Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Penn State or UPitt?

Penn State
15
50%
UPitt
15
50%
 
Total votes: 30

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 9:12 pm

reverendt wrote:
blowhard wrote:
bencoots wrote:
blowhard wrote:This. I'm from PA and very familiar with the local market. Although both are a long shot for BigLaw.


Thanks for providing the info!
I understand they only have the regional reputation so BigLaw might not be the thing.
Which school do people in PA think is better in terms of academics, Penn State of Pitt?


Penn State

Penn state has a very nice faculty, but the students are generally considered a hard partying rabble who opted for a cow town so they could get trashed on football weekends.


Thanks for your input!
Yeah, frankly speaking, that's one of my concerns about Penn State.
The good thing is, I may never get bored in my 1L lol

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 9:14 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
reverendt wrote:Pitt graduating 3L here.
Obviously I can't make a real comparison, but I can tell you that I have been 95% very satisfied with the academics at Pitt.
Probably close to 1/3 of my professors were excellent, meaning they were both prominent/scholarly in their field AND were skilled teachers.
MOST of the rest I would describe as good to very good.
There were a few classes that I thought were lacking. Really only 2 overall.
Career services at Pitt sucks, and that's probably why they sometimes suffer in the rankings.
Oh and the student body....wonderful people, very friendly and un-cutthroat. Couldn't have asked for better classmates (some will be longtime friends).


Did you land a job? If so what class rank were you (approximately)?


Also curious here.

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northwood
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby northwood » Fri May 06, 2011 9:15 pm

bencouts- Undegrad at both of these schools know how to party. Professional and graduate students also know how to party( thats what UG is for) but that should not be a major decision factor. I'm sure if you did some type of research you will see that at the majority of schools there is a good size of the law school population that parties- regardless of the school's name.

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 9:21 pm

northwood wrote:bencouts- Undegrad at both of these schools know how to party. Professional and graduate students also know how to party( thats what UG is for) but that should not be a major decision factor. I'm sure if you did some type of research you will see that at the majority of schools there is a good size of the law school population that parties- regardless of the school's name.


Thank you for the suggestion!! You made a good point here!
I was just hoping the "party school name" wouldn't hurt the reputation for academics.

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northwood
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby northwood » Fri May 06, 2011 9:26 pm

Party school name and reputation mostly pertains to the undergraduate school. Once you are in the graduate level courses and programs students( for the most part) are more serious with their studies. That being said- they still do have fun, but it becomes more common to see people put their school work ahead of their party work (even if that means that they make sure to finish their papers before heading out, and not heading out then finishing the paper).

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 9:51 pm

northwood wrote:Party school name and reputation mostly pertains to the undergraduate school. Once you are in the graduate level courses and programs students( for the most part) are more serious with their studies. That being said- they still do have fun, but it becomes more common to see people put their school work ahead of their party work (even if that means that they make sure to finish their papers before heading out, and not heading out then finishing the paper).


I see. I guess everyone realizes that law school is not just college 2.0
Hey are you a 1L at UPitt (I saw on your profile)? How do you like the school?

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northwood
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby northwood » Fri May 06, 2011 9:53 pm

no- im starting in the fall.

I want to be in Pittsburgh, so its the best fit for me. Im pumped to be there though!

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OGR3
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby OGR3 » Fri May 06, 2011 9:58 pm

TJISMYHERO wrote:
dissonance1848 wrote:Rankings and reputations for the schools are irrelevant. Basically, it comes down to where you want to work. Do you want to be in/around Pittsburgh, or in the middle of PA? Thats what it comes down to. As for biglaw prospects, they are probably similar, with a slight edge to Pittsburgh because a few biglaw offices are there.



If rankings and reputation were irrelevant then schools and applicants wouldn't obsess over them. Fact is, however good or bad, rankings and especially reputation do matter. Alumni will give more back to a school that is increasing the value of their degree. While UPitt and Penn St. are relatively close in rank this year, I expect, since Penn St is one of the top public universities in the country, to dump enough resources into PSL to eventually translate into better overall job prospects.

Disclaimer: 0L opinion which could be totally wrong.


Rankings matter to schools because 0Ls are willing to pay $100K+ based on those rankings. If you want PIttsburgh, go to Pitt. If you want Philadelphia, go to Temple or Villanova.

