. Forum

[glewz]

T30 school, half the price of Vandy, NC desired market --> OP, go to UNC

[Grizz]

T30 school

What the hell does this even mean

[TheFactor]

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[stratocophic]

I can't believe people are voting UNC here. This is a no-brainer. Yeah, you want to work in UNC. But the Vandy name carries for sure. Vandy grads in 2009 grads jobs at Alston, Cadwalader, Dechert, K&L Gates, Moore and Van Allen (yes this was 2009, but the name carries, and it carries well). Only one person is working in NC this year from 2010, but keep in mind that people at Vandy spread out, and if you come, you will be one of only a very few people gunning for NC in your class, which is nice, as opposed to basically 100% or UNC people.

Plus let's be real, the UNC market sucks right now. Vandy will open up more options in major markets (NY, DC), and if you have other Southern ties, you will open up those markets to in a way Vandy won't. The only way I'd recommend UNC is if you would NOT be happy working ANYWHERE else, and even then, I might still go.

Damn, I was hoping someone from Vandy would jump in and say "UNC!" or vice versa lol. I realize that Vandy will open up many more options, but I don't want to be forced to gun for biglaw in order to pay off debt. Due to Vandy's average-at-best LRAP, loans of $140-150k w/ interest would prevent me from willingly going into gov/public interest work. If I knew I wanted biglaw, this would be a no-brainer. But do you think it's still a no-brainer for someone who may end up wanting gov/PI?

That's what IBR is for

[TheFactor]

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[drylo]

If you really want to stay in NC, then UNC might be a decent option. But honestly, you're still paying a fair amount for UNC. You should be able to get out of Vandy for less than $140, if you want to. Also, the placement disparity not only matters for post-LS, but also for 2L summer (and 1L summer for some people). If the placement disparity is 30% (guessing based on the numbers thrown around in this thread), then 30% more Vandy students will also make $15-30k over 2L summer.

It's a big decision, to be sure, and I think you should go with your gut to a large extent. I will say this: perhaps surprisingly, I don't know many people at Vandy who are from NC. I know some who went to UNC/Duke/Davidson for undergrad, but I really don't see a lot of native North Carolinians. I think this could be to your advantage at OCI. If you have halfway decent grades and put a NC address (or something) on your resume, I suspect that you could get a lot of OCI interviews in NC (and interest through Symplicity).

[Grizz]

If you really want to stay in NC, then UNC might be a decent option. But honestly, you're still paying a fair amount for UNC. You should be able to get out of Vandy for less than $140, if you want to. Also, the placement disparity not only matters for post-LS, but also for 2L summer (and 1L summer for some people). If the placement disparity is 30% (guessing based on the numbers thrown around in this thread), then 30% more Vandy students will also make $15-30k over 2L summer.

It's a big decision, to be sure, and I think you should go with your gut to a large extent. I will say this: perhaps surprisingly, I don't know many people at Vandy who are from NC. I know some who went to UNC/Duke/Davidson for undergrad, but I really don't see a lot of native North Carolinians. I think this could be to your advantage at OCI. If you have halfway decent grades and put a NC address (or something) on your resume, I suspect that you could get a lot of OCI interviews in NC (and interest through Symplicity).

All of the above is great stuff. I echo drylo in that while I hang out with a lot of Southern people, I know 0 people from NC.

[Grizz]

I can't believe people are voting UNC here. This is a no-brainer. Yeah, you want to work in UNC. But the Vandy name carries for sure. Vandy grads in 2009 grads jobs at Alston, Cadwalader, Dechert, K&L Gates, Moore and Van Allen (yes this was 2009, but the name carries, and it carries well). Only one person is working in NC this year from 2010, but keep in mind that people at Vandy spread out, and if you come, you will be one of only a very few people gunning for NC in your class, which is nice, as opposed to basically 100% or UNC people.

Plus let's be real, the UNC market sucks right now. Vandy will open up more options in major markets (NY, DC), and if you have other Southern ties, you will open up those markets to in a way Vandy won't. The only way I'd recommend UNC is if you would NOT be happy working ANYWHERE else, and even then, I might still go.

Damn, I was hoping someone from Vandy would jump in and say "UNC!" or vice versa lol. I realize that Vandy will open up many more options, but I don't want to be forced to gun for biglaw in order to pay off debt. Due to Vandy's average-at-best LRAP, loans of $140-150k w/ interest would prevent me from willingly going into gov/public interest work. If I knew I wanted biglaw, this would be a no-brainer. But do you think it's still a no-brainer for someone who may end up wanting gov/PI?

That's what IBR is for

Assuming IBR is even an option in the future...

Fair, but I think 10 yr. PI/GOV is a safer bet time-wise and more politically safe than the 25 yr. one.

[thickfreakness]

NC's a tight market. I think that going to Vanderbilt and having strong ties back to the state would be very beneficial in helping you break in to the market. As one who was stuck with the tier 1/dominant in-state school versus out-of state (but still in the region) top school, I went back and forth quite a bit on my decision, since I'm fairly sure I want to work in my home state. I strongly think that coming to the higher ranked school was the right decision. Firms in my home state were very receptive, as there usually aren't many (or any) people from my school trying to go back there. It helps you stand out in a very positive way and guarantees at least a screening interview. You need to have a good story for why you went out of state for school (no, it can't be that Vandy is more prestigious than UNC, since you'll likely be interviewing with UNC grads), but if you can sell that you want to be back in NC they'll be all over you. Just make sure you get in touch with the NC firms early (read as: possibly this summer before you start, definitely during the fall) and then send cover letter/resumes out on December 1st so your interest is sincere. Some firms here hire 1Ls, and if they already know your name and interest level before your application arrives you're going to be way ahead of the curve.

