Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Good or Better?

Chicago
72
50%
NYU
73
50%
 
Total votes: 145

GoodFood
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Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:44 pm

Numbers are rough estimates but that's essentially what I would graduate with in loans at each school.

Background: From NY, love NY, want to be here for the rest of my life, including when I work
Goals: Good person/get a uber-prestigous job in biglaw
Issues: A significant SO/family/friends in NY. I would obviously prefer to live in Manhattan than Hide Park (sic on purpose), but I HATE debt (none from UG). I also visited NYU and I think I fell in love with the place.

In general I err on the side of pragmatism over stuff like "fit" and "vibe" though. I imagine I'll be ok at either place.

Perceived Pros/Cons:

NYU Pros: Home<3. Has a curriculum in the thing I'm interested in (not that it matters I guess, but it would make me happy :) )
NYU Cons: More debt/higher COL. Huge class size (does the world really need 450 NYU Law grads?)

UChi Pros: Less debt<3. Smaller class size (could the world handle more than 190 Chicago Law grads?)
UChi Cons: Not home/general location :( . Apparently Chicago students have a weird reputation on TLS...I wonder if there's any truth to that--so far it seems stupid and baseless. Also, I am not sure if being at UChicago would translate into less/lesser opportunities in NY upon graduation in comparison to NYU.

I would like to come back to NY to work every summer while in law school. Will that be problem from Chicago?

Thank you. You're all very helpful. Advice from current NYU/Chicago students would obviously be the most helpful.
Last edited by GoodFood on Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:45 pm

If you can live at home, NYU. If not, enjoy Hyde PArk.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:47 pm

Desert Fox wrote:If you can live at home, NYU. If not, enjoy Hyde PArk.


I have a hunch this is going to be the broad consensus, so thank you.

Can't live at home. Do you mind expanding on your reasons why or addressing some of my concerns above?

duckmoney
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby duckmoney » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:48 pm

Sounds like this comes down to is being with your SO worth 50k of debt to you? Both schools will give you fantastic job prospects in NYC, and you will probably be comfortable / make friends at either schools and be happy living in either city once you settle in to it.

Long distance relationships, on the other hand, suck.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:49 pm

GoodFood wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:If you can live at home, NYU. If not, enjoy Hyde PArk.


I have a hunch this is going to be the broad consensus, so thank you.

Can't live at home. Do you mind expanding on your reasons why or addressing some of my concerns above?


They are peer schools and you have 50K less debt from one of them.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:51 pm

I missed the SO part. If SO is husband/wife. You gotta stay NYU. If it's a GF/BF, and you are very likely to get married. NYU. Otherwise I'd go with my prior advice.

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IAFG
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby IAFG » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:53 pm

I think UChicago students on average are way weirder than NYU students on average, having spent time with both groups. If you don't notice when you visit, it probably won't bother you. Obviously I think it's neither stupid nor baseless. Also, HP is much shittier than NYU's neighborhood. It's also relatively hard to get in and out of.

Other than that, the same cut-offs at both schools are going to largely get you the same job opportunities. It would be hard to turn down the $$. That comes out to a significant difference in your monthly loan payments. Only you can know what the QOL differences are worth to you. Remember though, that there is life beyond 1L. After you get your 2L summer job/have your firm locked down, you still have two more years of dealing with your school and environment.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:03 pm

IAFG wrote:I think UChicago students on average are way weirder than NYU students on average, having spent time with both groups.


Just out of curiosity, why do you think this is so? And weird in what way?

Desert Fox wrote:I missed the SO part. If SO is husband/wife. You gotta stay NYU. If it's a GF/BF, and you are very likely to get married. NYU. Otherwise I'd go with my prior advice.


Does anyone have any advice on what it would be like to live with a SO at Chicago? Maybe for your 2L/3L year? I'd be in NY during the summers, so she'd presumably have to come with me...that would complicate her getting a decent job in the new city, right?

ETA: Also, it's the GF/marry one.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:16 pm

If she is just going to move around with you, then still Chicago. I thought she was staying in NYC. The job market in Chicago is okay.

During the summer she'd just have to stay in Chicago while you go to NYC.

Living with you GF/wife wouldn't be any different than in NYC, so I don't get the question.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:19 pm

Desert Fox wrote:If she is just going to move around with you, then still Chicago. I thought she was staying in NYC. The job market in Chicago is okay.

During the summer she'd just have to stay in Chicago while you go to NYC.

Living with you GF/wife wouldn't be any different than in NYC, so I don't get the question.


I was referring to the job market/how the going back and forth has worked out for people. But also...dragging a gf to what sounds like a ghetto? I dunno...

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dresden doll
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dresden doll » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:19 pm

If you think you'll be miserable outside of NYC, 50k savings might not be worth it. Otherwise I'd go to UChicago.

As a side note, you're not condemned to living in HP. I didn't live in HP and the commute didn't kill me.

Lastly, I think it's pointless to debate 'weirdness.' Does it seriously matter whether one class is 'weirder' on average than the other? You're not going to have the time to hang out with everyone, and if you can't find a few normal people to be friends with, chances are it's not the school that's the problem.

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dresden doll
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dresden doll » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:20 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Living with you GF/wife wouldn't be any different than in NYC, so I don't get the question.


