gap between HYS and CCN

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Bildungsroman
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby Bildungsroman » Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:58 am

funkyturds wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:
DoubleChecks wrote:Personally, I can't imagine I would have had as chill of a 1L yr at CCN w/ traditional grades.

I guess CCN student bodies are mostly comprised of people who are mature enough to handle real grades.


as shown by that mature post. :roll:

Sorry, I forgot this thread was srs bsns and not just a place where people were trolling for their own schools.

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funkyturds
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby funkyturds » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:00 pm

rayiner wrote:
funkyturds wrote:
rayiner wrote:
I'll come out and say it: U Chicago's law and economics shtick is so last-century it's not even funny. Now that we know neo-classical economics is basically just a bunch of gibberish, what latent academic prestige Chicago had will be quickly wiped away by the rise of behavioral law and economics.


massive anti-Chicago trolling...you assume the rise of behavioral law and economics is going to wipe away Chicago's academic prestige even though we've got guys like Thaler here? :?


So in the 1960s, prior to the rise of the law and economics movement, you probably would've listed the top 5 schools as Harvard, Yale, Columbia, Stanford and Michigan, with Chicago just outside that group. Law and economics made U Chicago a legitimate competitor with Harvard and Yale, but that movement is on its way out.


I don't disagree. My point is that the rise of behavioral economics won't necessarily hurt U Chicago.

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funkyturds
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby funkyturds » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:05 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
funkyturds wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:
DoubleChecks wrote:Personally, I can't imagine I would have had as chill of a 1L yr at CCN w/ traditional grades.

I guess CCN student bodies are mostly comprised of people who are mature enough to handle real grades.


as shown by that mature post. :roll:

Sorry, I forgot this thread was srs bsns and not just a place where people were trolling for their own schools.


My bad...although, I have to say, the irony was not at all obvious in that post. (especially since I can imagine quite a few ppl at our school saying that kind of thing in earnest)

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BiglawOrBust
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby BiglawOrBust » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:15 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:just cause the people at Harvard are supergunnery and the place is not the greatest WRT QOL


Ever read Brush with the Law?

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JamMasterJ
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:16 pm

DoubleChecks wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:only based on the general stigma I've heard from others on this site, but basically, getting a Harvard Law degree isn't the most pleasant experience


that's weird, because i got the exact opposite sentiment and virtually everyone i know agrees with me. maybe that has to do with our class yr (better economy) or maybe it has to do with HLS' class size (and a larger proportion of HLS students being on TLS) so that the same % of whiners are over-represented on here. maybe a combination of both since the handful that weren't happy at HLS that posted on TLS seemed to all be in the yrs above me.

it could even have to do with the disproportionate amount of people at HLS that may feel entitled to something more (i know someone who was upset at the end of 1L yr that he was top 30%...he said he'd never been only top 30% before in his life lol). nothing wrong with that, just pointing out a possible difference in expectations too.

Since my post was based purely on anecdotal evidence, I really have no problem with what you're saying. Personally, I'd love to study law at Hahvahd, FWIW.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:16 pm

BiglawOrBust wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:just cause the people at Harvard are supergunnery and the place is not the greatest WRT QOL


Ever read Brush with the Law?

read my most recent post. I never claimed any legitimate evidence.

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BiglawOrBust
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby BiglawOrBust » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:24 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
BiglawOrBust wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:just cause the people at Harvard are supergunnery and the place is not the greatest WRT QOL


Ever read Brush with the Law?

read my most recent post. I never claimed any legitimate evidence.


Well, to be sure, Brush with the Law is likewise anecdotal. But, by all means, do yourself a favor and check it out!

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2246 ... th_the_Law

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JamMasterJ
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:26 pm

BiglawOrBust wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
BiglawOrBust wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:just cause the people at Harvard are supergunnery and the place is not the greatest WRT QOL


Ever read Brush with the Law?

read my most recent post. I never claimed any legitimate evidence.


