Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

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iosborn12
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Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby iosborn12 » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:14 pm

So here is my situation. I am in at Alabama with $23.5k a year, in at UGA with nothing at the moment, and in at USC jr. with instate tuition (~22k a year). Waiting on Emory, but based on a friend's review, who is a 3L there now, I would need a significant scholarship to consider Emory. Also in at LSU and Georgia State, but not really considering either at the moment.

What are everyone's thoughts/concerns with the above mentioned schools? Originally UGA was where I really wanted to go, but I cannot justify paying sticker at UGA over paying 7-10k in tuition at Alabama. I plan on trying to negotiate once I hear from Emory, but I guess for the time being I will assume I am not getting anything from UGA. I would love to work in South Carolina, but I also have a hard time justifying paying 22k there, and I get the feeling from many posters here that it is difficult to make it there without direct connections (I have connections to South Carolina, being a Clemson grad, just none specifically to their legal markets).

Lastly, how are out of state students viewed in Alabama/Georgia? I am originally from Massachusetts, but went to school in South Carolina, and now have lived in Baltimore for two years, so I have been all over the place and am not concerned with moving somewhere new (although rural Alabama may be interesting).

Thanks for all your help!
Last edited by iosborn12 on Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

protip
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby protip » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:18 pm

PROTIP: USC is in Southern California

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NoleinNY
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby NoleinNY » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:22 pm

iosborn12 wrote:So here is my situation. I am in at Alabama with $23.5k a year, in at UGA with nothing at the moment, and in at USC with instate tuition (~22k a year). Waiting on Emory, but based on a friend's review, who is a 3L there now, I would need a significant scholarship to consider Emory. Also in at LSU and Georgia State, but not really considering either at the moment.

What are everyone's thoughts/concerns with the above mentioned schools? Originally UGA was where I really wanted to go, but I cannot justify paying sticker at UGA over paying 7-10k in tuition at Alabama. I plan on trying to negotiate once I hear from Emory, but I guess for the time being I will assume I am not getting anything from UGA. I would love to work in South Carolina, but I also have a hard time justifying paying 22k there, and I get the feeling from many posters here that it is difficult to make it there without direct connections (I have connections to South Carolina, being a Clemson grad, just none specifically to their legal markets).

Lastly, how are out of state students viewed in Alabama/Georgia? I am originally from Massachusetts, but went to school in South Carolina, and now have lived in Baltimore for two years, so I have been all over the place and am not concerned with moving somewhere new (although rural Alabama may be interesting).

Thanks for all your help!


Try your damndest to get money from UGA and go there if you get scholly money. Use the Bama scholarship offer to try and leverage the Dawgs. GA is a larger legal market than AL. Not entirely sold on Southern Carolina (according to the 9th Circuit of the federal courts, USC = Southern California :-P)

iosborn12
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby iosborn12 » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:33 pm

NoleinNY wrote:
iosborn12 wrote:So here is my situation. I am in at Alabama with $23.5k a year, in at UGA with nothing at the moment, and in at USC with instate tuition (~22k a year). Waiting on Emory, but based on a friend's review, who is a 3L there now, I would need a significant scholarship to consider Emory. Also in at LSU and Georgia State, but not really considering either at the moment.

What are everyone's thoughts/concerns with the above mentioned schools? Originally UGA was where I really wanted to go, but I cannot justify paying sticker at UGA over paying 7-10k in tuition at Alabama. I plan on trying to negotiate once I hear from Emory, but I guess for the time being I will assume I am not getting anything from UGA. I would love to work in South Carolina, but I also have a hard time justifying paying 22k there, and I get the feeling from many posters here that it is difficult to make it there without direct connections (I have connections to South Carolina, being a Clemson grad, just none specifically to their legal markets).

Lastly, how are out of state students viewed in Alabama/Georgia? I am originally from Massachusetts, but went to school in South Carolina, and now have lived in Baltimore for two years, so I have been all over the place and am not concerned with moving somewhere new (although rural Alabama may be interesting).

Thanks for all your help!