That's not true. The dynamics of the relationship can change tremendously when one person moves to another city for the other. If OP's gf winds up disliking Chicago, she may well take it out on him.

09042014
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby 09042014 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:22 pm

GoodFood wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:If she is just going to move around with you, then still Chicago. I thought she was staying in NYC. The job market in Chicago is okay.

During the summer she'd just have to stay in Chicago while you go to NYC.

Living with you GF/wife wouldn't be any different than in NYC, so I don't get the question.


I was referring to the job market/how the going back and forth has worked out for people. But also...dragging a gf to what sounds like a ghetto? I dunno...


You don't have to live in Hyde Park, and you probably shouldn't.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:28 pm

dresden doll wrote:Lastly, I think it's pointless to debate 'weirdness.' Does it seriously matter whether one class is 'weirder' on average than the other? You're not going to have the time to hang out with everyone, and if you can't find a few normal people to be friends with, chances are it's not the school that's the problem.


Yeah, I agree with this. Thanks.

The SO issue sort of dominated the discussion, but does anyone have anything to say about prospects at UChicago and NYU for NY firms specifically--and I guess V10/15 firms? I only ask because I'm worried that for any given firm job in NY, I'd have a disadvantage coming from UChi than from NYU. Is this a misplaced concern?

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:40 pm

The fact that the poll is a DEAD TIE every time I look at it is not helping lol...

concurrent fork
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby concurrent fork » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:47 pm

GoodFood wrote:From NY, love NY, want to be here for the rest of my life, including when I work

A significant SO/family/friends in NY. I would obviously prefer to live in Manhattan

I also visited NYU and I think I fell in love with the place

Sounds like NYU is worth the extra 50K

Gato de Schrodinger
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Gato de Schrodinger » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:52 pm

Talk clearly to your SO about the potential move to Chicago and potential savings. Chicago is a great city and is much cheaper than NY and Hyde Park is relatively safe. I would personally pick Chicago, but then again I'm from there and strongly believe it is the greatest city in the world.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:59 pm

Gato de Schrodinger wrote:Talk clearly to your SO about the potential move to Chicago and potential savings. Chicago is a great city and is much cheaper than NY and Hyde Park is relatively safe. I would personally pick Chicago, but then again I'm from there and strongly believe it is the greatest city in the world.


LAWL.

But all kidding aside, I think I agree with this piece of advice the most. Thank you.

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IAFG
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby IAFG » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:00 pm

I don't think there's any reason to think that UChicago will hold you back from any set of Vault ranked firms.* Of course, with self-selection, public interest people, people trying to stay in their preferred city, you never can really know what a school could have placed if everyone were just mindless prestige whores.

* viewtopic.php?f=23&t=156483

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dresden doll
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dresden doll » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:08 pm

IAFG wrote:I don't think there's any reason to think that UChicago will hold you back from any set of Vault ranked firms.* Of course, with self-selection, public interest people, people trying to stay in their preferred city, you never can really know what a school could have placed if everyone were just mindless prestige whores.

* viewtopic.php?f=23&t=156483


The decision becomes very hard if OP is PI focused.

If he wants a PI culture at the law school, NYU is the better choice. Far more relevantly, NYC is where PI really is, and I'm a huge, huge believer in the locational advantage that is being able to get to job interviews by riding the local subway.

OTOH, the new UChi LRAP is ridiculously good. If OP's gf makes great money, he should seriously consider the advantage of being in an LRAP program that doesn't give two shits about your spouse's income.

GoodFood
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby GoodFood » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:44 pm

Definitely don't want PI.

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dresden doll
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dresden doll » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:44 pm

GoodFood wrote:Definitely don't want PI.


That makes life easier, then. Either school will give you great access to NYC firms.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Bildungsroman » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:58 pm

$50k plus interest is nothing to sneeze at; that's several years of payments you don't have to make.

Plus, I think the weirdness angle is overblown. I can't speak to whether there are more or fewer weird people in total, but it doesn't matter because most people are still going to be normal, and like in any other situation in life you'll hang out with the people you want to. The people I usually see talking a lot about how weird UChi students are have either never been to UChi and are just parroting back things they've heard on TLS, or go to Northwestern.

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:11 pm

Chicago seems to be the slightly better choice here.

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Re: Chicago (100k in loans) vs. NYU (150k in loans)

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:50 pm

I voted NYU. Sounds like there's a good chance you'll be happier here. Don't forget that you'll incur expenses and a not insignificant amount of stress moving back and forth for your summers, visiting for holidays, etc. But this is definitely a tough call.

Job prospects for NYC firms are identical as far as any human being is able to discern and don't buy a bridge from anyone who tries to tell you different.

I might reframe the decision in the following way: say you were choosing between two jobs right now. As far as anyone can tell from a prospective position, the two jobs will open identical career options down the road. One pays $16,000 a year more, but you get a slightly weird vibe from the office, plus you are gonna have to relocate to a new city. The other pays $16,000 less, but you got a great feeling about it, and won't have to uproot your life to work there. What would you choose? I think this is a fair analogy and I think it also reframes the issues in a way that makes staying in NYC sound like a more valid decision.




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