Well, to be sure, Brush with the Law is likewise anecdotal. But, by all means, do yourself a favor and check it out!

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2246 ... th_the_Law

When Byrnes wasn't biking he was getting drunk and smoking crack. Finding himself when he discovered the right woman, Byrnes finally moved to Los Angeles during his third year and flew upstate only to take final exams.

hmmmm

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BiglawOrBust
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby BiglawOrBust » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:28 pm

The guy who went to Harvard was funnier, IMO.

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rayiner
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby rayiner » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:29 pm

funkyturds wrote:
rayiner wrote:
funkyturds wrote:
rayiner wrote:
I'll come out and say it: U Chicago's law and economics shtick is so last-century it's not even funny. Now that we know neo-classical economics is basically just a bunch of gibberish, what latent academic prestige Chicago had will be quickly wiped away by the rise of behavioral law and economics.


massive anti-Chicago trolling...you assume the rise of behavioral law and economics is going to wipe away Chicago's academic prestige even though we've got guys like Thaler here? :?


So in the 1960s, prior to the rise of the law and economics movement, you probably would've listed the top 5 schools as Harvard, Yale, Columbia, Stanford and Michigan, with Chicago just outside that group. Law and economics made U Chicago a legitimate competitor with Harvard and Yale, but that movement is on its way out.


I don't disagree. My point is that the rise of behavioral economics won't necessarily hurt U Chicago.


I don't think it'll hurt it in the sense that it'll become a TTT, but I do think Chicago is a pretty academically conservative place and once L&E passes they'll slip back to being solidly behind H/Y (particularly with H's renewed emphasis on empiricism). If I had to put money on which school will catch the next academic wave I'd put it on NYU.

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:52 pm

rayiner wrote:If I had to put money on which school will catch the next academic wave I'd put it on NYU.

This will make rigorous UChicago trolls' heads spin. (I do think there is something compelling about the sort of economic-cost-benefit-analysis-meets-humanism-meets-pragmatism school of thought going on at NYU; though of course I have no real basis for comparison, it always seemed to contrast with the "we study the capital-L Law" attitude of Columbia and Chicago.)

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Bildungsroman
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby Bildungsroman » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:55 pm

funkyturds wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Sorry, I forgot this thread was srs bsns and not just a place where people were trolling for their own schools.


My bad...although, I have to say, the irony was not at all obvious in that post. (especially since I can imagine quite a few ppl at our school saying that kind of thing in earnest)

I wouldn't ever seriously claim to have the upper hand in terms of maturity. I still get the urge to laugh in class when a professor mentions "duty" and I think he says "doody."

mrloblaw
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby mrloblaw » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:17 pm

Real grades are IMO one of the things that CCN do right. How can a system that creates incentives to coast by on intellectual laziness, without fully separating the wheat from the chaff, be good for anyone other than the lazy and the stupid? Not to mention that developing the ability to thrive in a competitive, winner-take-all system seems sort of crucial for litigators.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:19 pm

mrloblaw wrote:Real grades are IMO one of the things that CCN do right. How can a system that creates incentives to coast by on intellectual laziness, without fully separating the wheat from the chaff, be good for anyone other than the lazy and the stupid? Not to mention that developing the ability to thrive in a competitive, winner-take-all system seems sort of crucial for litigators.

You're argument presupposes that the "bottom" of the class is lazy and/or stupid. Not necessarily true.

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby mrloblaw » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:23 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
mrloblaw wrote:Real grades are IMO one of the things that CCN do right. How can a system that creates incentives to coast by on intellectual laziness, without fully separating the wheat from the chaff, be good for anyone other than the lazy and the stupid? Not to mention that developing the ability to thrive in a competitive, winner-take-all system seems sort of crucial for litigators.

You're argument presupposes that the "bottom" of the class is lazy and/or stupid. Not necessarily true.


