What is the best option?

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Best choice?

WUSTL +$84,000
4
10%
MINN +$60,000
2
5%
ILL +$90,000
11
28%
IUB +$120,000
1
3%
IOWA Full Ride
4
10%
Lower-range T-14 Sticker
17
44%
 
Total votes: 39

ArtVandalay
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:19 am

What is the best option?

Postby ArtVandalay » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:38 am

What would be the best choice here, if location is not hugely important, and Big Law is a goal.

WUSTL +$84,000
MINN +$60,000
ILL +$90,000
IUB +$120,000
IOWA Full Ride
Lower-range T-14 Sticker

Please provide explanations for votes

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mrtoren
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Re: What is the best option?

Postby mrtoren » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:46 am

Tough call. U of I or lower range T-14 at sticker if I had to choose. U of I will easily open up Chicago, which is a legal mecca compared to Minnesota, Wisconsin and Iowa. However, a lower range T-14 would do even more.

U of I.

weejonbu
Posts: 219
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2009 8:48 pm

Re: What is the best option?

Postby weejonbu » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:48 am

Just list the lower range T-14 so we know what you're talking about... why list the name of every other school and not that one?

dadamafia
Posts: 42
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Re: What is the best option?

Postby dadamafia » Mon Jun 13, 2011 12:47 pm

The real decision here is between UIUC and the lower T-14 (Cornell? Georgetown?). If I were in your position, and had no issue with working in Chicago (even though a respectable 30-40% end up working outside Illinois), I'd happily take the money and go to UIUC. Champaign isn't a bad place to spend 3 years focusing on your studies, and it won't burn a hole through your pocket. The College of Law has a good vibe about it, has a great community, and the job prospects aren't too shabby either. I have not heard of many students lining up to leave after knocking out 1L either, so they must be doing something right.

Hmm? viewtopic.php?f=1&t=150700

ArtVandalay
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:19 am

Re: What is the best option?

Postby ArtVandalay » Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:03 pm

Thanks for the response. I do favor Illinois and also as a personal preference would love to work in Chicago (but not sure about their economy now). What is the difference between MINN and ILL? (Minn ranked slightly higher) No love for Washu at almost the same money?

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bk1
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Re: What is the best option?

Postby bk1 » Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:40 pm

There are two separate questions here:

What is the best option for biglaw? - Without a doubt it is the lower T14. The other schools are only putting 1/4 or so of their class into biglaw. So if you really want biglaw this is the choice you should make. However that then begs the question of whether it is financially worth it. If you feel a coinflip (basically 50/50 chance, depending on which lower T14) of getting biglaw at the cost of $200,000 is worth it to you then take the lower T14. You're not going to get a much better chance than that at biglaw.

What is the best financial decision? - This is where the lower T14 at sticker loses out. While it is the best at getting you biglaw, and by a large margin, it is a decidedly risky choice considering there is a very real chance that you end with $200k worth of debt and a $30-60k job. Because of that your other options are probably better financial decisions than a lower T14 at sticker.

Which then leads to a much murkier question of cost vs prospects and I think that argument favors either WUSTL or UMinn. My reasoning being is that out of all these schools, I think that WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois tend to be peers. While Illinois/WUSTL place more NLJ250, UMinn does have a comparable amount of grads placed into 6 figure jobs that isn't accounted for by the NLJ250. I also normally would say that WUSTL=Illinois, but after looking at http://www.lawschooltransparency.com it seems like WUSTL/UMinn placed 80% of their 2009 grads into full time lawyer jobs whereas Illinois only placed 70%. In this instance I think it makes sense to take WUSTL/UMinn over Illinois at equal or even slightly higher cost.

IUB/Iowa are decent deals but they are comparatively weak to WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois at placing grads into 6 figure jobs. So yes they are less risky but since WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois only cost about $100,000, they aren't too risky themselves. So, for the best financial decision I think you should pick WUSTL or UMinn depending on whether you prefer Minnesota or you prefer the rest of the midwest.

