William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

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W&M or ...?

W&M
10
31%
Retake and ED UVA
20
63%
Retake and try for GULC
2
6%
 
Total votes: 32

coocookuhchoo
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:14 pm

William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby coocookuhchoo » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:10 pm

I am 99.99% sure that I want to go to WM next year. I have a 3.25 and took the LSAT once, getting a 167. I have 12,000 a year to WM, and the stip is just a "C" average - very doable at a school that curves to a B+. Despite my relative certainty, I see retake/reapply recommended so often that I began to wonder if it actually might be the better choice.

I know I want to end up in DC. I've lived in the area my whole life, and I really couldn't see myself anywhere else. I am of the impression that, coming from WM, I probably need to be top 20% to do so. I figure with my GPA being pretty low, a higher LSAT may not do me a ton of good as far as reapplying. For reference, I got an interview at GULC but was promptly rejected thereafter.

Also, there don't seem to be a ton of better options for DC-area work. Obviously GULC and UVA do very well in DC, but even if I could get in with, say, a 170+, I doubt I would get any money, resulting in massive debt from either one. I also have very little interest in being at home another year (been here my whole life, including UG), and even less interest in cracking back open the Powerscore bibles.

So, my question is - despite all that I've said above, might it be wise to consider retake/reapply? Over the past few days I've seen a lot said about WM's "abysmal" job prospects, and I've seen a few people admitted there advised to retake. I want to make sure that I'm making the right choice. Thanks.

::edit::
I forgot to mention - I have no idea what kind of law I want to practice. I don't particularly want biglaw, nor do I want to make <$60,000/year, but it seems like there may not be an in between?

::double edit::
I thought I would add up here that with my scholarship and what my parents can pay, I will likely be taking on about $70,000 in debt
Last edited by coocookuhchoo on Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Nelson
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Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 12:43 am

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby Nelson » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:20 pm

Retake. Like most splitters you're probably better off at a T14 at sticker than at lower ranked schools with the small scholarships you will get. Since your goal is DC this is especially true.

coocookuhchoo
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Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby coocookuhchoo » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:24 pm

Nelson wrote:Retake. Like most splitters you're probably better off at a T14 at sticker than at lower ranked schools with the small scholarships you will get. Since your goal is DC this is especially true.


Can you explain the reasoning there? Do you mean that since I did poorly UG I'll probably do poorly in LS, and thus will be better off at a school where I don't need to be top 20%?

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bk1
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby bk1 » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:26 pm

coocookuhchoo wrote:I forgot to mention - I have no idea what kind of law I want to practice. I don't particularly want biglaw, nor do I want to make <$60,000/year, but it seems like there may not be an in between?


UVA/GULC will give you more options. Worst case scenario you can fall back on 20 year IBR. You will have a shot at biglaw if you decide salary is important. You will have a better shot at public interest if you want that and can be debt-free in 10 years via PSLF/LRAP. A higher LSAT (170+) will help you get into splitter-friendly T14's (GULC/UVA included).

There's a lot of risk either way. W&M will limit your career options (which is especially a problem if you aren't entirely sure what you want to do). On the other hand 250k+ debt is quite insane.

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Nelson
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby Nelson » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:30 pm

coocookuhchoo wrote:
Nelson wrote:Retake. Like most splitters you're probably better off at a T14 at sticker than at lower ranked schools with the small scholarships you will get. Since your goal is DC this is especially true.


Can you explain the reasoning there? Do you mean that since I did poorly UG I'll probably do poorly in LS, and thus will be better off at a school where I don't need to be top 20%?

No, nothing like that. People with high GPAs are in better positions to get full rides or close to it at strong regional schools. This mitigates risk. Splitters are usually better off aiming high so they have a better shot at a biglaw job.

What is the total cost of attendance for WM?

coocookuhchoo
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby coocookuhchoo » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:33 pm

It may be worth adding that I have pretty good connections in the DC area. I wouldn't say they are guaranteed-job connections, but I am definitely better off than someone coming from out of town.

coocookuhchoo
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby coocookuhchoo » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:34 pm

Nelson wrote:
What is the total cost of attendance for WM?


Relying on WM's estimates, total cost for 3 years for me is 120,000. I can expect my parents to pay roughly 50 of that, so about 70 to me.

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Nelson
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby Nelson » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:39 pm

That's not too much debt. I would still retake but it depends on your willingness to work at a small or medium firm in VA if you don't end up at the top of your class.

crit_racer
Posts: 756
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:15 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby crit_racer » Sun Apr 08, 2012 10:11 pm

I know you said you are from DC, but does that mean VA? If you have VA residency, then you should absolutely retake. I would guess that in state + ED with a 170+ would be a lock for UVA, even w/ your GPA. If that doesn't work, you can turn around and ED to GULC.

coocookuhchoo
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby coocookuhchoo » Sun Apr 08, 2012 10:16 pm

crit_racer wrote:I know you said you are from DC, but does that mean VA? If you have VA residency, then you should absolutely retake. I would guess that in state + ED with a 170+ would be a lock for UVA, even w/ your GPA. If that doesn't work, you can turn around and ED to GULC.


Nope, I'm from MD. At this point I'm having a hard time even fathoming what it would mean to take next year off to retake. I've put so much effort into the whole application process up to now that I really just want to get started. I think in all likelihood I'll be at W&M next year, knowing that I'm going to need to work my ass off to get where I want to be.

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romothesavior
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby romothesavior » Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:10 am

Retake and ED to UVA. WM is not worth that cost.

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acrossthelake
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby acrossthelake » Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:17 am

coocookuhchoo wrote:It may be worth adding that I have pretty good connections in the DC area. I wouldn't say they are guaranteed-job connections, but I am definitely better off than someone coming from out of town.


DC is basically the most competitive market there is. Harvard''s OCS, which is hopelessly optimistic, even cautions most of us from bidding there and I've seen posters on here talk about doing really well in NYC and absolutely abysmal in D.C.

I don't really know what you'd have to be at W&M, but I assume fairly high, if you make that comparison.

rad lulz
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Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby rad lulz » Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:55 am

70k at W&M isn't a terrible risk, but if you're dead set on DC, you need to retake and reapply. It's gonna suck for you though because like other people said, a 3.25 is gonna put you out of the running for $ at a lot of places.

anan
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:59 pm

Re: William and Mary-bound 0L considering retake/reapply

Postby anan » Mon Apr 09, 2012 2:27 pm

Similar numbers, I went for it. Dont regret it, jobs in DC are there if you want them from what Ive seen...




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