Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans) Forum

[Doorkeeper]

Thanks everyone for the great advice. I am a little shocked that people think I should pay an extra 50k/+interest for NYU, but I guess I have strong reasons to do so.

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?

It's because of your unique personal situation. People credit/discredit your SO/family/friend situation differently. Considering that these are peer schools, the vote hinges on the debt vs. SO/family value...which is going to be different for people. I'm not surprised at all that this is so close.

[GoodFood]

Thanks everyone for the great advice. I am a little shocked that people think I should pay an extra 50k/+interest for NYU, but I guess I have strong reasons to do so.

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?

It's because of your unique personal situation. People credit/discredit your SO/family/friend situation differently. Considering that these are peer schools, the vote hinges on the debt vs. SO/family value...which is going to be different for people. I'm not surprised at all that this is so close.

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

[Nelson]

Thanks everyone for the great advice. I am a little shocked that people think I should pay an extra 50k/+interest for NYU, but I guess I have strong reasons to do so.

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?

It's because of your unique personal situation. People credit/discredit your SO/family/friend situation differently. Considering that these are peer schools, the vote hinges on the debt vs. SO/family value...which is going to be different for people. I'm not surprised at all that this is so close.

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

It would be one thing if you were from Tallahassee but just "loved New York soooo much." But you're from the city and live there now. There needs to be some value placed on staying where you have family, friends, established social and professional networks etc. Plus you can hopefully make up some of the COL difference from not having relocation/travel and from knowing how to cut some corners in a city you're familiar with as opposed to a brand new place. Is that worth 50k? YMMV

[annet]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

[kaiser]

You love NY, you loved NYU, this is your home, and this is where you want to work. NYU's alumni network is insanely helpful, and I can't begin to describe how beneficial it is to have that alumni network in close reach. The networking opportunities and proximity to alumni alone make it worth it if NYC is your goal. Everything else is just icing on top. Definitely NYU.

If you weren't sold on NYC vs. Chicago in general, I'd of course just say go for the $$, but your situation pretty heavily skews it to the NYU side, at least enough so that the additional 50K becomes justified.

[Bildungsroman]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Yeah, non-k-JD 0Ls are probably the best source of info about what law school is like, definitely more than K-JD current law students.

[GoodFood]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Why do you think the opinion of those who took some time off between UG and law school sway this in favor of NYU?

[chasgoose]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Why do you think the opinion of those who took some time off between UG and law school sway this in favor of NYU?

Because we recognize that there is more to picking a law school than just prestige and money offered. I'm already going to spend my mid-20's in law school, no need to spend them languishing in Hyde Park.

[Bildungsroman]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Why do you think the opinion of those who took some time off between UG and law school sway this in favor of NYU?

Because we recognize that there is more to picking a law school than just prestige and money offered. I'm already going to spend my mid-20's in law school, no need to spend them languishing in Hyde Park.

Ah the wisdom of someone in his-20s. You are so wise, Master Splinter.

[annet]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Yeah, non-k-JD 0Ls are probably the best source of info about what law school is like, definitely more than K-JD current law students.

Ok, yeah, in hindsight that came out wrong (it was a long week). I was just trying to point out that I think some of the comparatively older folks around here are, myself included, are going to put more value on your ties to NYC, loving where you live, and your relationship with your SO. Younger folks are more optimistic and seem to be much more inclined to uproot for school (and didn't have to walk to ug in a blizzard uphill both ways ).

[JollyGreenGiant]

Based on what I know about this board, I was expecting something along the lines of: "Don't be a fool; take the 50k and find a way to make the SO situation work." Pleasantly surprised that people have a soul here . Naive 0Ls voting perhaps?

Voted NYU for all of the reasons folks have already listed. I think the fact that there are a lot of non-K-JD folks around is influencing your poll results more than a lot of us being 0Ls. I've been out of school for a while and despite being debt-averse, I think it'll be worth the 50k in the long run to stay in NY.

