New Mexican Law

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blueprint87
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby blueprint87 » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:26 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
blueprint87 wrote:OP, UNM does have a pretty good lock on the state. However, it won't necessarily be hard to break in with an outside degree. It helps if you have ties though. You'll want to have a good reason to tell employers why you want to be here. I was born and raised in Albuquerque but am attending Wisconsin-Madison right now and have had luck working this summer in NM and plan to come back. Let me know if you have any questions.

OP has never been to NM, and the school he's attending has ZERO portability


JMJ - Nowhere in my post did I say that. I am well aware that OP has never been to NM. I simply stated that it would help to have ties.

OP - I found most of the employers through places like NALP, Google, and through my connections in the state. What are you interested in? I might be able to suggest some places and if you're lucky, I may have contact info.

andythefir
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby andythefir » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:33 pm

NM is, like other small states, a poor and poorly educated state (it’s always racing with Mississippi to the bottom of rankings) with a very low concentration of people outside of Albuquerque and Santa Fe. While there are some killer engineering jobs available in the national labs the majority of residents simply have no need for an attorney through the majority of their lives. NM can be a great place to live and if you want to practice here go to UNM. I graduated high school with a guy who went to an ivy, aced the LSAT and is considering UNM law because he thinks it will set him up better in this state than any other school.
Also, as with other rural places, the natural skepticism of outsiders is multiplied exponentially when it comes to NY.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby JamMasterJ » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:34 pm

blueprint87 wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
blueprint87 wrote:OP, UNM does have a pretty good lock on the state. However, it won't necessarily be hard to break in with an outside degree. It helps if you have ties though. You'll want to have a good reason to tell employers why you want to be here. I was born and raised in Albuquerque but am attending Wisconsin-Madison right now and have had luck working this summer in NM and plan to come back. Let me know if you have any questions.

OP has never been to NM, and the school he's attending has ZERO portability


JMJ - Nowhere in my post did I say that. I am well aware that OP has never been to NM. I simply stated that it would help to have ties.

OP - I found most of the employers through places like NALP, Google, and through my connections in the state. What are you interested in? I might be able to suggest some places and if you're lucky, I may have contact info.

I wasn't arguing with you, just pointing out that he probably doesn't have the ties you mentioned

blueprint87
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby blueprint87 » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:41 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
blueprint87 wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
blueprint87 wrote:OP, UNM does have a pretty good lock on the state. However, it won't necessarily be hard to break in with an outside degree. It helps if you have ties though. You'll want to have a good reason to tell employers why you want to be here. I was born and raised in Albuquerque but am attending Wisconsin-Madison right now and have had luck working this summer in NM and plan to come back. Let me know if you have any questions.

OP has never been to NM, and the school he's attending has ZERO portability


JMJ - Nowhere in my post did I say that. I am well aware that OP has never been to NM. I simply stated that it would help to have ties.

OP - I found most of the employers through places like NALP, Google, and through my connections in the state. What are you interested in? I might be able to suggest some places and if you're lucky, I may have contact info.

I wasn't arguing with you, just pointing out that he probably doesn't have the ties you mentioned


Agree with you JMJ.

I think OP can get them. The NM employer I am at right now actually has more outside-of-the-state interns than people from UNM and several did not have any ties whatsoever to the state until now.

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scrowell
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby scrowell » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:50 pm

Blueprint: You've been really helpful, I greatly appreciate it! To be totally honest, I'm not 100% sure I know what I want to do yet. I'm definitely interested in being a public defender (would gov't jobs down there be especially hard to get as an out-of-stater?), but I'm definitely open to pretty much anything (we'll see if that changes when I start LS). Anyway, again, I appreciate all of the info, and if you have any links or whatever I'd greatly appreciate those too.

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scrowell
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby scrowell » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:54 pm

andythefir wrote:NM is, like other small states, a poor and poorly educated state (it’s always racing with Mississippi to the bottom of rankings) with a very low concentration of people outside of Albuquerque and Santa Fe. While there are some killer engineering jobs available in the national labs the majority of residents simply have no need for an attorney through the majority of their lives. NM can be a great place to live and if you want to practice here go to UNM. I graduated high school with a guy who went to an ivy, aced the LSAT and is considering UNM law because he thinks it will set him up better in this state than any other school.
Also, as with other rural places, the natural skepticism of outsiders is multiplied exponentially when it comes to NY.