Try your damndest to get money from UGA and go there if you get scholly money. Use the Bama scholarship offer to try and leverage the Dawgs. GA is a larger legal market than AL. Not entirely sold on Southern Carolina (according to the 9th Circuit of the federal courts, USC = Southern California :-P)


USC Jr. better? :D

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BruceWayne
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby BruceWayne » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:51 pm

For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level).

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.


If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC.
Last edited by BruceWayne on Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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gavinstevens
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby gavinstevens » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:51 pm

NoleinNY wrote:Try your damndest to get money from UGA and go there if you get scholly money. Use the Bama scholarship offer to try and leverage the Dawgs. GA is a larger legal market than AL. Not entirely sold on Southern Carolina (according to the 9th Circuit of the federal courts, USC = Southern California :-P)


+1

Most people get in state at UGA their second and third years.

FWIW I know of a USC jr. (nice term hahaha) 3L top ten (people, not percent) that is jobless.

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sunynp
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby sunynp » Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:08 pm

I know that a while ago I did some research on Alabama firms. There were only about 50 -60 positions on NALP for 2Ls in Birmingham. Note that in Alabama many of the firms hire a large number of 1Ls. The job market in Alabama seems very screwy.

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:23 pm

BruceWayne wrote:For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level). This part is not true. Top 10% to land a job in the South? Really?

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama. This part is generally true, and is well reasoned.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.
This part continues your general theme of exaggeration. Of course you should aim high, but in my experience, the idea that you need to be top 10% to secure a job in the South is off base.

If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC. This part goes against everything I've heard about the SC market, which is "if you want to work there, you should go to USC."


Signed,


Alabama 3L

iosborn12
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby iosborn12 » Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:28 pm

Aqualibrium wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level). This part is not true. Top 10% to land a job in the South? Really?

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama. This part is generally true, and is well reasoned.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.
This part continues your general theme of exaggeration. Of course you should aim high, but in my experience, the idea that you need to be top 10% to secure a job in the South is off base.

If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC. This part goes against everything I've heard about the SC market, which is "if you want to work there, you should go to USC."


Signed,


Alabama 3L


Thanks for the insight. What are your thoughts on how out of state students (and in my case, northerners) are viewed in Alabama? My assumption would be if I went to Alabama I would be staying there for good.

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jeeptiger09
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby jeeptiger09 » Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:50 pm

Have to agree with Aqualibrium.

Can't echo the sentiment enough that Atlanta is a fucking mess right now. I know people that are top 10 at Georgia State that can't even get Atlanta Midlaw (given, UGA and Bama are much better schools than GSU but GSU does alright being in Atlanta). Problem with Georgia is that it's pretty much Atlanta or nothing (unless you want to do small town law in the South, in which case I would go to the cheapest school if I were you). Bama is mostly Birmingham (with smaller markets in Mobile, Montgomery) and some Nashville (Aqua, don't some UA kids go to Jackson and other places in MS?). Nashville is becoming the next shit show, but Birmingham is staying somewhat healthy (and both schools will give you distant shots at Chattanooga).

With that being said, if you are interested in Regional biglaw, it seems like Alabama would give you a better bet, since there is ridiculous competition in Atlanta. You still have an outside shot at ATL and Nash and will have an advantage in most markets in AL and MS.

Also, I don't think top 10% is the cutoff for landing a job, but I would say you need to be in the top 1/4 to 1/3 depending on school/market.

And finally, I didn't try and look in SC, but from everything I have heard:
-going to South Carolina gives you minimal degree portability, so basically it limits you to SC
-if you want to work in South Carolina, you absolutely must go to SC (or T14)

Hope that helps.

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:59 pm

iosborn12 wrote:
Aqualibrium wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level). This part is not true. Top 10% to land a job in the South? Really?

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama. This part is generally true, and is well reasoned.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.
This part continues your general theme of exaggeration. Of course you should aim high, but in my experience, the idea that you need to be top 10% to secure a job in the South is off base.

If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC. This part goes against everything I've heard about the SC market, which is "if you want to work there, you should go to USC."


Signed,


Alabama 3L


Thanks for the insight. What are your thoughts on how out of state students (and in my case, northerners) are viewed in Alabama? My assumption would be if I went to Alabama I would be staying there for good.