Why do you think the opinion of those who took some time off between UG and law school sway this in favor of NYU?

Because we recognize that there is more to picking a law school than just prestige and money offered. I'm already going to spend my mid-20's in law school, no need to spend them languishing in Hyde Park.

Spoken like a true 0L.

[concurrent fork]

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?

Polls are pretty meaningless. Some people will just select the highest USNWR rank without even reading your post.

[birdlaw117]

You could always look at the insufferable posts by Bils and JollyGreenGiant (UChi students) and compare those to the posts by Chasgoose and Dixie to get a general sense the Chi vs. NYU vibe. NYU students try and be helpful by giving you a bunch of info. Chi students try and belittle other posters.

But seriously, taking away personal preferences Chi is the obvious winner. The question is just how much your personal preference for NYC/NYU is worth. It's difficult for someone else to place a value on that. Personally, I would pay $50k (plus interest) to not be away from my SO (and I guess family as well) for 3 years. But I don't know if you would/should make that same valuation.

[Xifeng]

You could always look at the insufferable posts by Bils and JollyGreenGiant (UChi students) and compare those to the posts by Chasgoose and Dixie to get a general sense the Chi vs. NYU vibe. NYU students try and be helpful by giving you a bunch of info. Chi students try and belittle other posters.

Hmm.

And as someone who had a lot more $ at Chicago and an SO in NYC, it's totally workable and long-distance (especially 1L year) can be helpful in focusing on school.

[birdlaw117]

You could always look at the insufferable posts by Bils and JollyGreenGiant (UChi students) and compare those to the posts by Chasgoose and Dixie to get a general sense the Chi vs. NYU vibe. NYU students try and be helpful by giving you a bunch of info. Chi students try and belittle other posters.

Hmm.

And as someone who had a lot more $ at Chicago and an SO in NYC, it's totally workable and long-distance (especially 1L year) can be helpful in focusing on school.

I was trying to make light of the douchiness of the recent posts... Something that should have been obvious when I said "But seriously."

[Bildungsroman]

You could always look at the insufferable posts by Bils and JollyGreenGiant (UChi students) and compare those to the posts by Chasgoose and Dixie to get a general sense the Chi vs. NYU vibe. NYU students try and be helpful by giving you a bunch of info. Chi students try and belittle other posters.

Hmm.

And as someone who had a lot more $ at Chicago and an SO in NYC, it's totally workable and long-distance (especially 1L year) can be helpful in focusing on school.

I was trying to make light of the douchiness of the recent posts... Something that should have been obvious when I said "But seriously."

I hope my douchy posts didn't hurt the delicate fee fees of the 0Ls in here giving advice to one another on what law school is like.

[GoodFood]

I hope my douchy posts didn't hurt the delicate fee fees of the 0Ls in here giving advice to one another on what law school is like.

What are you talking about?

ETA: I should've prefaced this thread by asking only current students/graduates to chime in, actually. Although it's still nice to see what decision others would make and why if they were in my shoes.

[GoodFood]

The fact that 72 people have voted in the poll and it is still a DEAD TIE is really funny though =). Does this happen a lot on this site?

Polls are pretty meaningless. Some people will just select the highest USNWR rank without even reading your post.

It's funny that it's been a dead tie the whole time though.

And as someone who had a lot more $ at Chicago and an SO in NYC, it's totally workable and long-distance (especially 1L year) can be helpful in focusing on school.

How often do you visit?

[Xifeng]

How often do you visit?

I visit every couple months, depending on my school schedule (but he visits me about every couple months, so we see each other about once a month). It's really easy/cheap to get between NYC and Chicago, especially with Southwest at Midway. Feel free to PM me about this if you have any more questions!

[dixiecupdrinking]

You know what would be helpful? If this thread had more people coming in and making completely off-base ad hominem arguments that involve referring to current law students as 0Ls. That would be great.