I could totally see that from some of the less educated people, but do you really think NM lawyers (the people that would be hiring me) would have that attitude? I'm not trying to question your credibility or anything, it would just be genuinely surprising to me if the more educated people held those types of prejudices.

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Bill Cosby
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby Bill Cosby » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:05 pm

scrowell wrote:
andythefir wrote:NM is, like other small states, a poor and poorly educated state (it’s always racing with Mississippi to the bottom of rankings) with a very low concentration of people outside of Albuquerque and Santa Fe. While there are some killer engineering jobs available in the national labs the majority of residents simply have no need for an attorney through the majority of their lives. NM can be a great place to live and if you want to practice here go to UNM. I graduated high school with a guy who went to an ivy, aced the LSAT and is considering UNM law because he thinks it will set him up better in this state than any other school.
Also, as with other rural places, the natural skepticism of outsiders is multiplied exponentially when it comes to NY.


I could totally see that from some of the less educated people, but do you really think NM lawyers (the people that would be hiring me) would have that attitude? I'm not trying to question your credibility or anything, it would just be genuinely surprising to me if the more educated people held those types of prejudices.


Hiring you personally? Yeah, but that's because you're going to CUNY.

andythefir
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby andythefir » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:09 pm

You may well prove me extremely wrong (if NM is what you want I hope you do). That having been said, while federal jobs have lots of out of state folks, they mostly got on the GS gravy train years ago and got transferred after working for the feds for years. And if you’re opposed to clouds, cold, or water you’re looking at the small towns in the south where no one ever leaves. So whoever is hiring is looking at someone who went to high school with their cousin, NM state with their brother, and UNM law with their neighbor v someone from NY. Don’t mean to say it’s impossible, I’m just surprised the previous poster’s employer has so many folks without ties because that hasn’t been my experience at all.

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Bill Cosby
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby Bill Cosby » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:14 pm

andythefir wrote:You may well prove me extremely wrong (if NM is what you want I hope you do). That having been said, while federal jobs have lots of out of state folks, they mostly got on the GS gravy train years ago and got transferred after working for the feds for years. And if you’re opposed to clouds, cold, or water you’re looking at the small towns in the south where no one ever leaves. So whoever is hiring is looking at someone who went to high school with their cousin, NM state with their brother, and UNM law with their neighbor v someone from NY. Don’t mean to say it’s impossible, I’m just surprised the previous poster’s employer has so many folks without ties because that hasn’t been my experience at all.


Lol @ "GS gravy train".

BeautifulSW
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby BeautifulSW » Wed Jul 20, 2011 6:21 pm

I've lived in almost every corner of New Mexico over the last thirty years, took my J.D. from UNM twenty-five years ago, and will retire from state employ as a lawyer in the not too distant future. The state has been very good to me.

Couple of points:

Weird as it sounds to others' ears, the N.Mex. bug CAN bite after just one short visit. Hard to say why but if you love open space, bright sun, and a place where wildly different cultures jostle along together with remarkably little friction (and you are addicted to hot chile), N.Mex. is unique.

The state is also incredibly isolated. It takes FOREVER to get anywhere from here.

The state is very, very poor. Salaries and incomes here tend to be significantly lower than in surrounding states.

The state is growing very slowly compared with surrounding states.

If you come here and do not land one of the (very) few quasi-BigLaw jobs, your first lawyer job might pay $35-40K. If you went to UNM Law, you can just about afford that. If you owe $120K, forget it.

UNM Law almost owns the Albuquerque-Santa Fe markets except at those few largish firms who like to recruit from the Chosen Few. Even so, salaries at those places will be less than in surrounding states. But getting into UNM Law is much harder than stats suggest. They have a STRONG preference for in-state residents.

There is work here. You want a lawyer job, you can probably get a lawyer job. But your first job might be on the Great Plains rather than the Rocky Mountains. Speaking "Baptist" helps out there.

I've wanted to leave (officially) for thirty years. But the truth is, nothing could ever have pried me away after I got out of law school and landed my first job. The place gets into your soul.