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OGR3
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby OGR3 » Fri May 06, 2011 10:05 pm

OP: I'm a 1L at Pitt and I absolutely love it.

My classmates are great and I've made a bunch of lifelong friends.

The 3.0 GPA scholarship stipulation is top 50%. It's first evaluated at the end of 1L, and if you drop below 3.0, if you can bring it back during future semesters, they'll reinstate the scholarship. The curve is easier for 2L and 3L, so median becomes closer to a B+ rather than a B.

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 10:34 pm

northwood wrote:no- im starting in the fall.

I want to be in Pittsburgh, so its the best fit for me. Im pumped to be there though!



Yeah Pittsburgh IS a beautiful city.
My biggest concern, still, is the drop in the ranking of Pitt in recent years...

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 10:40 pm

OGR3 wrote:
TJISMYHERO wrote:
dissonance1848 wrote:Rankings and reputations for the schools are irrelevant. Basically, it comes down to where you want to work. Do you want to be in/around Pittsburgh, or in the middle of PA? Thats what it comes down to. As for biglaw prospects, they are probably similar, with a slight edge to Pittsburgh because a few biglaw offices are there.



If rankings and reputation were irrelevant then schools and applicants wouldn't obsess over them. Fact is, however good or bad, rankings and especially reputation do matter. Alumni will give more back to a school that is increasing the value of their degree. While UPitt and Penn St. are relatively close in rank this year, I expect, since Penn St is one of the top public universities in the country, to dump enough resources into PSL to eventually translate into better overall job prospects.

Disclaimer: 0L opinion which could be totally wrong.


Rankings matter to schools because 0Ls are willing to pay $100K+ based on those rankings. If you want PIttsburgh, go to Pitt. If you want Philadelphia, go to Temple or Villanova.


Hey thank you for your reply!
So.. there is no room for Penn State?
On the other hand the Pitt is facing a falling trend in the ranking. I am concerned if this is because the faculty is doing a bad job in teaching, career service, etc...

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 10:41 pm

OGR3 wrote:OP: I'm a 1L at Pitt and I absolutely love it.

My classmates are great and I've made a bunch of lifelong friends.

The 3.0 GPA scholarship stipulation is top 50%. It's first evaluated at the end of 1L, and if you drop below 3.0, if you can bring it back during future semesters, they'll reinstate the scholarship. The curve is easier for 2L and 3L, so median becomes closer to a B+ rather than a B.


Nice. What do you think about the teachers and the career service?

bencoots
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby bencoots » Fri May 06, 2011 10:43 pm

reverendt wrote:Pitt graduating 3L here.
Obviously I can't make a real comparison, but I can tell you that I have been 95% very satisfied with the academics at Pitt.
Probably close to 1/3 of my professors were excellent, meaning they were both prominent/scholarly in their field AND were skilled teachers.
MOST of the rest I would describe as good to very good.
There were a few classes that I thought were lacking. Really only 2 overall.
Career services at Pitt sucks, and that's probably why they sometimes suffer in the rankings.
Oh and the student body....wonderful people, very friendly and un-cutthroat. Couldn't have asked for better classmates (some will be longtime friends).


Wait a minute. The career service at Pitt sucks? Maybe I shouldn't believe those guys who wrote the Best 172 Law schools.

reverendt
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby reverendt » Sun May 08, 2011 1:41 am

bencoots wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
reverendt wrote:Pitt graduating 3L here.
Obviously I can't make a real comparison, but I can tell you that I have been 95% very satisfied with the academics at Pitt.
Probably close to 1/3 of my professors were excellent, meaning they were both prominent/scholarly in their field AND were skilled teachers.
MOST of the rest I would describe as good to very good.
There were a few classes that I thought were lacking. Really only 2 overall.
Career services at Pitt sucks, and that's probably why they sometimes suffer in the rankings.
Oh and the student body....wonderful people, very friendly and un-cutthroat. Couldn't have asked for better classmates (some will be longtime friends).


Did you land a job? If so what class rank were you (approximately)?


Also curious here.

Sadly....not yet. I'm still sending out resumes and such....it's pretty brutal.
They make a point of not ranking, but I'm probably around the top 25%, and well within the top 1/3. Secondary journal with a note published.
As far as staying in Pittsburgh...a decent amount are going elsewhere.
I know of one or two people going to DC.