You'll encounter some xenophobia, especially if you are someone who has never lived in or is not from the South; The "Why Birmingham/Why Mobile/Why Montgomery (SERIOUSLY WHYYYY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN MONTGOMERY!!)/Why Huntsville question will come up and come up often, but it can be dealt with. All of my classmates within the grade ranges required for firm jobs expressed some initial frustration with this, but have eventually done just fine with regards to jobs (one thing I noticed is that a lot of out of staters, at least initially, used the fact that they weren't from the South or Alabama as an excuse instead of trying to figure out the real reasons they weren't having success in their job hunt).

I'm here all night if you've got more questions.

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:13 am

jeeptiger09 wrote:Have to agree with Aqualibrium.

Can't echo the sentiment enough that Atlanta is a fucking mess right now. I know people that are top 10 at Georgia State that can't even get Atlanta Midlaw (given, UGA and Bama are much better schools than GSU but GSU does alright being in Atlanta). Problem with Georgia is that it's pretty much Atlanta or nothing (unless you want to do small town law in the South, in which case I would go to the cheapest school if I were you). Bama is mostly Birmingham (with smaller markets in Mobile, Montgomery) and some Nashville (Aqua, don't some UA kids go to Jackson and other places in MS?). Nashville is becoming the next shit show, but Birmingham is staying somewhat healthy (and both schools will give you distant shots at Chattanooga).

With that being said, if you are interested in Regional biglaw, it seems like Alabama would give you a better bet, since there is ridiculous competition in Atlanta. You still have an outside shot at ATL and Nash and will have an advantage in most markets in AL and MS.

Also, I don't think top 10% is the cutoff for landing a job, but I would say you need to be in the top 1/4 to 1/3 depending on school/market.

And finally, I didn't try and look in SC, but from everything I have heard:
-going to South Carolina gives you minimal degree portability, so basically it limits you to SC
-if you want to work in South Carolina, you absolutely must go to SC (or T14)

Hope that helps.


Honestly, Bama with money is probably the best place to be for the exact reasons you mentioned. You get access to a thriving - or at least healthy - market in Birmingham, as well as smaller markets in Mobile, Montgomery, and Huntsville. Additionally, with good grades, you can try for Texas markets (not a commentary on the amount of students that end up there from Bama), Atlanta, Mississippi, Tennessee, and Louisiana (it especially helps if you are a native of GA, LA, MS, TN, etc... and don't get into/are not satisfied with $ from the top schools in the respective state).

Also, the top 1/4 - 1/3 comment you made is about right.

My personal experience was as follows (and I'm probably outing myself, but I'm sure I already have so whatever): 1L summer worked at two regional mid/biglaw bama firms. 2L summer worked at two regional mid/big law firms in another Southern state, and a state in the Mid-Atlantic. 2L summer, I applied as a urm and a Southerner (though not an Alabamian) in the top 1/4 of the class and ended up with offers in Bama, NOLA, Miami, VA & DC, Houston, and Atlanta. YMMV
Last edited by Aqualibrium on Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby BruceWayne » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:19 am

Aqualibrium wrote:Signed,


Alabama 3L
BruceWayne wrote:For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level). This part is not true. Top 10% to land a job in the South? Really?

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama. This part is generally true, and is well reasoned.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.
This part continues your general theme of exaggeration. Of course you should aim high, but in my experience, the idea that you need to be top 10% to secure a job in the South is off base.

If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC. This part goes against everything I've heard about the SC market, which is "if you want to work there, you should go to USC."


Signed,


Alabama 3L


I was talking with regards to major law firms. For jobs outside of that almost none of what I said is really applicable. The idea that you need top 10 percent to land A job in the South from these schools is obviously ludicrous--to a point where I'm surprised that you even mistook that for what I was saying. Particularly since I'm not one of the " outside of HYS or top 10 percent at a top 6 and you're dead" fearmongers. Honestly, for non law firm jobs I don't think there's really uniform advice that you can give someone other than network, go to a school in your desired work region, and hustle. There is no grade cutoff below which you're dead or above which and you're golden. That's not how the rest of the world works (thank God).