Army2Law
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby Army2Law » Wed Jul 20, 2011 6:31 pm

AreJay711 wrote:Sooo... you've never been to NM but want to spend your life there? lol ok :lol:

6/10 troll

Actually, it's usually people who've never been to NM who would rather spend their lives there, but, I digress.

Also, OP, you're not going to have an easy time getting a law job in NM straight from a CUNY school. You'll probably have an easier time if you get a couple of years of work experience after graduating, but it still won't be easy. NM is very parochial.

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sunynp
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby sunynp » Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:25 pm

OP: perhaps immigration is a good field for you? CUNY has a good immigration program. A good friend volunteers at their citizenship events.

I have no idea if they need immigration lawyers in New Mexico. However, it is something that you could get that might be portable from CUNY to other states. BUT: very low probability of this happening. I agree with the other people in the thread who are trying to give you a reality check.

I hope you are real OP because you make me smile too.

seatown12
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby seatown12 » Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:14 am

Army2Law wrote:Actually, it's usually people who've never been to NM who would rather spend their lives there, but, I digress.

I stayed in Albuquerque for a night while driving from LA to St Louis. All I kept thinking was how appropriate a setting it was for Breaking Bad.

BeautifulSW
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby BeautifulSW » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:09 am

No, there's not much immigration law practiced here in N.Mex. Most of it around here is done in El Paso and most of THAT is done on a legal aid basis. Interesting work but not too well paying. But El Paso is a rather good place for a new lawyer to be these days according to the ABA. I personally wouldn't mind living there at all. It's a very cool city if you like things Mexican and speak a modicum of Spanish. (And don't mind the occasional stray shot from across the river...but that's nothing new in El Paso history!)

El Paso County is called "The Edge of Texas" and it's so far out West that the city doesn't feel particularly Texan. More like New Mexico but better off.

The Texas Bar Exam has a fairly evil reputation though not as bad as California or New York.

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scrowell
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby scrowell » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:35 am

Hey everyone, I really appreciate the thoughtful responses. It sounds like I'm in for a bit of an uphill battle, but I think if I play my cards right, working in NM could definitely be feasible for me!

Bill Cosby: C'mon my public school brother! Don't be such a pessimist.
andythefir: That makes sense. I guess I'll just have to work harder to prove myself.
BeautifulSW: Really appreciate your feedback! It's great to hear from someone who has live there for so long! I'm really not that worried about salary. I'm budgeting VERY carefully, I have no undergrad debt (went for nearly free), my school is very cheap, and my parents are helping me a bit, so I'm looking at between 30-50k in loans (depending on what I get for summer work) by the time I graduate. I definitely wouldn't mind a lower paying job, especially one with a legal-aid clinic. That leads me to the next poster:
sunynp: Immigration sounds interesting to me, and if CUNY has a good program, I'll definitely check it out. Thanks for the heads up! I do know that we don't do any clinical programs until 3L or second half of 2L, but I'll keep it in mind! And I'm real, don't listen to the haters in this thread. Some people take life too seriously I guess.
seatown: Is Breaking Bad a movie set in NM? Maybe I should check it out.
BeautifulSW (again): Legal aid employment in El Paso sounds cool too...I'll be sure to check it out when I go down to NM. Or maybe if I find an internship opportunity there I'll just road trip to NM a time or two. Do you think a job there could lead to a similar job in New Mexico (especially considering how important contacts are in NM)?

Thanks again everyone! :)

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scrowell
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby scrowell » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:50 pm

UPDATE: Did research on El Paso, TX. Looks really awesome! Same cheap housing and nice climate as New Mexico, and it seems to have more going on than Las Cruces. Does anyone have any info on what life/law employment is like in El Paso? Thanks! Hopefully I can catch a flight to El Paso and rent a car to drive to Las Cruces at some point to check them out in person.

Also, what are people's thoughts on Albuquerque vs. El Paso?

BeautifulSW
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby BeautifulSW » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:00 pm

Albuquerque v. El Paso? I don't know what the difference in the job markets might be; El Paso is about the same size as El Burque (slang) but there's more commercial stuff going on in ELP, I think. There are also a lot more Texan lawyers around to service those clients.