FWIW (and I mean that genuinely. I don't know exactly what it's worth.), GoodFood, I'm an NYU 2L, came here over Chicago with slightly more money (not $50k, more like $10k).

Anyway I think you have probably gotten about as much advice as can be dished out on this question. It's a personal choice, but I don't think you would be giving up anything careerwise by choosing NYU over Chicago. I also don't really think you'd be gaining much. It's a wash. Otherwise, I don't think anyone can help much with deciding whether your other preferences are worth $50k. But you wouldn't be nuts to pass up the money at Chicago, that's for sure.

[GoodFood]

You know what would be helpful? If this thread had more people coming in and making completely off-base ad hominem arguments that involve referring to current law students as 0Ls. That would be great.

FWIW (and I mean that genuinely. I don't know exactly what it's worth.), GoodFood, I'm an NYU 2L, came here over Chicago with slightly more money (not $50k, more like $10k).

Anyway I think you have probably gotten about as much advice as can be dished out on this question. It's a personal choice, but I don't think you would be giving up anything careerwise by choosing NYU over Chicago. I also don't really think you'd be gaining much. It's a wash. Otherwise, I don't think anyone can help much with deciding whether your other preferences are worth $50k. But you wouldn't be nuts to pass up the money at Chicago, that's for sure.

Yeah I think I'm ready to make a final decision soon. Thank you to everyone who responded, especially the UChicago/NYU students!

[skers]

OP, peer schools are peer. If you want NY you should be able to get back there considering the significant number of students at U of C that realize Chicago is a better city and want to stay there. The relevant question for you is whether 50k (plus interest) is worth some undefinable increase in happiness, though it'd be best to realize that as a law student you'll never be happy.

[dresden doll]

I've assisted OP via pms, but the turn this thread has taken compels me to post ITT as well.

If Bils and JollyGreenGiant are being a little abrasive, it's probably because many advice givers here seem atrociously misguided. Specifically, a number of posters have emphasized that 'the cost of traveling will chip away at that 50k difference' while conveniently ignoring two facts: 1) OP's gf is coming with him so he's unlikely to travel to NYC all that frequently and 2) COL differential between Chicago and NYC is IMMENSE. You know how I know? I know because I've spent first two years of lawl school at UChi and I'm at CLS for my third year (for personal reasons that don't at all reflect on my home school). While in Chicago, I lived in a large studio in the best part of the city for 775 a month (all utilities included). At CLS, I pay 1,250 a month for my share of rent in - wait for it - a subsidized, supposedly very cost-effective apartment. My loans have gone up by THOUSANDS due to the COL difference alone. And this is Morningside Heights, a.k.a. the least prestigious part of Manhattan. Which is to say, OP is likely to cough up at least 500 bucks extra in rent each month living around NYU.

Btw, I lived on the Chi-NYC relation throughout all of my 2L before going off to CLS. Total cost of airfare? Less than 1500 when all was said and done. Seriously.

Moving along to address some of the speculation in re: employment prospects, whatever 'advantage' OP gains by hanging out with NYU junior biglawl associates may well be outweighed by the fact that, at UChi, he'd be competing with fewer classmates for NYC biglawl. From what I've heard, firms do like some diversity in their SA classes. Thus, OP may well be advantaged by the small class size coupled with a lesser level of overall interest in NYC biglawl. In etiher case, the marginal benefit of lunching with a first year associate in NYC is immensely outweighed by the fact that OP's loans will be reduced by a third, if not more, if he chooses Chicago.

Lastly, I don't know why anyone assumes that OP is somehow going to wind up miserable outside of NYC. OP's a big boy, and as he's said to me at least, he's down to experience another city. Plenty of NYC natives go to UChi, enjoy themselves and return home, and they're no worse for the experience of having stepped out of the Big Apple for three short years of their lives.

