Cornell vs. USC $$$

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tnasser
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Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby tnasser » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:53 pm

Accepted at USC with a guaranteed $108,000 scholarship ($36,000/year). Just got accepted to Cornell today, but no word on financial aid. I'm going to call and see if I have a chance at any money from them. (174 / 3.87)

I'm looking towards some kind of international law though. But the weather and beaches in L.A. sound nicer than the snow in Ithaca. Been living in Florida for most of my life.

Thoughts, suggestions, comments?

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jkpolk
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby jkpolk » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:55 pm

Reapply to Yale next cycle?

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flem
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby flem » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:56 pm

polkij333 wrote:Reapply to Yale next cycle?


lol

But seriously you should have some killer options with those numbers. You apply late?

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Doorkeeper » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:59 pm

If you have any interest in working in anything resembling "international law", reapply to HYS next cycle. You should get into one of them unless you have major issues with your application.

TLSwag
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby TLSwag » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:59 pm

tnasser wrote:Accepted at USC with a guaranteed $108,000 scholarship ($36,000/year). Just got accepted to Cornell today, but no word on financial aid. I'm going to call and see if I have a chance at any money from them. (174 / 3.87)

I'm looking towards some kind of international law though. But the weather and beaches in L.A. sound nicer than the snow in Ithaca. Been living in Florida for most of my life.

Thoughts, suggestions, comments?


So what about Harvard deterred you?

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Elston Gunn
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Elston Gunn » Mon Apr 16, 2012 5:00 pm

Reapply. If you have to go this year, USC.

tnasser
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby tnasser » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:14 pm

Not going to reapply. I got my apps in last week of February because of problems with LOR's. One recommender fell through, and it took a little over 4 weeks for my replacement LOR to get mailed from Luxembourg. Studied abroad and all that. So Rejected at Harvard and Berkeley, didn't apply to Yale, still waiting on Stanford and UCLA.

Hold at Columbia and Northwestern.

Waitlist at Chicago, Duke, Michigan, and Penn (didn't accept the Penn waitlist).

I know the late application hurt me quite a bit, but I don't have something productive to do for a year. I also don't think the entry level job placement that I could get from HYS is really worth a year out of the field.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby CanadianWolf » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:22 pm

With a 3.87/174, Cornell's Dean is likely to send a car to drive you to school each day where you should enjoy a hefty scholarship & a prepared gourmet lunch each day. The USC offer is also good, but you need to ask about transportation & the daily menu. :D

EdgarWinter
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby EdgarWinter » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:24 pm

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Last edited by EdgarWinter on Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kwais
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby kwais » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:32 pm

tnasser wrote:Not going to reapply. I got my apps in last week of February because of problems with LOR's. One recommender fell through, and it took a little over 4 weeks for my replacement LOR to get mailed from Luxembourg. Studied abroad and all that. So Rejected at Harvard and Berkeley, didn't apply to Yale, still waiting on Stanford and UCLA.

Hold at Columbia and Northwestern.

Waitlist at Chicago, Duke, Michigan, and Penn (didn't accept the Penn waitlist).

I know the late application hurt me quite a bit, but I don't have something productive to do for a year. I also don't think the entry level job placement that I could get from HYS is really worth a year out of the field.


This is short-sighted, incorrect and you will regret it. Oh and what "field" are you out of?

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top30man
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby top30man » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:33 pm

EdgarWinter wrote:Cornell should be paying for that 174. You should try to wring some money out of them. Send them the USC offer, and even if you aren't going to reapply, mention that you are considering doing just that (because people advise you that you might be competitive for sizable scholarships) when you email them your $$$-pleadings. It's a reasonably credible outside option.

You have t6 numbers. Easily. Even if you really want Cornell, you are the kind of person they give full rides too. You won't wait a year for 150 grand?
Eta: also full rides at better schools.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Doorkeeper » Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:06 pm

tnasser wrote:Not going to reapply. I got my apps in last week of February because of problems with LOR's. One recommender fell through, and it took a little over 4 weeks for my replacement LOR to get mailed from Luxembourg. Studied abroad and all that. So Rejected at Harvard and Berkeley, didn't apply to Yale, still waiting on Stanford and UCLA.

Hold at Columbia and Northwestern.

Waitlist at Chicago, Duke, Michigan, and Penn (didn't accept the Penn waitlist).

I know the late application hurt me quite a bit, but I don't have something productive to do for a year. I also don't think the entry level job placement that I could get from HYS is really worth a year out of the field.

You need to consider reapplying. Law schools don't care about you doing anything productive. Do whatever the fuck you want. Do not go to Cornell or USC when you could be going to Harvard or Columbia. It makes a very, very big difference.

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Elston Gunn
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Elston Gunn » Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:34 pm

Seriously, I've done far from prestigious work this year, and I'm going to Yale next year. With your GPA, you can find something to pay the bills, even if it's teaching the LSAT.

tnasser
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby tnasser » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:42 am

Elston Gunn wrote:Seriously, I've done far from prestigious work this year, and I'm going to Yale next year. With your GPA, you can find something to pay the bills, even if it's teaching the LSAT.


What was your situation like last cycle? I've got a six figure scholarship offer and an admission at a t14/ivy league guaranteed for August; seems like a lot to give up for a chance at better offers.