Albuquerque has the better climate and much easier access to Santa Fe and the scenic and cultural treasures of Northern New Mexico. El Paso has Juarez. Don't sneer; Juarez is a remarkable city, incredibly diverse and filled with wonderful places to shop and eat. Just be out before nightfall. I mean it. BE OUT BEFORE NIGHTFALL!

Over the last five years, THIRTY-FIVE THOUSAND people have been murdered in Mexico, most in Juarez and the State of Chihuahua. Nevertheless, I DO travel in Northern Mexico on short vacations and enjoy myself immensely. But I am very, very careful as to where I go and how I get there.

Las Cruces has nothing likely to be of interest to a young person. There's the State University but somehow it doesn't generate the kind of ferment you will find around UNM in Albuquerque. Don't move here. You won't be happy. I've lived here in L.C. for, what, 17 years? If you are married, fine. Kids? Great. Finding a mate? Forget it. Night life is nonexistent. Not so in El Paso or Albuquerque.

Las Cruces is significantly more expensive to live in than El Paso and somewhat more expensive than Albuquerque. (My opinion.) State law jobs are fairly readily available in Albuquerque, Santa Fe, and Las Cruces but as always, the pay is dismal and we want to see two or three years of experience.

Army2Law
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby Army2Law » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:06 pm

seatown12 wrote:I stayed in Albuquerque for a night while driving from LA to St Louis. All I kept thinking was how appropriate a setting it was for Breaking Bad.

Lol. TITCR

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vanwinkle
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby vanwinkle » Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:52 am

Since OP is a 0L, moved to an appropriate 0L forum.

andythefir
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby andythefir » Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:17 pm

Never consider making any kind of steps towards comitting to El Paso in any way before visiting. Sprawling city with very little English spoken, dirty walmarts and bullets literally hitting buildings from Juarez. Also, never go to Juarez if you're not a combat expert.

SchopenhauerFTW
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby SchopenhauerFTW » Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:29 pm

Santa Fe/Albuquerque, NM > El Paso TX.

New Mexico is beautiful. It's hard to settle there though as an outsider.

BeautifulSW
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby BeautifulSW » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:05 pm

The description of El Paso is not accurate. Twenty years ago, I might have agreed but not now. It isn't dirty, there's been extensive downtown restoration and renewal, it's one of the safest cities of its size in the U.S. and yes, a lot of Spanish is spoken. So what. A lot of English is spoken in Juarez. That's what being on the border means.

Regarding Juarez, well, I can't say too much because even around here I am in a small minority. Fact is, most Southern New Mexicans and many El Pasoans who used to cross the border routinely no longer do so because of the violence. A good many Juarez residents, those with border crossing cards or dual nationality, are spending their nights in El Paso and commuting into Juarez only for work or school.

People are afraid. The city is dangerous mostly in certain places and during certain times of day, meaning after dark unless you are fool enough to go into the southeastern barrios. Go there and you deserve whatever you get. But the commercial center of the city during daylight is scary mostly for the hordes of uniformed men with machine guns and badges and balaclavas than for the chance of seeing actual violence. I do find it hard to remind myself that those guys are there to PROTECT me. But that's what the government SAYS, anyway...

andythefir
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby andythefir » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:19 pm

I may be willing of confirmation bias (looking down El Paso is one of the few things NM and TX can agree on) but when I was there earlier this year I found it to be as I remembered. I did not stay downtown, which may explain it. It is probably on balance somewhere between the chaotic supermarket I remember and the new downtown mentioned but I would think practicing law there would be pretty rough. Violence from Juarez spilling over, political pressure from Austin etc., which may explain why law jobs are available.

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scrowell
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby scrowell » Fri Jul 22, 2011 11:04 pm

SchopenhauerFTW wrote:Santa Fe/Albuquerque, NM > El Paso TX.

New Mexico is beautiful. It's hard to settle there though as an outsider.


Why do you think it's hard to settle there as an outsider?

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20160810
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Re: New Mexican Law

Postby 20160810 » Fri Jul 22, 2011 11:46 pm

In case this isn't a flame: I lived in NM for years and it still wasn't "ties to the area" enough to get me a single interview with a single ABQ firm despite having good grades at a T25 school. They get a whole lot of East Coast blowhards who want to move to NM for about ten minutes, and they care a lot about ties. You will not find a job in the state. Don't bother looking.




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