Choosing among T-25s

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

What's the best choice considering COA and jerb prospects?

-USC at sticker (waiting to hear about scholarships)
6
50%
-Loyola Full tuition and fees scholarship
0
No votes
-BU with 22k scholarship
1
8%
-BC with 25k scholarship
2
17%
-Notre Dame with 10k scholarship
3
25%
-UW Madison with in-state and some scholarship money
0
No votes
-WUSTL with 20k scholarship
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 12

fo sho
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:09 am

Choosing among T-25s

Postby fo sho » Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:08 pm

Ok I'm no special snow flake but I'm having a dilemma that I'm hoping TLS can help me out with. I know ultimately you should go where you want to practice, but I have three regions that I can see myself working in:

Southern California- Went to undergrad here, this is where all of my friends live and I feel like I have a good chance of networking here.

Midwest- This is where I am from and where the majority of my work experience on my resume took place. A lot of family, including some in law, here.

Boston- I have never lived in Boston, but I do have a sibling living in the area which counts for something I suppose.

Given this, it seems LA or the Midwest are my best choices, but now it depends on the schools I have been accepted at. I want to weigh the tuition/cost of living with what prospects I'd have if graduating at median from these schools.

USC- Hasn't sent out scholarship notices, but I imagine it would be at sticker or with small scholarship money
Loyola- Full scholarship and some fees (stipulations have been relaxed to around 50th percentile)
WUSTL- 20k in scholarships per year.
UW-Madison- In-state tuition and some money.
Notre Dame- 10k per year but I would hope I could raise that if I were more serious about going there
BC- 25k per year
BU- 22k per year

So the dilemma is that I would like to work and live in LA, but USC at sticker is seen by many as a bad investment. My big question here is what kind of employment someone at median from USC can find. The Loyola scholarship is nice, and I'd hope if I lost the scholarship I'd have the sense to drop out anyways, but wondering about what could have been if I had chosen USC over Loyola would be hanging over my head if I did that. Then we have relatively low COA's with the BC/BU scholarships, and UW scholarship+in state, but diminishing job prospects from USC.

So TLS, help a brutha out and tell me what you think please...
Last edited by fo sho on Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
dingbat
Posts: 4976
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:12 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby dingbat » Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:41 pm

What do you plan to do when you graduate?

User avatar
Green Glass Windows
Posts: 743
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 3:37 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby Green Glass Windows » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:03 am

Wow, your situation is extremely similar to mine. Tagging.

User avatar
TLS_noobie
Posts: 205
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 6:17 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby TLS_noobie » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:10 am

Bump - this thread is relevant to my interests.

jarofsoup
Posts: 1952
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:41 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby jarofsoup » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:22 am

Go to USC over Loyola even if full ride. Being in a T2 does not compare.

You'll pay for it after graduation.


*I got to a socal T2. No bueno rank does matter. Pick between the top 20's don't dip down that low.

fo sho
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:09 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby fo sho » Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:33 am

dingbat wrote:What do you plan to do when you graduate?


Well I have some experience of working in a small personal injury firm, and I don't think that is the direction I want to go. My work experience is heavy on teaching, but I don't think that will factor into a law career. I would like to focus on corporate law or employment-related law, if I had to guess now as a 0L knowing that will maybe change in the future.

Factoring coa and future prospects, it seems to me like UW and USC have the best balances. Am I wrong in assuming that USC gives me the best margin for having the chance to choose a direction in law on my own terms (relatively)?

User avatar
dingbat
Posts: 4976
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:12 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby dingbat » Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:43 am

fo sho wrote:
dingbat wrote:What do you plan to do when you graduate?


Well I have some experience of working in a small personal injury firm, and I don't think that is the direction I want to go. My work experience is heavy on teaching, but I don't think that will factor into a law career. I would like to focus on corporate law or employment-related law, if I had to guess now as a 0L knowing that will maybe change in the future.

Factoring coa and future prospects, it seems to me like UW and USC have the best balances. Am I wrong in assuming that USC gives me the best margin for having the chance to choose a direction in law on my own terms (relatively)?


Let's start by saying that you don't really seem to know what you want to do with your law degree, which makes paying sticker anywhere a bad idea (generally, if your goals don't involve biglaw, you should not pay sticker)

USC will give you the most options, but at the greatest cost, While BU/BC and WUSTL are the most logical choices in terms of having a lot of (local) options and not costing an arm and a leg, if location is taken out of the equation - those three have very good employment prospects

WUSTL seems like a bad idea as you have no ties to the area, nor a desire to end up there
A lot of people dislike Boston, so if you never lived there, you should go and visit before committing to BU/BC
Wisconsin and Notre Dame are good schools and if you want to end up in those parts of the country are perfectly fine options, especially if you keep the total cost relatively low.

The question is, how badly do you want to be in SoCal?
USC at sticker is a risk, but, so is Loyola with a stip. Before accepting either, you should have a much clearer idea of what you want to do with your law degree (examples: if you want biglaw, go USC; if you want to set up shop advising public school teachers on employment issues, go to Loyola)

If you have no idea what you want to do with your law degree, you should always consider cost the most important factor (but not the only factor; for an extreme example, yale at sticker is better than Cooley with a full ride and living expenses stipend)

User avatar
sunynp
Posts: 1899
Joined: Tue May 24, 2011 2:06 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby sunynp » Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:08 am

You know we need your numbers. At least rule out loyola. It is difficult to advise you, but I strongly suggest staying where you have friends. I don't think USC is generally thought to be worth sticker.

