CLS v NYU

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Mavraides87
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby Mavraides87 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:06 pm

Do ppl think NYU and CLS will be easier to get into bc of a potential app decline this year?

Or will the app decline be a figment of my imagination

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birdlaw117
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby birdlaw117 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:09 pm

lawschoolgrapedme wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:Number of enrolled law students from a USNews 2010 publication:

Georgetown 1,982
Harvard 1,771
GWU 1,632
Fordham 1,469
NYU 1,427
Columbia 1,310
Texas 1,182
Virginia 1,122
Michigan 1,117
UCLA 1,011
SMU 903
UC-Berkeley 892
WashUStL 856
BU 830
BC 814
Northwestern 814
Penn 790
Minnesota 766
UNC 765
Emory 715
Georgia 694
Ohio State 669
Duke 661
Wm. & Mary 626
Cornell 622
Indiana 620
USC 618
Illinois 617
Yale 613
Vanderbilt 594
Chicago 590
Iowa 590
ASU 576
Stanford 557
Oklahoma 550
Notre Dame 548
Alabama 547
Colorado 547
Univ. Wash. 530
Wake Forest 476
Arizona 475
Baylor 465
BYU 447
West Virginia 418
Utah 400
Cincinnati 391
Wash. & Lee 390
New Mexico 351
Hawaii 326


does this include LLMs or is it just JDs?

No way it includes LLMs. NYU's LLM class is roughly the size of a 1L class.

CanadianWolf
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby CanadianWolf » Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:09 pm

The USNews category does not specify whether or not LLM students are included in this "total full and part-time enrollment".

P.S. First year class size is listed as 449 for NYU & 398 for Columbia. Georgetown's is 593 & Harvard's 565 while Yale is listed as 213.
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

freestallion
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby freestallion » Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:09 pm

Curious1 wrote:
Only if you want to be friends with a super liberal public interest-y type who probably fits in better at Berkeley


I love liberals (not the super in-your-face kind that annoys everyone) and wish I could do public interest...but I like/am addicted to money too much...I think I'll assuage my guilt by donating some of the money I (hope to) make.

If I had to choose between in-your-face liberal PI ppl and uptight douchebags...that's a tough choice. So it has to come down to the moderate students that make up most of the student body.

Again...if it comes down to that. I will make multiple threads.


Don't worry, I will probably make threads too if it comes down to it. I think visiting can change your mind too, and I honestly think the differences aren't as overblown as liberal PI hippies v. uptight douchebags. They're probably more similar than we think.

lawschoolgrapedme
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby lawschoolgrapedme » Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:09 pm

Mavraides87 wrote:Do ppl think NYU and CLS will be easier to get into bc of a potential app decline this year?

Or will the app decline be a figment of my imagination


Possibly a little easier, but I would imagine that it would be so slight that most would not notice it. I wouldn't count on this, since even if there is an app decline, I'm sure NYU and CLS still won't have trouble finding students to come.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:05 pm

Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

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birdlaw117
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby birdlaw117 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:29 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.

luthersloan
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby luthersloan » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:33 pm

birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.


I doubt that is the only reason. Money would be a good reason, the schools are close enough in terms of reputation that anything over a half-scholarship should make it an easy call. Additionally, I know at least a few people who went to NYU over CLS for reasons related to "environment" or "culture." By the way, I think that is a silly reason, but it is certainly not ignorant. I saw all of this as an NYU student who fully acknowledges that CLS is, on net, better.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:35 pm

birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.

I never thought of that, but then again, I go to NYU. QED.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:38 pm

luthersloan wrote:
birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.


I doubt that is the only reason. Money would be a good reason, the schools are close enough in terms of reputation that anything over a half-scholarship should make it an easy call. Additionally, I know at least a few people who went to NYU over CLS for reasons related to "environment" or "culture." By the way, I think that is a silly reason, but it is certainly not ignorant. I saw all of this as an NYU student who fully acknowledges that CLS is, on net, better.

CLS made my skin crawl. Not to put too fine a point on it. Probably an unfair impression but there it is. I haven't really encountered any reason so far to regret it.

Edit: This is actually a little revisionist, it was 90% fine and 10% unaccountably bad vibes. Still, one person's experience.
Last edited by dixiecupdrinking on Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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birdlaw117
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby birdlaw117 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:38 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.

I never thought of that, but then again, I go to NYU. QED.

As do I... :wink:

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:39 pm

birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:
birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.

I never thought of that, but then again, I go to NYU. QED.

As do I... :wink:

:lol: I looked at your profile before writing a more indignant response.

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lzyovrachievr
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby lzyovrachievr » Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:59 am

Passing on the baiting.

American_in_China
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby American_in_China » Tue Oct 25, 2011 3:21 am

They're both fantastic schools with different focuses. Why is this a big deal? Chicago owns Chicago, NYU does better in NYC, Chicago has academia and clerkships, NYU does public interest.

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ahduth
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby ahduth » Tue Oct 25, 2011 7:41 am

Passed on CLS, as the ASW cohort had the personality of wallpaper. And anyone who's done their homework knows NYU has equal job prospects.