ArtVandalay
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:19 am

Re: What is the best option?

Postby ArtVandalay » Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:55 pm

bk1 wrote:There are two separate questions here:

What is the best option for biglaw? - Without a doubt it is the lower T14. The other schools are only putting 1/4 or so of their class into biglaw. So if you really want biglaw this is the choice you should make. However that then begs the question of whether it is financially worth it. If you feel a coinflip (basically 50/50 chance, depending on which lower T14) of getting biglaw at the cost of $200,000 is worth it to you then take the lower T14. You're not going to get a much better chance than that at biglaw.

What is the best financial decision? - This is where the lower T14 at sticker loses out. While it is the best at getting you biglaw, and by a large margin, it is a decidedly risky choice considering there is a very real chance that you end with $200k worth of debt and a $30-60k job. Because of that your other options are probably better financial decisions than a lower T14 at sticker.

Which then leads to a much murkier question of cost vs prospects and I think that argument favors either WUSTL or UMinn. My reasoning being is that out of all these schools, I think that WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois tend to be peers. While Illinois/WUSTL place more NLJ250, UMinn does have a comparable amount of grads placed into 6 figure jobs that isn't accounted for by the NLJ250. I also normally would say that WUSTL=Illinois, but after looking at http://www.lawschooltransparency.com it seems like WUSTL/UMinn placed 80% of their 2009 grads into full time lawyer jobs whereas Illinois only placed 70%. In this instance I think it makes sense to take WUSTL/UMinn over Illinois at equal or even slightly higher cost.

IUB/Iowa are decent deals but they are comparatively weak to WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois at placing grads into 6 figure jobs. So yes they are less risky but since WUSTL/UMinn/Illinois only cost about $100,000, they aren't too risky themselves. So, for the best financial decision I think you should pick WUSTL or UMinn depending on whether you prefer Minnesota or you prefer the rest of the midwest.


I know I could probably find this somewhere but where does WUSTL place their grads with the 6-figure salaries? I know I have heard that UMinn places mostly in Minneapolis, although with good jobs. I wouldn't mind living in Minneapolis but also other cities in the midwest I would be fine with, especially Chicago

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bk1
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Re: What is the best option?

Postby bk1 » Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:58 pm

ArtVandalay wrote:I know I could probably find this somewhere but where does WUSTL place their grads with the 6-figure salaries? I know I have heard that UMinn places mostly in Minneapolis, although with good jobs. I wouldn't mind living in Minneapolis but also other cities in the midwest I would be fine with, especially Chicago


The 2005 data (source: NLJ) says that the majority of WUSTL grads then stayed in MO. I'd imagine that WUSTL has since grown more diverse but to what degree it is hard to tell. That being said, I have heard and think it makes sense that Chicago is WUSTL's primary market for biglaw but you have to keep in mind that a significant number of WUSTL grads don't get Chicago at all.

ArtVandalay
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:19 am

Re: What is the best option?

Postby ArtVandalay » Mon Jun 13, 2011 2:00 pm

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what are the other midwest cities with the largest biglaw markets? Or markets where you can get a 6-figure starting salary out of a school like Washu? If I am set on Chicago I'd probably rather just attend U of I but if not then I think WUSTL could be better

splitster1221
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 12:58 am

Re: What is the best option?

Postby splitster1221 » Tue Jun 14, 2011 12:44 pm

Close call... I voted for WUSTL, although if lower T14 is Cornell I'd probably really consider that

Z3RO
Posts: 526
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:57 am

Re: What is the best option?

Postby Z3RO » Tue Jun 14, 2011 12:59 pm

I had to make a similar decision and settled on lower T14. My understanding is that OCI at WUSTL has been brutal these last two years, and I held out no hope of getting a job outside of St. Louis with a degree from there.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: What is the best option?

Postby JamMasterJ » Tue Jun 14, 2011 2:41 pm

tl;dr, but are you a resident in the state of any of these state schools? I think Illinois or the T-14 option is probably TCR either way, but as a Minnesota resident or something, that factor changes things a bit




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