I'm going to have to disagree with you on the having to attend law school in SC thing though for working there. That would be true if OP hadn't went to Clemson for undergrad, but since he/she did that's not the case. I've met people who got jobs in other regions across the South as long as they have another Southern degree and a legitimate reason for wanting to be there (myself for example) as well as Southern ties. The South can be very ties centric, but a lot of times the ties can simply be to the South in general; they don't necessarily have to be to that exact Southern state that you are attempting to work in. And again I know that from experience.
Last edited by BruceWayne on Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:27 am, edited 2 times in total.

iosborn12
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby iosborn12 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:23 am

Aqualibrium wrote:
iosborn12 wrote:
Aqualibrium wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:For any of these schools you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job in the South (I'm talking at least top 15 percent---top 10 is more likely). So in a sense there isn't much difference between UGA and Bama (however, I would put USC on a somewhat lower level). This part is not true. Top 10% to land a job in the South? Really?

That said, to be honest, in this climate I might lean towards Bama. Since you will need ultra high grades to land a firm job from either school prestige is even. The difference comes in with regard to market. Atlanta is disaster. Birmingham is not---it's probably the healthiest Southern market. And even if you would like to work in Atlanta, if you pull off the high grades that either school would require for any firm job Bama will still give you good shot at an Atlanta firm job. And you'll be guaranteed a place at one of the Birmingham firm jobs. Go to Bama. This part is generally true, and is well reasoned.

But I want you to remember the the recurring theme of my post--you need ultra high grades at any of these schools to really land firm jobs anywhere. Thus, if that's your goal you need to understand what you're getting yourself into.
This part continues your general theme of exaggeration. Of course you should aim high, but in my experience, the idea that you need to be top 10% to secure a job in the South is off base.

If you want to work in SC that probably means that you don't want to work in a big firm. And if that's the case I would definitely go to the cheapest school. Bama shouldn't cause a Clemson undergrad much trouble in SC. This part goes against everything I've heard about the SC market, which is "if you want to work there, you should go to USC."


Signed,


Alabama 3L


Thanks for the insight. What are your thoughts on how out of state students (and in my case, northerners) are viewed in Alabama? My assumption would be if I went to Alabama I would be staying there for good.



You'll encounter some xenophobia, especially if you are someone who has never lived in or is not from the South; The "Why Birmingham/Why Mobile/Why Montgomery (SERIOUSLY WHYYYY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN MONTGOMERY!!)/Why Huntsville question will come up and come up often, but it can be dealt with. All of my classmates within the grade ranges required for firm jobs expressed some initial frustration with this, but have eventually done just fine with regards to jobs (one thing I noticed is that a lot of out of staters, at least initially, used the fact that they weren't from the South or Alabama as an excuse instead of trying to figure out the real reasons they weren't having success in their job hunt).

I'm here all night if you've got more questions.


The "Why Alabama" questions do not frighten me too much, because my intentions were to go back to a southern school and particularly to one with a passionate alumni base, and so naturally I would want to be around those alumni.

Overall, what is your sense as to how your peer's job prospects are this year compared to other years you have seen? Also how have the summer opportunities been both in 1L and 2L? And lastly what kind of opportunities have you or your classmates had during the school year through clinics and/or externships?

Thank you so much for your help!

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:26 am

BruceWayne wrote:
I was talking with regards to major law firms. For jobs outside of that almost none of what I said is really applicable. The idea that you need top 10 percent to land A job in the South from these schools is obviously ludicrous--to a point where I'm surprised that you even mistook that for what I was saying. Particularly since I'm not one of the " outside of HYS or top 10 percent at a top 6 and you're dead" fearmongers. Honestly, for non law firm jobs I don't think there's really uniform advice that you can give someone other than network, go to a school in your desired work region, and hustle. There is no grade cutoff below which you're dead or above which and you're golden. That's not how the rest of the world works (thank God).

I'm going to have to disagree with you on the having to attend law school in SC thing though for working there. That would be true if OP hadn't went to Clemson for undergrad, but since he/she did that's not the case. I've met people who get jobs in other regions across the South as long as they have another Southern degree and a legitimate reason for wanting to be there (myself for example). The South can be very ties centric, but a lot of times the ties can simply be to the South in general; they don't necessarily have to be to that exact Southern state that you are attempting to work in. And again I know that from experience.