In comparison to the sample set, it is. There's going to be a few people even at HYS that are more Thomas Cooley material, but majored in basket weaving at the local community college and worked really hard at the LSAT, right? The set of all LSAT takers is a pretty big sample for crazy shit to start happening with.
Last edited by mrloblaw on Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:24 pm

mrloblaw wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
mrloblaw wrote:Real grades are IMO one of the things that CCN do right. How can a system that creates incentives to coast by on intellectual laziness, without fully separating the wheat from the chaff, be good for anyone other than the lazy and the stupid? Not to mention that developing the ability to thrive in a competitive, winner-take-all system seems sort of crucial for litigators.

You're argument presupposes that the "bottom" of the class is lazy and/or stupid. Not necessarily true.


In comparison to the sample set, it is. There's going to be a few people even at HYS that are more Thomas Cooley material, but majored in basket weaving at the local community college and worked really hard at the LSAT, right?

explain to me how these two statements are congruent

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby mrloblaw » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:13 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:In comparison to the sample set, it is. There's going to be a few people even at HYS that are more Thomas Cooley material, but majored in basket weaving at the local community college and worked really hard at the LSAT, right?

explain to me how these two statements are congruent[/quote]

I guess, to clarify, one of my biggest concerns (had I somehow got into Harvard) would be that the grading system wouldn't allow me to distinguish myself sufficiently for employers from the kids who got in via 4.3s from junk majors at TTT undergrads and whose sole accomplishment in life was pulling it together for one month of LSAT prep. If anything, that would be more stressful for me than real grades.

Is that just not a concern when "mediocre" means "settling" for 2nd Cir/STB instead of SCOTUS/Wachtell?

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IAFG
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby IAFG » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:19 pm

Lol lol lol lol all the lol

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ahduth
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby ahduth » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:36 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
rayiner wrote:If I had to put money on which school will catch the next academic wave I'd put it on NYU.

This will make rigorous UChicago trolls' heads spin. (I do think there is something compelling about the sort of economic-cost-benefit-analysis-meets-humanism-meets-pragmatism school of thought going on at NYU; though of course I have no real basis for comparison, it always seemed to contrast with the "we study the capital-L Law" attitude of Columbia and Chicago.)


Translation: once the legal field realizes what they really want is drunken hipsters, NYU will rise to the top.

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Nov 28, 2011 10:35 pm

ahduth wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:
rayiner wrote:If I had to put money on which school will catch the next academic wave I'd put it on NYU.

This will make rigorous UChicago trolls' heads spin. (I do think there is something compelling about the sort of economic-cost-benefit-analysis-meets-humanism-meets-pragmatism school of thought going on at NYU; though of course I have no real basis for comparison, it always seemed to contrast with the "we study the capital-L Law" attitude of Columbia and Chicago.)


Translation: once the legal field realizes what they really want is drunken hipsters, NYU will rise to the top.

Well, I am SAing at DLA Piper's Bushwick office this summer.

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby DoubleChecks » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:40 am

mrloblaw wrote:I guess, to clarify, one of my biggest concerns (had I somehow got into Harvard) would be that the grading system wouldn't allow me to distinguish myself sufficiently for employers from the kids who got in via 4.3s from junk majors at TTT undergrads and whose sole accomplishment in life was pulling it together for one month of LSAT prep. If anything, that would be more stressful for me than real grades.

Is that just not a concern when "mediocre" means "settling" for 2nd Cir/STB instead of SCOTUS/Wachtell?


if you wanted that 'elite' status, like i said, extremes are still taken into account, and certain firms look for that (Wachtell, W&C, etc.). the rest, i mean, i guess if you personally wanted high grades (but not extremely high) to feel some weird triumph even if it led to no real practical results...im sorry?

lol surprisingly though, there arent that many super lazy people at HLS (though i am sure there are some) as the type that get in tend to not be able to shut 'it' down -- while there isn't some nasty competitive nature, many ppl do work hard regardless. now if your concern is for the type of people who happened to go to a TTT ugrad and got a high GPA (few TTT schools represented here it seems btw...) AND overcame their lazy life attitude and poor work ethic to somehow miraculously bust balls for the LSAT, then revert to their old self once they got in...then yeah, i guess those people got a rather sweet ride (until they get fired from their job :P...unless of course they turn it back on again hahahaha).