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booboo
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby booboo » Tue Oct 25, 2011 7:54 am

dixiecupdrinking wrote:CLS made my skin crawl. Not to put too fine a point on it. Probably an unfair impression but there it is. I haven't really encountered any reason so far to regret it.

Edit: This is actually a little revisionist, it was 90% fine and 10% unaccountably bad vibes. Still, one person's experience.


birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:
birdlaw117 wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Oh, good. An original topic.

I'll just drop a note in here that lots of people choose NYU over CLS each and every year. Why?

Ignorance.

I never thought of that, but then again, I go to NYU. QED.

As do I... :wink:


ahduth wrote:Passed on CLS, as the ASW cohort had the personality of wallpaper. And anyone who's done their homework knows NYU has equal job prospects.


LOL, this year NYU will drop out of the preftigious T14. Count it!

American_in_China wrote:They're both fantastic schools with different focuses. Why is this a big deal? Chicago owns Chicago, NYU does better in NYC, Chicago has academia and clerkships, NYU does public interest.


Guess you're missing the general theme of this thread, nice job.

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ahduth
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby ahduth » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:23 am

Booboo, you're not terribly aware of the structure of the legal market are you? CLS and NYU are functionally the same for big law firms in NYC. And NYC is the largest legal market around. Beyond that, CLS is more geographically portable for corporate work, while NYU owns the PI market. Please don't spread disinformation.

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kwais
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby kwais » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:33 am

diclaimer. unabashed CLS lover, but isn't the PI difference overstated. Between self-selection, the fact that most NYU kids do biglaw and the fact that CLS has access to NYU's PI fair, isn't it more about the culture than the actual opportunities?

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booboo
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby booboo » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:41 am

ahduth wrote:Booboo, you're not terribly aware of the structure of the legal market are you? CLS and NYU are functionally the same for big law firms in NYC. And NYC is the largest legal market around. Beyond that, CLS is more geographically portable for corporate work, while NYU owns the PI market. Please don't spread disinformation.


I'd hope I am, I'm in the same year as you at NYU.

There was no disinformation being spread. :). Once we have our OCS presentation, we can (at least for ourselves) know the position NYU is in, when comparing to Columbia.

I'd even go out on a limb and say neither is more geographically portable. Every other market has incredible entrance costs that are mostly irreverent to the type of school, outside of HY and S to some degree. I am going beyond the typical big market locales, if we are talking geographic portability.

I'm not sure if NYU owns the PI market, though.

kwais wrote:diclaimer. unabashed CLS lover, but isn't the PI difference overstated. Between self-selection, the fact that most NYU kids do biglaw and the fact that CLS has access to NYU's PI fair, isn't it more about the culture than the actual opportunities?


Actual opportunities may be greater... We really are more or less "forced" into at least considering PI as an opportunity. Having an unabashed (see what I did there?) corporate focus, even I am beginning to at least wonder what PI I could get myself into.

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ahduth
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby ahduth » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:53 am

kwais wrote:diclaimer. unabashed CLS lover, but isn't the PI difference overstated. Between self-selection, the fact that most NYU kids do biglaw and the fact that CLS has access to NYU's PI fair, isn't it more about the culture than the actual opportunities?


Not based on the amount of PILC spam I get. And CLS's need to front up their ASW with a testimony to how they're working on their PI program didn't reassure anyone at all.

The fact that CLS kids need to use NYU's PI fair (which I hadn't been aware of) is telling.

That being said, the vast majority of NYU people take big law jobs.

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ahduth
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby ahduth » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:57 am

booboo wrote:I'd hope I am, I'm in the same year as you at NYU.


Sheeeit. Which section?

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booboo
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby booboo » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:59 am

ahduth wrote:
booboo wrote:I'd hope I am, I'm in the same year as you at NYU.


Sheeeit. Which section?


The only one that matters. 1.

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ahduth
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby ahduth » Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:07 am

booboo wrote:
ahduth wrote:
booboo wrote:I'd hope I am, I'm in the same year as you at NYU.


Sheeeit. Which section?


The only one that matters. 1.


Mm hmm.

http://www.law.nyu.edu/news/MILLER_CBE

Curious1
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby Curious1 » Tue Oct 25, 2011 11:39 am

Can anyone ACTUALLY talk about exactly how many people were unemployed last year at each school (as of OCI). General arguments are all fine and both schools are great, yes yes, but can we get some numbers?

If no such numbers are available...then that's telling too.

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birdlaw117
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Re: CLS v NYU

Postby birdlaw117 » Tue Oct 25, 2011 11:50 am

Curious1 wrote:Can anyone ACTUALLY talk about exactly how many people were unemployed last year at each school (as of OCI). General arguments are all fine and both schools are great, yes yes, but can we get some numbers?

If no such numbers are available...then that's telling too.

The thing is, as of OCI isn't really all that helpful (assuming you mean through OCI, because when OCI starts nobody has jobs). OCI numbers really only show job prospects at certain firms. Granted, those are, for the most part, the firms that most students want to work at. That doesn't, however, include PI or Gov't jobs, which NYU has a larger self-selecting group for, and it also doesn't include many secondary markets that people might be targeting. Basically what I'm saying is those numbers are probably not as telling as one might think.

Also, the OCI numbers exist, but students at each school aren't supposed to share them.




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