The only factor that really gives me pause here is SO's gf. If she doesn't wind up liking Chicago and doesn't wind up getting a job she's all right with, she may well take her frustration out on him. But this is a risk people take. FWIW, it never materialized with any of my classmates whose SOs came along.

[dresden doll]

Because we recognize that there is more to picking a law school than just prestige and money offered. I'm already going to spend my mid-20's in law school, no need to spend them languishing in Hyde Park.

I would expect someone who claims to have been enriched by the 'adult world' experience to be particularly sensitive to the immense benefits of saving yourself several years' worth of loan repayments.

[GoodFood]

I've assisted OP via pms, but the turn this thread has taken compels me to post ITT as well.

If Bils and JollyGreenGiant are being a little abrasive, it's probably because many advice givers here seem atrociously misguided. Specifically, a number of posters have emphasized that 'the cost of traveling will chip away at that 50k difference' while conveniently ignoring two facts: 1) OP's gf is coming with him so he's unlikely to travel to NYC all that frequently and 2) COL differential between Chicago and NYC is IMMENSE. You know how I know? I know because I've spent first two years of lawl school at UChi and I'm at CLS for my third year (for personal reasons that don't at all reflect on my home school). While in Chicago, I lived in a large studio in the best part of the city for 775 a month (all utilities included). At CLS, I pay 1,250 a month for my share of rent in - wait for it - a subsidized, supposedly very cost-effective apartment. My loans have gone up by THOUSANDS due to the COL difference alone. And this is Morningside Heights, a.k.a. the least prestigious part of Manhattan. Which is to say, OP is likely to cough up at least 500 bucks extra in rent each month living around NYU.

Btw, I lived on the Chi-NYC relation throughout all of my 2L before going off to CLS. Total cost of airfare? Less than 1500 when all was said and done. Seriously.

Moving along to address some of the speculation in re: employment prospects, whatever 'advantage' OP gains by hanging out with NYU junior biglawl associates may well be outweighed by the fact that, at UChi, he'd be competing with fewer classmates for NYC biglawl. From what I've heard, firms do like some diversity in their SA classes. Thus, OP may well be advantaged by the small class size coupled with a lesser level of overall interest in NYC biglawl. In etiher case, the marginal benefit of lunching with a first year associate in NYC is immensely outweighed by the fact that OP's loans will be reduced by a third, if not more, if he chooses Chicago.

Lastly, I don't know why anyone assumes that OP is somehow going to wind up miserable outside of NYC. OP's a big boy, and as he's said to me at least, he's down to experience another city. Plenty of NYC natives go to UChi, enjoy themselves and return home, and they're no worse for the experience of having stepped out of the Big Apple for three short years of their lives.

The only factor that really gives me pause here is SO's gf. If she doesn't wind up liking Chicago and doesn't wind up getting a job she's all right with, she may well take her frustration out on him. But this is a risk people take. FWIW, it never materialized with any of my classmates whose SOs came along.

OP here. Agree with all of this.

I'm glad I've spawned a thread that has gone this long, and I appreciate the discussion, but I don't know why some people voting NYU were trying to convince me that the COL differences will almost even out due to travel and whatnot--the gap is WAY too huge between the two cities. Prices in the village are insane (although well worth it IMO ). I also think that there are a LOT of reasons to pick UChi over NYU even if all else is equal.

In the end, I'm going to law school with the aim of joining a profession. As I suggested in my OP, I subscribe to the view that although each location/school has its own unique attributes, ultimately, whether you're "happy" at any given place will be more a measure of your own personality and temperament than anything else. The great concern strangers have shown for my relationship with my SO is very thoughtful , but I don't think the distance will be an insurmountable obstacle. And if it is for anyone who's in a similar situation, saving more than $50,000 in loans should be an incentive to get over it .

Thanks again!

ETA: One last bit--between this and the other "UChi Students Taking Questions" thread, I have noticed that there are a few UChi TLSers who really need to chill the fuck out and stop taking the internet so seriously.