You may be correct on SC. I don't know much about the market, and made a point to mention that I was simply repeating what I had heard.

I agree with you on the ties thing.

I disagree with you re: grade cutoffs for major regional firm jobs. From my experience here, the cutoff for those jobs in the state of Alabama is generally in the top 1/4 - 1/3 range for a UA student.

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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby BruceWayne » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:32 am

You may be correct on SC. I don't know much about the market, and made a point to mention that I was simply repeating what I had heard.

I agree with you on the ties thing.

I disagree with you re: grade cutoffs for major regional firm jobs. From my experience here, the cutoff for those jobs in the state of Alabama is generally in the top 1/4 - 1/3 range for a UA student.


If this is true I'm a bit surprised considering what I heard from partners at one of the big Birmingham firms and from what I've seen on the website profiles (loaded with Summa and Magna cum laude Bama grads-- very few without those stats). I'm especially curious bout how true the top 1/3 top 1/4 thing is for Bradley considering that they weren't even interested in going below median at UVA from what I've seen/heard. Maybe they just didn't find as many applicants that they liked.

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:41 am

iosborn12 wrote:
The "Why Alabama" questions do not frighten me too much, because my intentions were to go back to a southern school and particularly to one with a passionate alumni base, and so naturally I would want to be around those alumni.

Overall, what is your sense as to how your peer's job prospects are this year compared to other years you have seen? Also how have the summer opportunities been both in 1L and 2L? And lastly what kind of opportunities have you or your classmates had during the school year through clinics and/or externships?

Thank you so much for your help!


Comparisons are tough. I didn't know most of the 3L's my 1L year, so I can't really comment. The 3L's from my 2L year seemed to do fine, and fell in line with the top 1/4 - 1/3 line that me and another poster has previously mentioned. My classmates have enjoyed that same level of success when it comes to jobs at law firms.

Summer opportunities in the state of Alabama as a 1L are far better than almost every other state. For whatever reason, the employers here hire quite a few 1L's. The school has also done a good job of creating a varied range of for credit externships that allow students to work in various public interest organizations, with judges, and with government agencies.

2L summer opportunities provide similar options...more firms jobs are generally available (the cutoff and degree of selectivity with regards to personality/fit/ties seems to be tighter for 1L summer than it is for 2L summer at firms. Quite a few people with good grades who could not get 1L firm gigs were able to get 2L firm gigs...I personally ended up with 2L offers at several places that rejected me as a 1L).

Alabama has a clinical experience guarantee, which allows a student to get a spot in one of the 7 law clinics before they graduate if they so choose. The externships during the school year are largely of the judicial variety, but the school has made some moves to try to increase other types. In the last year, the Southern Poverty Law Center and ACLU have both been added as semester externship options. Students can also "create" an externship by working with the externship director. I personally took advantage of the opportunity to do a clinic and an in semester externship while I was here, and have really valued the experience. In fact, since 2L year started, I've focused on gaining as much practical experience as possible (that makes my transcript looks funky with all the pass fail credits I've taken lol, but I feel very confident about my ability to go get work done when I start as an entry level associate post barzam).

Aqualibrium
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Aqualibrium » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:47 am

BruceWayne wrote:
You may be correct on SC. I don't know much about the market, and made a point to mention that I was simply repeating what I had heard.

I agree with you on the ties thing.

I disagree with you re: grade cutoffs for major regional firm jobs. From my experience here, the cutoff for those jobs in the state of Alabama is generally in the top 1/4 - 1/3 range for a UA student.


If this is true I'm a bit surprised considering what I heard from partners at one of the big Birmingham firms and from what I've seen on the website profiles (loaded with Summa and Magna cum laude Bama grads-- very few without those stats). I'm especially curious bout how true the top 1/3 top 1/4 thing is for Bradley considering that they weren't even interested in going below median at UVA from what I've seen/heard. Maybe they just didn't find as many applicants that they liked.


1/4 still gets latin honors here...

Bradley is traditionally regarded as a very snobby firm.

