Picking a Chicago law school

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sunynp
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby sunynp » Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:36 pm

Beeg12 wrote:I am not basing my statements on employment statistics, rather current opinions of hiring law firm partners in the market. Aren't these unemployment statistics similar in other law programs and other legal markets? The nation lost 1800 legal jobs in December and they all aren't from the Chicago market. My whole point is that if law is the career in which you plan to pursue, and your options were those listed by the post, to take the best options, which from what I've heard from partners in law firms in Chicago is Kent, and work hard. the fact is that there are attorneys that graduated Kent that have jobs, and there are unemployed graduates in every field of study in every city in America. I just dislike the negative outlook and bad advice you give in regards to "don't go to law school". Obviously if NU and Chicago law were options we wouldn't be having this discussion. The topic is what is the best option to take. If you are going to law school for only money, then don't go. If you want a legal education and are prepared to work for your career, than take the best option you are given and work your butt off. It is naive to think that in the current market that a career will just be handed to you in any field.


Obviously you aren't looking at employment statistics, otherwise you would know how wrong you are and how terrible this advice is. There is a huge difference between expecting a career to be handed to you and to not being able to find any job making any money at all practicing law. You need to understand the statistics.

Here's another tip - everyone in law school will be working hard, very hard. You can not plan on outworking them and you can't plan on beating the curve. The only safe thing is to assume you will be at median (though many people will be below median.) What are the job prospects for the median students? I suggest you look at statistics and the employment forums here. Do not go to school expecting you will be the editor of the law review. (Although as noted above, even the editor of the law review remained jobless.)

If you want to rely on the advice some guy told you over the clear evidence to the contrary, go ahead, just please be careful about telling other people to do the same.

maximator
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby maximator » Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:50 pm

Beeg12 wrote:I am not basing my statements on employment statistics, rather current opinions of hiring law firm partners in the market. Aren't these unemployment statistics similar in other law programs and other legal markets? The nation lost 1800 legal jobs in December and they all aren't from the Chicago market. My whole point is that if law is the career in which you plan to pursue, and your options were those listed by the post, to take the best options, which from what I've heard from partners in law firms in Chicago is Kent, and work hard. the fact is that there are attorneys that graduated Kent that have jobs, and there are unemployed graduates in every field of study in every city in America. I just dislike the negative outlook and bad advice you give in regards to "don't go to law school". Obviously if NU and Chicago law were options we wouldn't be having this discussion. The topic is what is the best option to take. If you are going to law school for only money, then don't go. If you want a legal education and are prepared to work for your career, than take the best option you are given and work your butt off. It is naive to think that in the current market that a career will just be handed to you in any field.


But this advice is lousy because the OP doesn't have to take the best option he has been "given." OP could get some work experience and retake the LSAT. With a better score, the OP will have "given" himself better options i.e. admission to better schools or larger scholarships at the schools listed above.

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IrwinM.Fletcher
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby IrwinM.Fletcher » Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:19 pm

This thread, I don't even...

I thought this kind of 0L idiocy got euthanized sometime around 2009 OCI?

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Helmholtz
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby Helmholtz » Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:30 pm

IrwinM.Fletcher wrote:This thread, I don't even...

I thought this kind of 0L idiocy got euthanized sometime around 2009 OCI?


Nah, dawg. People just woke up and realized you can outnetwork and outwork your classmates all the way to your dream job (guaranteed!), regardless of your school. The $200k in debt you have from going to Kent or Loyola is nothing compared to the warm feeling in your heart knowing that you're an attorney.

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IrwinM.Fletcher
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby IrwinM.Fletcher » Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:37 pm

Helmholtz wrote:
IrwinM.Fletcher wrote:This thread, I don't even...

I thought this kind of 0L idiocy got euthanized sometime around 2009 OCI?


Nah, dawg. People just woke up and realized you can outnetwork and outwork your classmates all the way to your dream job (guaranteed!), regardless of your school. The $200k in debt you have from going to Kent or Loyola is nothing compared to the warm feeling in your heart knowing that you're an attorney.


Truth.

Beeg12
Posts: 73
Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:38 pm

Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby Beeg12 » Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:58 pm

"dawg"... When did I say out network, outwork, or dream job? I'm merely pointing out that getting a job out of undergraduate is just as hard as law school. An ceducation is no gauruntee of a career in any market, any adult currently in the workforce knows that. What kind of assumption iscitv to make that youllfind work in the meantime or do better on the LSAT? I personally know and have spoken with law professionals that are gainfully employed in Chicago and that actively hire attorneys and am merely retelling their seasoned advice that I found pertinent to original question posed.

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Helmholtz
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby Helmholtz » Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:01 pm

Beeg12 wrote:An ceducation is no gauruntee of a career in any market, any adult currently in the workforce knows that. What kind of assumption iscitv to make that youllfind work in the meantime or do better on the LSAT?


QFP

Transferthrowaway
Posts: 608
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby Transferthrowaway » Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:03 pm

Beeg12 wrote:"dawg"... When did I say out network, outwork, or dream job? I'm merely pointing out that getting a job out of undergraduate is just as hard as law school. An ceducation is no gauruntee of a career in any market, any adult currently in the workforce knows that. What kind of assumption iscitv to make that youllfind work in the meantime or do better on the LSAT? I personally know and have spoken with law professionals that are gainfully employed in Chicago and that actively hire attorneys and am merely retelling their seasoned advice that I found pertinent to original question posed.


Between having difficulty finding a job after undergrad or having difficulty finding a job after three years of opportunity cost plus $200k, I'd choose the former.

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JoeFish
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby JoeFish » Wed Jan 11, 2012 4:36 am

Can't hurt to try for UIUC. None of us have absolutely any bloody idea what the applicant pool/medians are going to look like this year, what with Plessgate and all, so I have no idea what scholly if any you could get. 3.43/163 probably wouldn't have gotten much more than the 8k minimum this past year, but no idea how this is all going to shake out (if they're going to, say, accept that they'll have a lower class, not try to give enormous scholarships, and invest that money in image rebuilding OR if they're going to say "only way to keep our numbers up is to give out even more money). But, hey, I love it here. Don't let anyone lie to you about employment stats - you probably have, what, a 20% or so chance of 6 figures out of school with a JD from UIUC? - but the general advice is to go to the best school you can get into (or the school with the best employment opportunity/cost less scholarship ratio, or whatnot), because once you get there stats are out the window.
That is, if you can tolerate living in the cornfields for three years. My hometown was 5,000 people, so UC seems like Paris to me.

DePaulGradLawyer
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Re: Picking a Chicago law school

Postby DePaulGradLawyer » Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:53 pm

The "specialty rankings" from USNWR are hilarious bullshit. Look into how those rankings are actually determined and it won't be difficult to see that. Nobody takes them seriously. If you were in a group of law students and mention that Chicago Kent has one of the top ten legal-writing programs, be prepared to get laughed at.

**I graduated from DePaul around 10 years ago, and I fell for the "Top 10 health Law programs in the country' bs. If someone I cared about was in similar shoes today as I was then, I would tell them it almost certainly matters far more what your school's overall ranking is. With my gpa and LSAT I think I probably could have gotten into somewhat better ranked schools outside of Chicago - and had better results in my careers so far.

When I graduated I sent out 100+ resumes - actually mailing them, we didnt have email or Synchronicity or whatever then - and believe me every rejection letter I received in the mail crushed me until I was almost numb...and it still hurt. While I blame myself for much, it also matters what the name of the school is to many people who hire.




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