Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Cornell or Texas

Cornell $120k scholly
22
35%
Texas free plus $5000 in grants over the 3 years.
40
65%
 
Total votes: 62

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Angrygeopolitically
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Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 3:51 pm

I'm kinda frugal. I want a good job. I don't care where I live in toto.
So hard.... :cry:

I would like financial freedom with in a couple of years of graduation.
I'm in my late twenties so I don't want to be paying back loans for ten years.
Note- Tuition at Cornell is 55k. I am from Texas. I have about $30k debt from undergrad.
Please give reasons and don't just vote.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Doorkeeper » Fri Apr 06, 2012 3:55 pm

Texas and NYC are very different places. You should have an opinion where you want to live after law school. Choose accordingly.

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splitbrain
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby splitbrain » Fri Apr 06, 2012 3:57 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:I'm kinda frugal. I want a good job. I don't care where I live in toto.
So hard.... :cry:

I would like financial freedom with in a couple of years of graduation.
I'm in my late twenties so I don't want to be paying back loans for ten years.
Note- Tuition at Cornell is 55k. I am from Texas. I have about $30k debt from undergrad.
Please give reasons and don't just vote.

It is for these reasons that I picked Texas.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:00 pm

Let me add to this. I would like a liberal atmosphere. If anyone has some generalizations for the student body at the two schools they are welcome. I know Austin is liberal but what about the law school? Cornell? I wouldn't mind living in NYC or Houston afterwards. I don't mean to sound closed minded, I would just like a change. Austin is definitely a change but I don't know what Ithaca is like. Visiting is not an option for me right now.

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Samara
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Samara » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:01 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:Let me add to this. I would like a liberal atmosphere. If anyone has some generalizations for the student body at the two schools they are welcome. I know Austin is liberal but what about the law school? Cornell? I wouldn't mind living in NYC or Houston afterwards. I don't mean to sound closed minded, I would just like a change. Austin is definitely a change but I don't know what Ithaca is like. Visiting is not an option for me right now.

By all accounts, Austin is a terrific city. Sounds like UT is right for you.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:03 pm

splitbrain wrote:
Angrygeopolitically wrote:I'm kinda frugal. I want a good job. I don't care where I live in toto.
So hard.... :cry:

I would like financial freedom with in a couple of years of graduation.
I'm in my late twenties so I don't want to be paying back loans for ten years.
Note- Tuition at Cornell is 55k. I am from Texas. I have about $30k debt from undergrad.
Please give reasons and don't just vote.

It is for these reasons that I picked Texas.


But wouldn't Cornell give me a better shot at BigLaw?
And wouldn't being from Texas but going to a school that is ranked better than the Texas schools make me mildly unique if i'm looking at firms in Texas?

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Mr. Somebody
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Mr. Somebody » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:04 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:I'm kinda frugal. I want a good job. I don't care where I live in toto.
So hard.... :cry:

I would like financial freedom with in a couple of years of graduation.
I'm in my late twenties so I don't want to be paying back loans for ten years.
Note- Tuition at Cornell is 55k. I am from Texas. I have about $30k debt from undergrad.
Please give reasons and don't just vote.


What does good job mean to you?

woeisme
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby woeisme » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:12 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:
splitbrain wrote:
Angrygeopolitically wrote:I'm kinda frugal. I want a good job. I don't care where I live in toto.
So hard.... :cry:

I would like financial freedom with in a couple of years of graduation.
I'm in my late twenties so I don't want to be paying back loans for ten years.
Note- Tuition at Cornell is 55k. I am from Texas. I have about $30k debt from undergrad.
Please give reasons and don't just vote.

It is for these reasons that I picked Texas.


But wouldn't Cornell give me a better shot at BigLaw?
And wouldn't being from Texas but going to a school that is ranked better than the Texas schools make me mildly unique if i'm looking at firms in Texas?


Cornell grad here. And yes, I think so. There were a number of Texans my year and they all had a lot of success with the job hunt. Most of them are in Houston biglaw.

As for the two locations, they're prolly both pretty liberal. I know Ithaca is anyway. People love Austin too though.

I think if you do UT, you'll largely be limited it to Texas employment since you don't have out of state ties. Cornell will get you back to Texas, but opens more doors geographically speaking.

If it were me, I'd choose Cornell for the increased exit opportunities.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:13 pm

I'm not sure UT is right. My thoughts:

1. You have 30k undergrad debt. Even if interest doesn't accrue on this while in law school, you're going to be 75k in hole once you add that to your UT debt. If you end up in worst case scenario (30-60k salary at a small firm) you're still looking at almost a decade of loan repayments at 10k/year.