User avatar
Doorkeeper
Posts: 4872
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:25 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby Doorkeeper » Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:53 am

USC- Do you want to live/work in LA?
Loyola- No.
WUSTL- Do you want to live/work in St. Louis?
UW-Madison- Do you want to live/work in Wisconsin?
Notre Dame- Do you want to live/work in Indiana?
BC/BU- Do you want to live/work in Boston?

If all of your preferences to the above questions are equal, then I would go USC if they give you some money. If not, then maybe BU/BC pending you visiting the campus and Boston to see if you like the area. Is UCLA in the mix?

User avatar
aekea
Posts: 236
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:10 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby aekea » Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:34 pm

dingbat wrote:WUSTL seems like a bad idea as you have no ties to the area, nor a desire to end up there


OP said that he's from the midwest, did most of his resume work there and has family, including family in law, there. I think these are pretty solid ties. If you don't want to work in the midwest, OP, then obviously WUSTL is not ideal, but you seem at least somewhat flexible and I think it's a better choice than Loyola or USC at sticker.

wfudeacons2005
Posts: 150
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 2:08 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby wfudeacons2005 » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:07 pm

Don't mean to hijack the thread but I've just always wondered about ND. All things considered, it probably has one of, if not the most, broad and proud alumni network in the country. Great reputation, and it isn't like it's law school is a toilet by any means. I've just always been surprised at how regional/state level people on here view its placement. Again, don't mean to challenge that assertion at all...it just really surprises me.

As to the OP, I don't have a ton of insight into those options at all but UW-Madison with in-state tuition+money and ties (plus the fact you don't have to take the bar in Wisconsin) would be pretty tough for me to turn down. Also, in reading other threads, it seems that if you do well at UW-Madison, the degree does have some mobility.

User avatar
dingbat
Posts: 4976
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:12 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby dingbat » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:11 pm

aekea wrote:
dingbat wrote:WUSTL seems like a bad idea as you have no ties to the area, nor a desire to end up there


OP said that he's from the midwest, did most of his resume work there and has family, including family in law, there. I think these are pretty solid ties. If you don't want to work in the midwest, OP, then obviously WUSTL is not ideal, but you seem at least somewhat flexible and I think it's a better choice than Loyola or USC at sticker.

Oops- had a brain fart thinking Missouri was The South, enen though I know better.
Mea Culpa

dissonance1848
Posts: 706
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:42 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby dissonance1848 » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:12 pm

Loyola is out.
ND is out, 10K/yr. ain't worth it.
You are from or living in Wisconsin (in-state tuition), but Wisconsin ain't strong enough. Out.

USC too much of a risk, given at sticker. Out.

WUSTL is doable because you've got ties to Wisconsin, can explain loving the Midwest.

No idea about how paternal Boston is with regard to ties. If it does not care much about ties (i.e NYC), then either one may be better than WUSTL.

User avatar
StarLightSpectre
Posts: 339
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:32 pm

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby StarLightSpectre » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:16 pm

In a similar situation as me. Deciding whether schools just outside the t14 are worth the debt is difficult to say the least. Good luck on deciding, I know this isn't really advice but you have my emotional cyber support.... and my ax.

Also: create a poll

fo sho
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:09 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby fo sho » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:19 pm

wfudeacons2005 wrote:As to the OP, I don't have a ton of insight into those options at all but UW-Madison with in-state tuition+money and ties (plus the fact you don't have to take the bar in Wisconsin) would be pretty tough for me to turn down. Also, in reading other threads, it seems that if you do well at UW-Madison, the degree does have some mobility.


I'd like to hear from UW people about the school but there don't seem to be many on TLS. Considering state budgeting issues, political turmoil, and a small legal market, these are some pretty heady times for Wisconsin, and I'm not convinced that going to law school in the middle of it is prudent.

When people say USC is a risk at sticker, is that because somebody at median or lower will likely be making 30/40/50k after school in a legal job, or because they'll be making coffees in the morning and stripping by night in non-legal jobs?

fo sho
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:09 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby fo sho » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:20 pm

Thanks for the input too everybody, I appreciate it.

User avatar
thexfactor
Posts: 1277
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:40 am

Re: Choosing among T-25s

Postby thexfactor » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:33 pm

fo sho wrote:
wfudeacons2005 wrote:As to the OP, I don't have a ton of insight into those options at all but UW-Madison with in-state tuition+money and ties (plus the fact you don't have to take the bar in Wisconsin) would be pretty tough for me to turn down. Also, in reading other threads, it seems that if you do well at UW-Madison, the degree does have some mobility.


I'd like to hear from UW people about the school but there don't seem to be many on TLS. Considering state budgeting issues, political turmoil, and a small legal market, these are some pretty heady times for Wisconsin, and I'm not convinced that going to law school in the middle of it is prudent.

When people say USC is a risk at sticker, is that because somebody at median or lower will likely be making 30/40/50k after school in a legal job, or because they'll be making coffees in the morning and stripping by night in non-legal jobs?


USC outplaces WUSTL by almost 2x. Since you have ties to the midwest, USC can help you open doors on the west coast. WUSTL doesn't do that. USC sticker is risky, but it isn't the worst gamble in the world, especially if you are only getting 60k from wustl.
Wisc places less than 10% in nlj250 firms.

Check this out:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1




Return to “Choosing a Law School”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bcreid03, ponderingmeerkat, townizm and 7 guests