$$$ vs. ranking

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )
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izy223
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby izy223 » Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:01 pm

I have a 30k a year scholarship to gerogetown vs NYU sticker (at least for now). I want biglaw- money isnt a huge issue- what do i do?

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JustE
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby JustE » Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:00 pm

izy223 wrote:I have a 30k a year scholarship to gerogetown vs NYU sticker (at least for now). I want biglaw- money isnt a huge issue- what do i do?

"Money ain't a thang" as in you have the cash saved to pay for it or "Money ain't a thang" as in you don't mind loans?

Either way, this sounds like you should visit and decide which one you like. NYU has much better big law stats, so unless you want to be in DC, this seems like a no-brainer.

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Gail
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby Gail » Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:42 am

I've been trolling law school tuition rates for the top 14 and scholarship amounts on LSN.


Maybe it's me, but I'd be throwing up daily if I were mortgaging 70k (tuition+COA) a year for the honor of a 50% chance at 2000-3000 billable hour prison and no other reasonable option besides that.

Different strokes. But dear God. How can Michigan justify 50k in tuition a year?

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skers
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby skers » Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:50 am

Gail wrote:I've been trolling law school tuition rates for the top 14 and scholarship amounts on LSN.


Maybe it's me, but I'd be throwing up daily if I were mortgaging 70k (tuition+COA) a year for the honor of a 50% chance at 2000-3000 billable hour prison and no other reasonable option besides that.

Different strokes. But dear God. How can Michigan justify 50k in tuition a year?


Odds of people out of t13 grabbing big law are much higher than 50% ad things like government, a3 clerkships leading to various opportunities, and prestigious PI are solid alternatives. The debt definitely isn't worth it to everyone, but there are reasons to take the plunge.

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Gail
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby Gail » Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:53 am

TemporarySaint wrote:
Gail wrote:I've been trolling law school tuition rates for the top 14 and scholarship amounts on LSN.


Maybe it's me, but I'd be throwing up daily if I were mortgaging 70k (tuition+COA) a year for the honor of a 50% chance at 2000-3000 billable hour prison and no other reasonable option besides that.

Different strokes. But dear God. How can Michigan justify 50k in tuition a year?


Odds of people out of t13 grabbing big law are much higher than 50% ad things like government, a3 clerkships leading to various opportunities, and prestigious PI are solid alternatives. The debt definitely isn't worth it to everyone, but there are reasons to take the plunge.


Maybe... I would be sick.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby TaipeiMort » Tue Mar 06, 2012 2:59 am

Gail wrote:
TemporarySaint wrote:
Gail wrote:I've been trolling law school tuition rates for the top 14 and scholarship amounts on LSN.


Maybe it's me, but I'd be throwing up daily if I were mortgaging 70k (tuition+COA) a year for the honor of a 50% chance at 2000-3000 billable hour prison and no other reasonable option besides that.

Different strokes. But dear God. How can Michigan justify 50k in tuition a year?


Odds of people out of t13 grabbing big law are much higher than 50% ad things like government, a3 clerkships leading to various opportunities, and prestigious PI are solid alternatives. The debt definitely isn't worth it to everyone, but there are reasons to take the plunge.


Maybe... I would be sick.


Unless you like what you do. I mean, deals work as an associate isn't good for most. However, too many assume that Biglaw is only 100-person project M&A.

Business (ie VC/start-up/PE) is awesome and rewarding. Non-deals tax is basically problem solving all day. BigLit is interesting, but I agree is really taxing-- billing 2800 hours at Quinn is not for some people. Boutique work conveys the benefits of BigLit ($$$, stimulating work) and avoids the drawbacks like lacking autonomy and billing 1,000,000 hours. Other specialized areas like compensation, HR, and real estate are great fields if you can break in. Some Midlaw (see Phoenix) pays 115k and requires 55 hours of work per week.

So, not all "Biglaw" sucks. However, many law students don't understand the distinction between these areas and end up somewhere they don't like.

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Gail
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby Gail » Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:22 pm

TaipeiMort wrote:
Gail wrote:
TemporarySaint wrote:
Gail wrote:I've been trolling law school tuition rates for the top 14 and scholarship amounts on LSN.


Maybe it's me, but I'd be throwing up daily if I were mortgaging 70k (tuition+COA) a year for the honor of a 50% chance at 2000-3000 billable hour prison and no other reasonable option besides that.

Different strokes. But dear God. How can Michigan justify 50k in tuition a year?


Odds of people out of t13 grabbing big law are much higher than 50% ad things like government, a3 clerkships leading to various opportunities, and prestigious PI are solid alternatives. The debt definitely isn't worth it to everyone, but there are reasons to take the plunge.


Maybe... I would be sick.


Unless you like what you do. I mean, deals work as an associate isn't good for most. However, too many assume that Biglaw is only 100-person project M&A.

Business (ie VC/start-up/PE) is awesome and rewarding. Non-deals tax is basically problem solving all day. BigLit is interesting, but I agree is really taxing-- billing 2800 hours at Quinn is not for some people. Boutique work conveys the benefits of BigLit ($$$, stimulating work) and avoids the drawbacks like lacking autonomy and billing 1,000,000 hours. Other specialized areas like compensation, HR, and real estate are great fields if you can break in. Some Midlaw (see Phoenix) pays 115k and requires 55 hours of work per week.