2. At Cornell if you add undergrad debt to law school debt you're at 150k when you graduate (assuming little to no accrual of interest on undergrad debt). This would be probably closer to something like 15ish years of to repay in the aforementioned worst case scenario.

Looking at it that way, I think that in any worst case scenario you are going to be in debt for a long time whether you choose UT or Cornell. Financial freedom at either school is going to require getting a large firm salary. With biglaw you could pay back your Cornell debt in 3-4 years, with UT you could do it in 2-3. I don't think your goal of not being indebted for another 10 years is significantly more achievable from UT. I really think you should choose Cornell if you want NYC and UT if you want TX. There are virtues to UT outside of location including being debt-free sooner in a worst case scenario, but worst case scenario is more likely from UT and the worst case scenario from UT still leaves you indebted for quite a while.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:20 pm

Good job = mild security and at least six figures. Work load does not come into play as long as I have the option to leave after about 5 years with something to show for it, not just breaking off even.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:32 pm

bk1 wrote:I'm not sure UT is right. My thoughts:

1. You have 30k undergrad debt. Even if interest doesn't accrue on this while in law school, you're going to be 75k in hole once you add that to your UT debt. If you end up in worst case scenario (30-60k salary at a small firm) you're still looking at almost a decade of loan repayments at 10k/year.

2. At Cornell if you add undergrad debt to law school debt you're at 150k when you graduate (assuming little to no accrual of interest on undergrad debt). This would be probably closer to something like 15ish years of to repay in the aforementioned worst case scenario.

Looking at it that way, I think that in any worst case scenario you are going to be in debt for a long time whether you choose UT or Cornell. Financial freedom at either school is going to require getting a large firm salary. With biglaw you could pay back your Cornell debt in 3-4 years, with UT you could do it in 2-3. I don't think your goal of not being indebted for another 10 years is significantly more achievable from UT. I really think you should choose Cornell if you want NYC and UT if you want TX. There are virtues to UT outside of location including being debt-free sooner in a worst case scenario, but worst case scenario is more likely from UT and the worst case scenario from UT still leaves you indebted for quite a while.


Currently I make about 80k part time and I can always go back to this. So I would be able to do this in combination with a less demanding government job if I miss/hate biglaw.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:39 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:Currently I make about 80k part time and I can always go back to this. So I would be able to do this in combination with a less demanding government job if I miss/hate biglaw.


I'm confused.

1. You want financial freedom. If so then I don't understand why you're ditching an 80k PT job. Even if you were dead set on law school I'd probably just keep at the current job until you have enough saved that you won't have any debt post-law school. That's assuming that financial freedom is of the utmost import to you.

2. If financial freedom isn't paramount then you should pick between your location preference and whether you want a better shot at biglaw. If you want NYC and you want biglaw, this is Cornell hands down.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:46 pm

bk1 wrote:
Angrygeopolitically wrote:Currently I make about 80k part time and I can always go back to this. So I would be able to do this in combination with a less demanding government job if I miss/hate biglaw.


I'm confused.

1. You want financial freedom. If so then I don't understand why you're ditching an 80k PT job. Even if you were dead set on law school I'd probably just keep at the current job until you have enough saved that you won't have any debt post-law school. That's assuming that financial freedom is of the utmost import to you.

2. If financial freedom isn't paramount then you should pick between your location preference and whether you want a better shot at biglaw. If you want NYC and you want biglaw, this is Cornell hands down.



It is not something I want to make a career out of. But it is something that I will always be able to supplement my income with. And I am already in my late twenties so I would like to be on a career path soon. I would like a little more structure.

I brought the info up because I thought it would mitigate the worst case scenarios.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:51 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:I brought the info up because I thought it would mitigate the worst case scenarios.


Fair enough. I think if you want biglaw or NYC: Cornell. If you want TX or less debt: UT.

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Angrygeopolitically
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Angrygeopolitically » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:36 pm

Through intense introspection, I think I have figured out my issue. :) I don't want to spend the rest of my life in Texas but I want to work in Texas..... I dont really want to work in NYC but i think it would be fun to live in Ithaca and then come back to Texas.

Also, I would give my left arm to get a biglaw job in Austin. Which school would give me a better shot at that in your opinion?

So, number one priority- Big law in Austin.

2. If it is likely that I will have to go to Houston, I would like a break from Texas first.
3. NYC
4. Avoid Dallas at all costs.
Last edited by Angrygeopolitically on Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:38 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:Through intense introspection, I think I have figured out my issue. I don't want to spend the rest of my life in Texas but I want to work in Texas..... I dont really want to work in NYC but i think it would be fun to live in Ithaca and then come back to Texas.