I know this website always leans towards waiting, but I agree with another poster on the subject. If a school really wanted you, it wouldn't matter when you sent your application in. Also, Cornell is 2nd in biglaw job placement for 2011, which is where the $160,000 starting salaries are. So it's feasible to pay off a large debt. It's not like HYS will offer a more lucrative starting position. And after I'm hired, isn't actual performance on the job going to make more of a difference that what school I graduated from a year ago?

kwais wrote:This is short-sighted, incorrect and you will regret it. Oh and what "field" are you out of?


I'm just finishing my BS in Finance. And you realize five years out of school work experience is going to matter much more than what school you came out of. Going to a T6 isn't a requirement for greatness, it just helps with the foot in the door. So I don't think it's short sighted at all, I'm looking at the big picture

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Dany
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Dany » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:45 am

Both of those options are bad considering your numbers, but if you're going to make a foolish decision, at least pick USC so you're not stuck at Cornell racking up crippling debt.

tnasser
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby tnasser » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:51 am

Oh, I should add my GPA would be a 3.83 if I reapplied next cycle. Makes enough difference for the .1 movement.

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flem
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby flem » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:21 am

tnasser wrote:
kwais wrote:This is short-sighted, incorrect and you will regret it. Oh and what "field" are you out of?


I'm just finishing my BS in Finance. And you realize five years out of school work experience is going to matter much more than what school you came out of. Going to a T6 isn't a requirement for greatness, it just helps with the foot in the door. So I don't think it's short sighted at all, I'm looking at the big picture


You're not looking at the big picture. You'll get more of an advantage starting out by going to a better school or going to a school in the Cornell/GTown range for free.

tnasser wrote:Oh, I should add my GPA would be a 3.83 if I reapplied next cycle. Makes enough difference for the .1 movement.


1) Why?
2) Even so, this doesn't matter in any conceivable significant way

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jkpolk
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby jkpolk » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:29 am

polkij333 wrote:Reapply to Yale next cycle?

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smokeylarue
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby smokeylarue » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:48 am

You are virtually in at HYS next year if you apply, yet you are seriously considering USC. Not sure if serious...

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Elston Gunn
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Elston Gunn » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:09 pm

tnasser wrote:What was your situation like last cycle? I've got a six figure scholarship offer and an admission at a t14/ivy league guaranteed for August; seems like a lot to give up for a chance at better offers.


You're right that you're in a better position than I was, because I hadn't applied yet. However, since non-YS law school admissions are remarkably predictable, it's misleading to think of yourself as "giving up" this offer when, barring some disaster, you are essentially guaranteed to get much better offers next year.

I know this website always leans towards waiting, but I agree with another poster on the subject. If a school really wanted you, it wouldn't matter when you sent your application in.


This is silly. Many schools had already almost filled their classes when you applied and/or gave out virtually all their scholarship money. Just use the example of Cornell, if that's where you want to go. They clearly liked you enough to admit you. But they usually give people with your numbers a lot of money, and you got nothing. What if they just didn't have any money left to give out? Does that not mean they didn't really want you?

Also, Cornell is 2nd in biglaw job placement for 2011, which is where the $160,000 starting salaries are. So it's feasible to pay off a large debt. It's not like HYS will offer a more lucrative starting position. And after I'm hired, isn't actual performance on the job going to make more of a difference that what school I graduated from a year ago?


I don't understand--are you completely ignoring the possibility of striking out? Cornell's a good biglaw school, but NLJ250 data is A) subject to a lot of random fluctuations, especially with a school as small as Cornell and B) doesn't include AIII clerkship placement (all of whom could have gotten biglaw). Your chances are going to be much lower of striking out from HYS or CCN.

But that's not really even the point. Unlike other posters, I certainly don't think you're a shoo-in at HYS (your GPA is low enough that you have to win them over). What your giving up is probably $100,000 at Cornell. Even assuming you get biglaw, 80% are gone by year 5. If you leave after a year or 2, you'll still have close to $200,000 in debt if you paid sticker, once you factor in interest. If you reapply it could be way way lower than that.

I'm just finishing my BS in Finance. And you realize five years out of school work experience is going to matter much more than what school you came out of. Going to a T6 isn't a requirement for greatness, it just helps with the foot in the door. So I don't think it's short sighted at all, I'm looking at the big picture


True that the schools aren't magical and work experience will matter more BUT WHY NOT SAVE $100,000 or more?

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby Tiago Splitter » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:19 pm

tnasser wrote:I'm just finishing my BS in Finance. And you realize five years out of school work experience is going to matter much more than what school you came out of. Going to a T6 isn't a requirement for greatness, it just helps with the foot in the door. So I don't think it's short sighted at all, I'm looking at the big picture


It's horribly short sighted.

At the very least you need to aggressively negotiate with Cornell for money. Paying sticker there with your numbers is insanity.

AffordablePrep
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Re: Cornell vs. USC $$$

Postby AffordablePrep » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:29 pm

Out of these 2 options as stated, USC no question. The big law numbers fluctuate year to year so it's short sighted to call Cornell the second best. At equal cost many people consider USC because the quality of life isai much better, and it will do more for you in so-cal. Cornell is better, but not by 108k.

However as others have stated your numbers can get better if you apply early. You'd probably get a full ride at UCLA so even if you're right about HYS (which you're not) waiting will likely gain you 50k. If you get a small job for even 30k it will be like making 80k total for a 9-5 job, which per hour is equal to big law pay without stress. You're not retaking. You can relax. Seems like a good deal....

Your present option of 108k at USC is a good deal. However your numbers can get better than just good.




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