenic areas, and downtown Chicago is a short bus-ride away. Downtown Chicago is actually nicer in many respects than NYC except for their shitty deep-dish pizza.

While I was definitely torn between the schools at sticker, the scholarship to Chicago made the decision much more simple.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:22 am

While Chicago is the better choice from financial & employment perspectives, NYU may be the better choice for you due to personal reasons in light of the fact that you're targeting NYC biglaw. Plus, your posts hint that you may spend the extra scholarship award from Chicago on travel to NYC. :D
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:14 am

CanadianWolf wrote:While Chicago is the better choice from financial & employment perspectives, NYU may be the better choice for you due to personal reasons in light of the fact that you're targeting NYC biglaw. Plus, your posts hint that you may spend the extra scholarship award from Chicago on travel to NYC.

Yeah, who cares that the repayment time could be cut by a third, he'll probably just spend $50,000 in 3 years on travel to NY anyway.

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dresden doll
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dresden doll » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:17 am

Bildungsroman wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:While Chicago is the better choice from financial & employment perspectives, NYU may be the better choice for you due to personal reasons in light of the fact that you're targeting NYC biglaw. Plus, your posts hint that you may spend the extra scholarship award from Chicago on travel to NYC.

Yeah, who cares that the repayment time could be cut by a third, he'll probably just spend $50,000 in 3 years on travel to NY anyway.

Airplane tickets are expensive, bro.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:37 am

The travel comment was intended to be humorous. :D Didn't expect it to be taken so seriously.

But OP's prior posts suggest that he & his SO would only fly first class. :D

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echamberlin8
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby echamberlin8 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:57 am

Which of these schools do you think gives you a better chance at a V15 NYC firm? Obviously Chicago has the better placement in Chicago, and NYU can get you a lot of opportunities in its city, but I'm curious if there is any data which shows which of these schools gives you access to the most prestigious NYC firms. I think Columbia is obviously the clear winner out of CCN in this regard, but I'm curious if there is much of a difference between Chi and NYU.

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Nelson
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Nelson » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:59 am

cjcregg wrote:Despite this, even if you go to Chicago you want to do Big Law in NYC. I just felt NYU didn't give me enough of a guaranteed pass. I know of several capable NYU students who weren't able to snag NYC Big Law jobs. I think Chicago offers a much higher probability of finding a Big Law job. I think Chicago's a safer bet to access a prestigious firm.

Actual placement data says you're wrong.

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cjcregg
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby cjcregg » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:11 am

Nelson wrote:
cjcregg wrote:Despite this, even if you go to Chicago you want to do Big Law in NYC. I just felt NYU didn't give me enough of a guaranteed pass. I know of several capable NYU students who weren't able to snag NYC Big Law jobs. I think Chicago offers a much higher probability of finding a Big Law job. I think Chicago's a safer bet to access a prestigious firm.

Actual placement data says you're wrong.


Which data? Not the 2012 Above the Law List. Chicago places a higher percent in NLJ 250 firms. Not percent LT employed, Chicago beats out NYU there.

You mean placement in firms w/ over 500 attorneys? I guess you're right for 2010. But other than that year the numbers are very similar.

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Lawst
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Lawst » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:14 am

Moving to a city you end up hating makes 1L way worse than it has to be, and 1L is pretty bad as it is. You have been admitted to one of the top schools in the country, located in the market in which you want to work and where you already live. You don't have to waste time getting your bearings or finding summer housing, and it's easier to get interviews because you're in the city already. It also allows for internships during the school year as a 2L or 3L in the market in which you want to work. Even without the SO situation, you've got a lot of reasons to choose NYU.
If you had no qualms about moving to Chicago, you wouldn't even be debating this. Even with the extra $50K, I don't think you'll regret going to NYU.
Also, I love New York and cannot seem to like Chicago despite multiple visits and despite having a lot of family and other connections there, so I guess take what I say with a grain of salt.

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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:17 am

Nelson wrote:
cjcregg wrote:Despite this, even if you go to Chicago you want to do Big Law in NYC. I just felt NYU didn't give me enough of a guaranteed pass. I know of several capable NYU students who weren't able to snag NYC Big Law jobs. I think Chicago offers a much higher probability of finding a Big Law job. I think Chicago's a safer bet to access a prestigious firm.

Actual placement data says you're wrong.

No one can untangle this stuff. It's just impossible. Whenever someone shows that per capita NYU is placing much higher than Chicago at places like STB, DPW, Skadden (which is true if you look at the summer classes this year), the response from Chicago people is, "Well nobody from Chicago wants to work in NYC anyway." When someone shows that Chicago (or Columbia) places higher percentages in the NLJ 250, the response from NYU people is, "More people want to do public interest at NYU." These are both probably true statements but it's basically impossible to know the extent of the impact these preferences have on the placement data. The best anyone can do is say that the schools are basically equivalent, and offer anecdotes about job placement. For instance, at NYU this year it seemed like top 1/3 gave you a pretty decent shot at V10 jobs, but there's a wide variation in there. Some people with decent grades struggled to get one or two offers. Ultimately, firms don't hire automatically anymore ITE the way they used to, and there's only so much mechanical prediction you can do about your odds at any of these schools.

I will say that it is a total joke to say that it doesn't matter where you live during law school because 1Ls just study all the time. Your environment matters A LOT. And if law school is taking up much more of your time than a full time job would, even during 1L year, you are doing it wrong.

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Nelson
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Nelson » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:31 am

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
Nelson wrote:
cjcregg wrote:Despite this, even if you go to Chicago you want to do Big Law in NYC. I just felt NYU didn't give me enough of a guaranteed pass. I know of several capable NYU students who weren't able to snag NYC Big Law jobs. I think Chicago offers a much higher probability of finding a Big Law job. I think Chicago's a safer bet to access a prestigious firm.

Actual placement data says you're wrong.

No one can untangle this stuff. It's just impossible. Whenever someone shows that per capita NYU is placing much higher than Chicago at places like STB, DPW, Skadden (which is true if you look at the summer classes this year), the response from Chicago people is, "Well nobody from Chicago wants to work in NYC anyway." When someone shows that Chicago (or Columbia) places higher percentages in the NLJ 250, the response from NYU people is, "More people want to do public interest at NYU." These are both probably true statements but it's basically impossible to know the extent of the impact these preferences have on the placement data. The best anyone can do is say that the schools are basically equivalent, and offer anecdotes about job placement. For instance, at NYU this year it seemed like top 1/3 gave you a pretty decent shot at V10 jobs, but there's a wide variation in there. Some people with decent grades struggled to get one or two offers. Ultimately, firms don't hire automatically anymore ITE the way they used to, and there's only so much mechanical prediction you can do about your odds at any of these schools.

Agree 100%. The data that is there is is so close and the year-to-year variations muddle everything. CCN are peers.

dixiecupdrinking wrote:I will say that it is a total joke to say that it doesn't matter where you live during law school because 1Ls just study all the time. Your environment matters A LOT. And if law school is taking up much more of your time than a full time job would, even during 1L year, you are doing it wrong.

Agreed as well, though I'm a 0L so what do I know.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:36 pm

Thanks everyone for the great advice. I am a little shocked that people think I should pay an extra 50k/+interest for NYU, but I guess I have strong reasons to do so.

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?




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