So, not all "Biglaw" sucks. However, many law students don't understand the distinction between these areas and end up somewhere they don't like.



I guess. But honestly... I'm looking at LSN right now, and it puzzles me. The t14 seem really, really stingy. I guess they an afford to be really picky, but I can't imagine having the weight of 200k in loans on my chest. For those 10% that don't get biglaw/pi/government, I can't think of a very good alternative option.


LRAP and IBR aren't good alternative options.

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skers
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby skers » Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:01 pm

Yeah, there are probably 10% fucked, but that percentage is much higher at lower schools. 100k Debt on a shitlaw salary isn't very desirable either.

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hung jury
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby hung jury » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:51 am

Gail wrote:

I guess. But honestly... I'm looking at LSN right now, and it puzzles me. The t14 seem really, really stingy. I guess they an afford to be really picky, but I can't imagine having the weight of 200k in loans on my chest. For those 10% that don't get biglaw/pi/government, I can't think of a very good alternative option.


LRAP and IBR aren't good alternative options.


A lot of people don't put their financial aid offers on LSN or they withdraw before they get their aid. If your numbers are good enough you'll get good aid. Though I agree sticker is a helluva wager, especially if you're looking at some of the "t14" schools with more suspect placement records.

semitranslucent
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby semitranslucent » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:07 pm

OK, so I'm still waiting on packages but the big decision right now is NYU v UCLA. I'm guessing I'll be able to get decent $ from UCLA (if not initially then by leveraging NYU). I'm born, raised and UG in NY and want to be able to work in NY biglaw or high-end boutique, but was hoping for CA weather/change of pace for the three years of law school.

Obv would have to wait for the packages to shake out but do you guys think UCLA would even be an option? What would it take to make it back to NY? And what would it take to get you to go to UCLA?

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TaipeiMort
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby TaipeiMort » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:16 pm

semitranslucent wrote:OK, so I'm still waiting on packages but the big decision right now is NYU v UCLA. I'm guessing I'll be able to get decent $ from UCLA (if not initially then by leveraging NYU). I'm born, raised and UG in NY and want to be able to work in NY biglaw or high-end boutique, but was hoping for CA weather/change of pace for the three years of law school.

Obv would have to wait for the packages to shake out but do you guys think UCLA would even be an option? What would it take to make it back to NY? And what would it take to get you to go to UCLA?


Nothing. UCLA is great in California, but NYU is NYC's regional school, and one of the best schools in the country. Being from NY makes you a lock for a job with an okay GPA. Because law school grading is less predictable, you should assume that you are going to end up at or below median. In this scenario, you would be in huge trouble at UCLA and you would still have a good shot at NYC biglaw, and a great shot at NY midmarkets.

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traehekat
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby traehekat » Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:31 pm

TaipeiMort wrote:
semitranslucent wrote:OK, so I'm still waiting on packages but the big decision right now is NYU v UCLA. I'm guessing I'll be able to get decent $ from UCLA (if not initially then by leveraging NYU). I'm born, raised and UG in NY and want to be able to work in NY biglaw or high-end boutique, but was hoping for CA weather/change of pace for the three years of law school.

Obv would have to wait for the packages to shake out but do you guys think UCLA would even be an option? What would it take to make it back to NY? And what would it take to get you to go to UCLA?


Nothing. UCLA is great in California, but NYU is NYC's regional school, and one of the best schools in the country. Being from NY makes you a lock for a job with an okay GPA. Because law school grading is less predictable, you should assume that you are going to end up at or below median. In this scenario, you would be in huge trouble at UCLA and you would still have a good shot at NYC biglaw, and a great shot at NY midmarkets.


Also worthwhile to mention that I don't think it is much more difficult to do well at a T14 or even T6 than it is at a T20 or even T30. This is just my theory though, and I don't have much to base it on other than the fact I'm a transfer student.

semitranslucent
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby semitranslucent » Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:15 pm

Thanks for the advice, I'd been afraid that might be the case. Already out at Berkeley and waiting on Stanford but fat chance. Also waiting on Penn/Duke/Georgetown plus assorted other T30.

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moneybagsphd
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Re: $$$ vs. ranking

Postby moneybagsphd » Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:30 pm

Right now, I'm trying to decide between UCLA w/90k scholly and Michigan (just in today, so no scholly yet).
My goals are somewhat flexible: no strong geographic preference, I want a decent job (not necessarily biglaw, but a salary that allows me to pay off any loans), I would like to clerk (but it's not the be-all and end-all).
If I go to UCLA, I will graduate ~60k in debt (after parental help). I'm pretty debt averse (as someone who's never been in debt and has been on TLS long enough to be sufficiently terrified of it). But I'm totally psyched about Michigan. If Michigan gives me 45k, I think it's the clear choice... I'm still not sure where to draw the line, though.
3 Questions: 1) For Michigan admits with $$$: From what I gather Michigan posts scholarship info ~2wks after acceptance, is that correct? 2) Do you think Mich will negotiate with UCLA's $$$ (not that they'd match it, but maybe meet somewhere in the middle)? 3) Given my goals, how much $$$ is enough to justify Michigan?

Still waiting on: HCCNB




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