[scammedhard]

OP, earlier I stated that you should go to UNC and save some money. Here is why:

At the price you'll be paying for Vandy, it works out fine if you get into big law, otherwise it will take you a long time to get out of the hole. Are your chances of getting into big law from Vandy great? No. Mostly likely you will end up with some other job, one that will be similar to the one you can get from UNC in NC, except that you will have paid 140K instead of 70K for it. By going to Vandy, instead of UNC, you are buying extra tickets for the big law lottery. Are those tickets worth 70-80K? IMO, No.

[TheFactor]

Judging from the mixed responses and poll results, sounds like I should just flip a coin.

[Moral_Midgetry]

Have you visited both? If so, which did you prefer?

[Flips88]

I can't believe people are voting UNC here. This is a no-brainer.

[Aberzombie1892]

Neither one is a particularly good bet.

On one hand, you have the best public law school in NC (which competes with two schools that are considered to be peers or better).

On the other hand, you have Vanderbilt, the best private school in the south (sans Duke) at twice the price of the aforementioned public school.

I would ultimately try to get employment data from the class of 2010 from each school (at graduation). You are admitted to both, and so you should be able to convince career services to do this. Once you get your hands on the data, you'll know which school is a better deal (don't interpret this as me voting for Vanderbilt; think of it as a quantifiable way to compare the costs and benefits of the two schools - Sure Vandy will be better, but by how much? You won't know without the data).

[TheFactor]

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[TheFactor]

I can't believe people are voting UNC here. This is a no-brainer.

Kind of surprising that you guys think this is a no-brainer. Care to elaborate or add anything to what Rad said?

[stylishlaw]

I went to school and lived in the area for a couple years. While I sincerely believe that the Triangle is undergoing a massive transformation and will look entirely different in 15 years, right now it's basically suburban sprawl. Nashville, while not a large city, seems like it will offer a different experience for three years. I like UNC though and it's a great choice if you are dead set on working in NC. If you even entertain the slightest possibility of working outside NC then I would pick Vandy here as a no-brainer. But UNC grads basically run that state.

No wrong choice here really.

[Flips88]

I can't believe people are voting UNC here. This is a no-brainer.

Kind of surprising that you guys think this is a no-brainer. Care to elaborate or add anything to what Rad said?

with a UNC degree, you're pretty much locked into North Carolina for working for the foreseeable future. With a degree from Vandy, you have national mobility and an especially prominent presence in the South. You have ties back to the NC market if you want to go back, but doors open up for you elsewhere. If you want Big Law or clerkships, Vandy is the clear choice.

I would only say pick UNC if you are dead set on wanting to practice in North Carolina for the next few decades. If not, and you think you might want to look elsewhere, then Vandy. The cost would be worth it, imo.

[northwood]

If your ties to NC are solid and you can maintain your network while living and learning in Nashville- then I think Vandy would be a better option. If you can manage to maintain those ties and create more ties elsewhere, you are giving yourself more options and avenues for success. Plus, you may change your mind about wanting to go back to NC after 3 years, or spending the time away may cement your desire to go back. It will come down to those ties, and ifyou think they are strong enough where they could last law school- then go to vandy if you aren't totally scared away by the extra $75,000.

[TheFactor]

I would characterize my ties to NC as solid, but not spectacular. I grew up in the state and went to undergrad here. My contacts within the profession are nothing special, but I do know several attorneys and a couple hiring partners throughout the state. I don't doubt that I'll be able to maintain these contacts while I'm in Nashville, but it's not like I have a guaranteed job or anything.

[thickfreakness]

I would characterize my ties to NC as solid, but not spectacular. I grew up in the state and went to undergrad here. My contacts within the profession are nothing special, but I do know several attorneys and a couple hiring partners throughout the state. I don't doubt that I'll be able to maintain these contacts while I'm in Nashville, but it's not like I have a guaranteed job or anything.

Growing up in the state and attending undergrad there are about as solid ties as you can get...

[Grizz]

I would characterize my ties to NC as solid, but not spectacular. I grew up in the state and went to undergrad here. My contacts within the profession are nothing special, but I do know several attorneys and a couple hiring partners throughout the state. I don't doubt that I'll be able to maintain these contacts while I'm in Nashville, but it's not like I have a guaranteed job or anything.

Growing up in the state and attending undergrad there are about as solid ties as you can get...

Yeah. With those ties, I don't foresee getting back to NC as being a problem in the least.

[westinghouse60]

I'm also from NC and have similar goals as you, but have yet to apply, so I've only wondered this as a hypothetical. I would have said UNC before reading this thread, but now I'm more uncertain lol

[TheFactor]

now I'm more uncertain lol

+1

[scammedhard]

now I'm more uncertain lol

+1

I wouldn't be too worried. You have two excellent options, and it really comes down to what you would be getting from Vandy for an extra 70K. Some people might say it's totally worth it to have greater shot at big law, clerkships, etc, others (like me) would disagree and believe that UNC is the best option. I think there is no right/wrong answer here, and you can see that the cumulative wisdom of TLSers is pretty evenly divided. Please let us know what you choose.