I appreciate your surprise, but I saw with my own eyes my classmates snag jobs at various regional mid and big law firms in Birmingham, Huntsville, Montgomery, and Mobile; success in this regard usually ended at about the top 1/3 mark with a few outliers who were inside the top 50% and a few well connected kids who were even further back.

(why the surprise btw, we've spoken before...I've never lied or puffed to you, so why would I start now?)

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BruceWayne
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby BruceWayne » Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:33 am

Aqualibrium wrote:1/4 still gets latin honors here...

Bradley is traditionally regarded as a very snobby firm.

I appreciate your surprise, but I saw with my own eyes my classmates snag jobs at various regional mid and big law firms in Birmingham, Huntsville, Montgomery, and Mobile; success in this regard usually ended at about the top 1/3 mark with a few outliers who were inside the top 50% and a few well connected kids who were even further back.

(why the surprise btw, we've spoken before...I've never lied or puffed to you, so why would I start now?)


I meant surprised based off of the website profiles and what the partners were saying--but they may have been exaggerating and your explanation about latin honors at Bama definitely explains my confusion about their class rank. If you get latin honors for being top 1/3 or 1/4 that basically discredits/explains away what I was saying about everyone having those markers as my justification for saying that they had high ranks. At a lot of schools magna only goes to top 10 percent so I thought that's what they had when I saw those honors.

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Grizz
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Grizz » Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:45 am

If you want to work in South Carolina, you gotta go to USC. The problem is, theres isn't really a lot going on in SC, and even though you went to Clemson, it's one of the most parochial markets in the nation.

Agree wrt Bruce and Aqua's comments about Birmingham being stronger than Atlanta, which is objectively a slaughterhouse right now.

I'd go to Bama I guess, but are you 100% sure you'd be happy working in Alabama? I really like Birmingham, but some do not. You don't seem to know very much about it.

iosborn12
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby iosborn12 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:28 pm

Grizz wrote:If you want to work in South Carolina, you gotta go to USC. The problem is, theres isn't really a lot going on in SC, and even though you went to Clemson, it's one of the most parochial markets in the nation.

Agree wrt Bruce and Aqua's comments about Birmingham being stronger than Atlanta, which is objectively a slaughterhouse right now.

I'd go to Bama I guess, but are you 100% sure you'd be happy working in Alabama? I really like Birmingham, but some do not. You don't seem to know very much about it.


I don't know a lot about it, but one of my best friends from undergrad is in Birmingham and loves it. Also, I really haven't had trouble picking up and moving to new cities in the past, especially with Baltimore being a very homer city with few transplants.

Grizz, what are your thoughts-with the Atlanta legal market being a "slaughterhouse"-on UGA vs. Alabama even if I were to wind up with a comparable scholarship at UGA? Do you agree with the other posters that Alabama has a little more reach in the deep south?

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Grizz
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby Grizz » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:34 pm

Neither of these schools has good into other deep south states, especially if you're not from that state to begin with. Except for ATL. Tippity top of the class at Bama is also competitive for ATL biglaw jobs, but like I said, slaughterhouse.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:44 pm

Calculate the total COA for each law school, then attend the one with the lowest debt/cost if the difference is significant since you are open to practicing almost anywhere in the South.

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jeeptiger09
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby jeeptiger09 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:26 pm

Grizz wrote:Neither of these schools has good into other deep south states, especially if you're not from that state to begin with. Except for ATL. Tippity top of the class at Bama is also competitive for ATL biglaw jobs, but like I said, slaughterhouse.


This. Southern States are partial to their state schools. Exception is Vandy and that only goes so far (and you could probably get to Mississippi with a Bama JD). Visit Birmingham and try to get a feel for it. Some love it. I hate it.

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sunynp
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Re: Thoughts on Alabama/UGA and other southern schools?

Postby sunynp » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:44 pm

Can someone post facts about this "thriving" or " healthy" market in Birmingham? I know there are relatively few 2l SA positions, most people who get one of these worked as a 1L, and that firms require people to split their summers, and that about half the class gets no- offered.

So what is with this rosy picture of jobs in birmingham? It may be less competitive than Atlanta because Atlanta is more desirable?




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