Solution: go to UT, work in TX, take vacations outside of TX.

Angrygeopolitically wrote:Also, I would give my left arm to get a biglaw job in Austin. Which school would give me a better shot at that in your opinion?


UT, but it's highly unlikely due to very few biglaw jerbs in Austin so it really shouldn't be a factor.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:01 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:Through intense introspection, I think I have figured out my issue. :) I don't want to spend the rest of my life in Texas but I want to work in Texas..... I dont really want to work in NYC but i think it would be fun to live in Ithaca and then come back to Texas.

Also, I would give my left arm to get a biglaw job in Austin. Which school would give me a better shot at that in your opinion?

So, number one priority- Big law in Austin.

2. If it is likely that I will have to go to Houston, I would like a break from Texas first.
3. NYC
4. Avoid Dallas at all costs.


You aren't from Austin already are you? UT gives you an pretty big advantage over Cornell for Austin if you're from Austin, and if you aren't from Austin it will give you huge advantage.

That said, I'm not sure making this decision on the idea of working in Austin is a good way to do it. Your chances of landing biglaw in Austin are pretty small. If you aren't from Austin, UT might give you a shot at Austin (while with Cornell, you won't have much of a chance), but it's still a long-shot.

If you are fine with gunning for Austin and settling for Houston, then UT makes the most sense.
If you want NYC (or elsewhere besides Texas), then Cornell.

If your goal is to get biglaw and get rid of all debt as fast as possible, I think UT is the right choice. There's a bigger risk that you might miss out on biglaw than if you were at cornell, but I think the lower debt + CoL in Texas makes UT a significantly better "best case scenario." (That is, unless you hate the idea of living in Houston.)

Living in Austin is like taking a break from the rest of Texas. The school is a mix of liberal and conservative (and people who don't care). Hard to say which group is dominate. Since it's a big school, you can choose who you want to be around. I'm politically apathetic, but I think the majority of my friends are more liberal.

Also, Austin>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ithaca.

Missteriouss
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Missteriouss » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:03 pm

.
Last edited by Missteriouss on Sat Apr 07, 2012 4:07 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:06 pm

Angrygeopolitically wrote:So, number one priority- Big law in Austin.

2. If it is likely that I will have to go to Houston, I would like a break from Texas first.
3. NYC
4. Avoid Dallas at all costs.


I agree with Richie, you should probably ignore Austin biglaw when making a decision. If you prefer NYC to Houston/DFW then I think the answer is Cornell.

imbored25
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby imbored25 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:08 pm

texas bro

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:21 pm

bk1 wrote:
Angrygeopolitically wrote:So, number one priority- Big law in Austin.

2. If it is likely that I will have to go to Houston, I would like a break from Texas first.
3. NYC
4. Avoid Dallas at all costs.


I agree with Richie, you should probably ignore Austin biglaw when making a decision. If you prefer NYC to Houston/DFW then I think the answer is Cornell.


I didn't necessarily mean ignore the possibility of Austin biglaw. I just think it should play a minor role in affecting her overall decision. Example: Say if someone's dream job is academia. That could be a factor when choosing between Columbia and GULC, but it really shouldn't be the main factor.

ETA: Austin biglaw jobs aren't by any means unicorns. They exist. But it takes a unique combination of traits to be competitive for them. Typically the two biggest ones are: 1) good grades and 2) a very transparent desire to not work in a big city and work on huge cases. I think austin firms look for lifestyle people, because that is the biggest sell for working in Austin since the legal market is nowhere near the size of Houston or Dallas.
Last edited by Richie Tenenbaum on Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:25 pm

Texas.

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bk1
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby bk1 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:25 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:I didn't necessarily mean ignore the possibility of Austin biglaw. I just think it should play a minor role in affecting her overall decision. Example: Say if someone's dream job is academia. That could be a factor when choosing between Columbia and GULC, but it really shouldn't be the main factor.


Fair enough, though I disagree with you. I think that Austin biglaw should be a nonfactor here. I also think academia should be a nonfactor between CLS/GULC.

I'm also done answering OP's question when their location preferences seem to change every 5 seconds.

Renzo
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby Renzo » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:29 pm

You cannot possibly be indifferent between NYC and Texas. It's not possible. Figure out where you want to live.

woeisme
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Re: Help.. Again.. Please.. Cornell with $120k or Texas free

Postby woeisme » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:36 pm

Renzo wrote:You cannot possibly be indifferent between NYC and Texas. It's not possible. Figure out where you want to live.


And if you can't, pick Cornell since you can still get Texas from Cornell (particularly with ties), but will likely be stuck in Texas with UT (especially given a lack of other ties)




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