Trina Johnson wrote:So should I go to WVU over UGA?
EDIT- Just noticed just a flamer... move along, nothing to see here
Trina Johnson wrote:So should I go to WVU over UGA?
dolfan0516 wrote:Trina Johnson wrote:So should I go to WVU over UGA?
EDIT- Just noticed just a flamer... move along, nothing to see here
Paul Campos wrote:The mistake here is to conflate the general state of the economy with the state of the hiring market for graduates of ABA law schools. The two are related obviously, but it's far from a simple relationship. The hiring market for the lawyers has been shedding jobs for 20 years now. In 2011 the legal services employment market was completely flat, even though the economy as a whole added more than 1.5 million jobs.
"We view [the summer program] as integral to the firm and to building and continuing our culture,” Grugan says. “But I don't think that we're going to go back to the time when we had 25 summer associates."
ocuviper wrote:I'm surprised Texas' numbers aren't stronger. What's up with that?
ocuviper wrote:No rationale. I'm just pretty new at interpreting all law school data. Thanks for the explanation.
dingbat wrote:ocuviper wrote:No rationale. I'm just pretty new at interpreting all law school data. Thanks for the explanation.
Generally, the T14 place at the top, while the following schools are in a second tranch:
Boston College
Boston University
Fordham
GW
U Texas
Vanderbilt
UCLA
USC
(Strong schools in big markets)
you have to realize, these are the largest firms, which means they're in the largest markets, and they predominantly tap the schools in those markets.
Some years strong schools in smaller regions (schools like Notre Dame, Howard, Indiana W&L and WUSTL) may also put up big numbers for NLJ250, but they're more likely to feed into the mid-size firms that have a strong presence in those mid-size markets
(which is not a bad thing - oftentimes these schools have better employment stats than the schools listed above, and the salary can be comparable)
There's a strong self-selecting process where people who want to work in a particular market tend to go to school in that region. It's easier for firms to go to schools in their own region because A) it's close; B) they usually already have ties to those schools; and C) students at schools in their regions tend to want to stay in those regions.
Even large chunks of the T-14 is not exempt from this - Columbia and NYU grads tend to stay in NY, GULC feeds into the DC market and Berkeley students tend to stay in northern California.
dingbat wrote:I will backtrack. I should have said some of those schools (regional) sometimes place better than some of the group above.
I just was trying to hedge myself, since on occasion these schools do a bit better (e.g. Notre Dame in 2009 or Howard in 2010), which happened to beat some of the schools that I placed in the second tranch.
The salaries at midsize firms are a bit lower, but then, the cost of living in midsize markets and cost of attendance at schools in midsize markets are lower, so this has a bit of a balancing effect
(making 30% less in an area that costs 30% less to live in is a wash)
As for the grades required in those midsize markets, this is somewhat comparable (with some latitude) to the grades needed at the schools I listed in the second tranch for getting into biglaw firms in biglaw markets.
While it's not directly comparable, I wouldn't be surprised if something similar could be true for someone paying in-state tuition at some of the states that only have 1 law school that's TTT, such as Wyoming or the Dakotas, where average salaries are low, but cost of living is also very low.
It's a matter of scale. I'd rather be making $90k in Florida than $160k in NYC
Trina Johnson wrote:So should I go to WVU over UGA?
smokeylarue wrote:As someone who is very seriously considering NYU, can someone explain to me the NYU T-6 advantage because these numbers of the last 3 years seems to show no advantage compared to a lot of the lower T-14.
sunynp wrote:Trina Johnson wrote:So should I go to WVU over UGA?
I think the WVU students in biglaw are people who are doing career associate work for bigfirms that have offices in West Viriginia. I don't think those students are typical bigfirm associates. Someone please correct me if I am mistaken.
Gail wrote:"We view [the summer program] as integral to the firm and to building and continuing our culture,” Grugan says. “But I don't think that we're going to go back to the time when we had 25 summer associates."
They say that now, sure.
Wait until business picks up and they need more young blood to bring in the cash.
Call me naive. I really don't think it's inherent to the legal profession. It's like during the best times of the economy people will think we're invulnerable to another depression and in a new age. No new age. Just another part of the cycle. Animal spirits will prevail. Being overly pessimistic is as profitable as being overly optimistic.
IAFG wrote:I read that quote very differently. I think we are just seeing less emphasis on the summer program; that firm may still end up with 25 first years, but only 10 summers, hire 10 3Ls who had no SA and maybe poach another 5 from other firms. If this would work in practice, I don't know, but I do think it is a model firms would like to move towards, so they can project hiring needs more effectively.
smokeylarue wrote:As someone who is very seriously considering NYU, can someone explain to me the NYU T-6 advantage because these numbers of the last 3 years seems to show no advantage compared to a lot of the lower T-14.
rad lulz wrote:smokeylarue wrote:As someone who is very seriously considering NYU, can someone explain to me the NYU T-6 advantage because these numbers of the last 3 years seems to show no advantage compared to a lot of the lower T-14.
PI bias
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