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby JamMasterJ » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:45 am

DoubleChecks wrote:
mrloblaw wrote:I guess, to clarify, one of my biggest concerns (had I somehow got into Harvard) would be that the grading system wouldn't allow me to distinguish myself sufficiently for employers from the kids who got in via 4.3s from junk majors at TTT undergrads and whose sole accomplishment in life was pulling it together for one month of LSAT prep. If anything, that would be more stressful for me than real grades.

Is that just not a concern when "mediocre" means "settling" for 2nd Cir/STB instead of SCOTUS/Wachtell?


if you wanted that 'elite' status, like i said, extremes are still taken into account, and certain firms look for that (Wachtell, W&C, etc.). the rest, i mean, i guess if you personally wanted high grades (but not extremely high) to feel some weird triumph even if it led to no real practical results...im sorry?

lol surprisingly though, there arent that many super lazy people at HLS (though i am sure there are some) as the type that get in tend to not be able to shut 'it' down -- while there isn't some nasty competitive nature, many ppl do work hard regardless. now if your concern is for the type of people who happened to go to a TTT ugrad and got a high GPA (few TTT schools represented here it seems btw...) AND overcame their lazy life attitude and poor work ethic to somehow miraculously bust balls for the LSAT, then revert to their old self once they got in...then yeah, i guess those people got a rather sweet ride (until they get fired from their job :P...unless of course they turn it back on again hahahaha).

If what you're going for is incredulous, then I totally agree with this post

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby mrloblaw » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:49 am

DoubleChecks wrote:
mrloblaw wrote:I guess, to clarify, one of my biggest concerns (had I somehow got into Harvard) would be that the grading system wouldn't allow me to distinguish myself sufficiently for employers from the kids who got in via 4.3s from junk majors at TTT undergrads and whose sole accomplishment in life was pulling it together for one month of LSAT prep. If anything, that would be more stressful for me than real grades.

Is that just not a concern when "mediocre" means "settling" for 2nd Cir/STB instead of SCOTUS/Wachtell?


if you wanted that 'elite' status, like i said, extremes are still taken into account, and certain firms look for that (Wachtell, W&C, etc.). the rest, i mean, i guess if you personally wanted high grades (but not extremely high) to feel some weird triumph even if it led to no real practical results...im sorry?

lol surprisingly though, there arent that many super lazy people at HLS (though i am sure there are some) as the type that get in tend to not be able to shut 'it' down -- while there isn't some nasty competitive nature, many ppl do work hard regardless. now if your concern is for the type of people who happened to go to a TTT ugrad and got a high GPA (few TTT schools represented here it seems btw...) AND overcame their lazy life attitude and poor work ethic to somehow miraculously bust balls for the LSAT, then revert to their old self once they got in...then yeah, i guess those people got a rather sweet ride (until they get fired from their job :P...unless of course they turn it back on again hahahaha).


I find your post heartening, as it suggests that there is order in the universe and that, in fact, I am dumber and lazier than HYS kids. As to no practical results, I'm not sure how much better HYS is there than CCN, but I'm hating the results of being presumed median (transfer) here. I'd think a system where I can "stand out" as being top 30%, or top 40%, or whatever as opposed to median is more advantageous to a lot of kids than the huge median swath promoted by your grading system.
Last edited by mrloblaw on Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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IAFG
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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby IAFG » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:49 am

mrloblaw is trolling... right?

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Re: gap between HYS and CCN

Postby mrloblaw » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:56 am

IAFG wrote:mrloblaw is trolling... right?


Probably just drifting between irony, hyperbole, and actually saying what I mean tactlessly enough that it looks that way.




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