ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

UCD or Cornell?

UCD (COA: 55K)
23
31%
Cornell (COA: 120K)
51
69%
 
Total votes: 74

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clevermoose
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ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby clevermoose » Thu May 12, 2011 8:34 pm

So I have narrowed my choices down to Cornell and UC Davis. Here is some relevant information:

UC Davis ($43K scholarship per year. Estimated COA: 55K over 3 years)
Cornell ($30K scholarship per year. Estimated COA: 120K over 3 years)

I am a California native (UCD grad) and I want to work here when I graduate, preferably norcal, bra.
I'm terrified of debt but I also am fearful of the possibility that when I am old I will regret taking a lesser school with less debt.
I probably don't want to go to biglaw, but I prefer to keep all of my options open should I decide to change my mind.
How do the LRAPs compare? How do the clinical programs compare?

What do you guys think? What would you guys do if you wanted to work in northern California?

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JamMasterJ
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby JamMasterJ » Thu May 12, 2011 8:38 pm

your preferences make this a much more difficult decision than it ought to be, but Cornell is still TCR. 120K at a T14 is always TCR. However, Davis works well with your goals, so it wouldn't be the most unreasonable of choices to pick it

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby crumpetsandtea » Thu May 12, 2011 8:49 pm

clevermoose wrote:So I have narrowed my choices down to Cornell and UC Davis. Here is some relevant information:

UC Davis ($43K scholarship per year. Estimated COA: 55K over 3 years)
Cornell ($30K scholarship per year. Estimated COA: 120K over 3 years)

I am a California native (UCD grad) and I want to work here when I graduate, preferably norcal, bra.
I'm terrified of debt but I also am fearful of the possibility that when I am old I will regret taking a lesser school with less debt.
I probably don't want to go to biglaw, but I prefer to keep all of my options open should I decide to change my mind.
How do the LRAPs compare? How do the clinical programs compare?

What do you guys think? What would you guys do if you wanted to work in northern California?

Oh hey fellow Aggie!!! :mrgreen:

Here's some info on LRAPs:

Cornell - http://www.top-law-schools.com/tls-guide-to-lrap-cornell-law.html
UCD - http://www.law.ucdavis.edu/current/financial-aid/loan-repayment-assistance.html

IMO if you don't want biglaw, UCD might be good if you realllyyy want NorCal...less debt and you'll be able to make connections. Do you have any preference regarding the schools and how you like them (as in, have you visited and etc etc)? Also, take this with a grain of salt because I'm just an 0L. (:

stylishlaw
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby stylishlaw » Thu May 12, 2011 9:15 pm

I think you should take a step back and really assess what your goals are. At this point it doesn't sound like you know what you want other than working in norcal, and that is making your decision more difficult than it should be.

If you want to go the PI route then go to UCD and minimize debt.
If you want BigLaw or anything requiring the prestige you should go to Cornell.

Cornell will give you the most options though. I'm not sure how easy it is to get back to California from Cornell. From my understanding, it's doable but requires some work. The majority of options at OCI will be from NYC.

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clevermoose
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby clevermoose » Fri May 13, 2011 1:05 am

thanks for the advice guys. any others? what would YOU do?

woeisme
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby woeisme » Fri May 13, 2011 1:30 am

Cornell.

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dpk711
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby dpk711 » Fri May 13, 2011 1:31 am

Enjoy Ithaca.

tothePAIN
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby tothePAIN » Fri May 13, 2011 1:46 am

Davis.

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jtemp320
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby jtemp320 » Fri May 13, 2011 1:47 am

Think about what you really want to do after school.

Try this - pick 3 dream jobs: if they are all things that are available to Davis grads who do well (but don't imagine yourself being top of the class - no guarantees) and Norcal is the #1 priority then go to Davis and don't ever regret it - its cooooold in Ithaca.

But if you see yourself in upstate NY for three years and then potentially in NYC and you dream of being an article III clerk, at the Department of Justice or some other prestigious PI or just in biglaw then go for it. All of those are far from guaranteed but far far more likely from Cornell - if you go that route getting back to the West Coast with ties is not unlikely but is far from a given so you need to accept that it might not happen.

Big question - have you visited Cornell - how did you feel about it? If not, do you have a job where you can call in sick ASAP and spend the cash to fly to Ithaca for a long weekend or something? It will be money well spent if you havent seen that option.
Last edited by jtemp320 on Fri May 13, 2011 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

flcath
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby flcath » Fri May 13, 2011 1:58 am

Go to Cornell.

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DreamsInDigital
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby DreamsInDigital » Fri May 13, 2011 2:09 am

Have you spent time back east? The cold is brutal and Ithaca is almost as bad as it get.

With that said, I think most of the other posters are right. If you are sure you want to stay in Cali, go to Davis, save some money, and be happy.

If you're not completely sure and think you might try some other options, take the risk and go into debt.

bogart
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby bogart » Fri May 13, 2011 8:17 am

Cornell, no question. It is a better school, with better prospects, in a better part of the country.

LurkerNoMore
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby LurkerNoMore » Fri May 13, 2011 8:24 am

You are looking at the debt wrong.

It's not the raw number, it is how difficult it would be to pay it back with the degree it buys you. In the best case scenario, it will be just as easy/hard to pay off $55k from Davis as it will be to pay off $120k from Cornell. However, with Cornell's LRAP program and increased opportunities nationwide, you are more protected against the debt than with a degree from Davis.

If you had a full rid from Davis, this would be close. But $55k makes Davis more of a risk than Cornell at $120k, IMHO.

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Law Sauce
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby Law Sauce » Fri May 13, 2011 9:06 am

You probably wouldn't leave cornell with 120k of debt. Not if you live cheap and/or get a 2L SA that pays well (this is a very good possibility from cornell, it is not a good possibility from davis). I bet you could get that down to 100 or 90k or so, which is very doable.

tothePAIN
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby tothePAIN » Fri May 13, 2011 9:16 am

For the record people, 43k from Davis is a full ride.

Also, as a Davis alum, OP should know that you can live for around 10,000 per year so debt may be closer to 30,000 than 55,000.

Edit: Also, if you even build in an assumption that OP works a job that generates 5k in post tax revenue each summer, we're talking 20k in debt people.

woeisme
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby woeisme » Fri May 13, 2011 9:47 am

tothePAIN wrote:For the record people, 43k from Davis is a full ride.

Also, as a Davis alum, OP should know that you can live for around 10,000 per year so debt may be closer to 30,000 than 55,000.

Edit: Also, if you even build in an assumption that OP works a job that generates 5k in post tax revenue each summer, we're talking 20k in debt people.


This post doesn't make sense. And gives bad advice anyway. Cornell is so clearly the better choice.

crit_racer
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby crit_racer » Fri May 13, 2011 9:49 am

bogart wrote:Cornell, no question. It is a better school, with better prospects, in a better part of the country.


are you on crack?

fact: no part of this country is better than California

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BaiAilian2013
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby BaiAilian2013 » Fri May 13, 2011 10:06 am

Maybe get in touch with some Davis 3Ls/alumni and figure out what kind of jobs people are getting from Davis. $120,000 is a lot of debt to pay back.

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Law Sauce
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby Law Sauce » Fri May 13, 2011 11:27 am

For many career goals, Cornell is definitely worth it. I mean 30k a year to a t14 is a no-brainer. Unless living in Nocal with a lower paying/less prestigious job > higher paying/more prestigious job in some other place and possibly in Nocal.

If your goal is to work in local government or pi in northern California then I'd say Davis. If you want a firm, even in Northern California, then I'd say Cornell. Debt is just a part of life your these types of career paths. And increasingly it is just a part of life for nearly everyone. Deciding what your goals are will clarify this decision. And if not sure then Cornell for significantly more options.

If you do poorly, 120k could limit you for a few years. If you do well, the Davis name could limit you your whole career (except in northern California small law or local gov/pi). Maybe not drastically, but compared to Cornell, no question. But if you cant live in Ithaca and ending up on the east coast for a few year after school is an unacceptable backup plan then Davis becomes more attractive. For me, I'd still go to Cornell. But it is a highly personal choice at that point.

tothePAIN
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby tothePAIN » Fri May 13, 2011 11:47 am

woeisme wrote:
tothePAIN wrote:For the record people, 43k from Davis is a full ride.

Also, as a Davis alum, OP should know that you can live for around 10,000 per year so debt may be closer to 30,000 than 55,000.

Edit: Also, if you even build in an assumption that OP works a job that generates 5k in post tax revenue each summer, we're talking 20k in debt people.


This post doesn't make sense. And gives bad advice anyway. Cornell is so clearly the better choice.


43,000 covers tuition/fees entirely. With personal knowledge of COL in Davis, I know that OP can live in Davis on an effective COA of 10,000 per year. Ergo, debt is 30,000. If you factor in summer jobs paying 5,000 in post tax income, we're talking a total debt of 20,000.

Cornell may be the better school but it is not clearly the better choice. The better choice is dependent on the OP's utility function. The difference between 20,000 in debt and 100,000+ debt is also significant.

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clevermoose
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby clevermoose » Fri May 13, 2011 12:23 pm

I really appreciate these great responses.

I'm heading out tonight to check out Ithaca in the springtime, which is sure to be unrepresentative of the entire three years that I will be spending there, but I still need to see if what the environment is like.

duckmoney
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby duckmoney » Fri May 13, 2011 12:29 pm

Look at employment stats.

--LinkRemoved--

This to me is scary, especially with the whopping 25% who didn't report a salary. Also 34% employed in "other" jobs is upsetting.

--LinkRemoved--

Go to Cornell.

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ahduth
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby ahduth » Fri May 13, 2011 3:39 pm

crit_racer wrote:
bogart wrote:Cornell, no question. It is a better school, with better prospects, in a better part of the country.


are you on crack?

fact: no part of this country is better than California


I'm fairly certain Sarah Palin would beg to differ.

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20160810
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby 20160810 » Fri May 13, 2011 9:55 pm

I love Davis dude, but this wouldn't be a smart choice if you're only saving about 50 grand.

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koalatriste
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Re: ITT: Convince me to choose Cornell over UC Davis

Postby koalatriste » Fri May 13, 2011 10:10 pm

bogart wrote:Cornell, no question. It is a better school, with better prospects, in a better part of the country.


i hate you.




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