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arvcondor
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby arvcondor » Mon May 09, 2011 9:26 am

bencoots wrote:
reverendt wrote:Pitt graduating 3L here.
Obviously I can't make a real comparison, but I can tell you that I have been 95% very satisfied with the academics at Pitt.
Probably close to 1/3 of my professors were excellent, meaning they were both prominent/scholarly in their field AND were skilled teachers.
MOST of the rest I would describe as good to very good.
There were a few classes that I thought were lacking. Really only 2 overall.
Career services at Pitt sucks, and that's probably why they sometimes suffer in the rankings.
Oh and the student body....wonderful people, very friendly and un-cutthroat. Couldn't have asked for better classmates (some will be longtime friends).


Wait a minute. The career service at Pitt sucks? Maybe I shouldn't believe those guys who wrote the Best 172 Law schools.

That is literally the first time I've seen that book referenced on TLS. Or anywhere, really.

gewbert
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby gewbert » Tue May 10, 2011 8:43 am

As a Penn St. 1L, I can clear a few things up.

1) It depends on what campus you go to. The UP campus is "newer" in that it wasn't established until a few years ago. Therefore, there's not much of a legal market up there. Though the administration seems determined to close Carlisle down and move everything up to UP, sadly. Shouldn't be for a few years though.

2) I can't speak for UP, but here in Carlisle nobody really parties like in UG. Sure we go out sometimes or have 1L parties after briefs are due or something, but nobody goes crazy every night.

3) Don't pick a school based on rankings (or the website for that matter, does that seriously matter?!?!?!). Both schools are solid.

4) Getting a job is tough no matter where you are. Depends on where you want to work and in what field. I know some 3Ls who have jobs and some who don't. Just the nature of things right now. Career services here does their best but there's a limit as to what they can do, most of the work is on you.

5) Faculty here is top notch. Haven't had a complaint about a single professor, and next year being able to take classes over the A/V system from UP will be nice. Have access to both campuses' faculty. I believe all are from T-14 law schools, but don't quote me on that.

6) In the end, pick a school where you want to practice. If you want DC, I wouldn't think Pitt would be a good choice. While Penn st mainly does the harrisburg/york/lancaster area, there is usually about 10% of grads who go to DC/Maryland/Virginia. We're closer to DC here and have connections. Pitt is way the hell out in western PA and can't imagine many contacts. Plus we have a semester in DC program where you can get an internship for a semester in DC and get academic credit. I'm planning on doing that my 3L year to help get a job.

Best advice is to go visit the schools. Hard to decide where you're going to spend the next 3 years (IMO) until you've visited.

reverendt
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby reverendt » Tue May 10, 2011 6:15 pm

gewbert wrote: If you want DC, I wouldn't think Pitt would be a good choice. While Penn st mainly does the harrisburg/york/lancaster area, there is usually about 10% of grads who go to DC/Maryland/Virginia. We're closer to DC here and have connections. Pitt is way the hell out in western PA and can't imagine many contacts. Plus we have a semester in DC program where you can get an internship for a semester in DC and get academic credit. I'm planning on doing that my 3L year to help get a job.


Actually Pitt has a facility in DC now, and a semester in DC program. One of the few good things the outgoing dean seems to have done.

gewbert
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby gewbert » Tue May 10, 2011 9:42 pm

reverendt wrote:
gewbert wrote: If you want DC, I wouldn't think Pitt would be a good choice. While Penn st mainly does the harrisburg/york/lancaster area, there is usually about 10% of grads who go to DC/Maryland/Virginia. We're closer to DC here and have connections. Pitt is way the hell out in western PA and can't imagine many contacts. Plus we have a semester in DC program where you can get an internship for a semester in DC and get academic credit. I'm planning on doing that my 3L year to help get a job.


Actually Pitt has a facility in DC now, and a semester in DC program. One of the few good things the outgoing dean seems to have done.


I stand corrected then.

HeavenWood
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Re: Penn State ($) vs. UPitt($)

Postby HeavenWood » Wed May 11, 2011 1:03 am

bencoots wrote:
blowhard wrote:
bencoots wrote:
blowhard wrote:
This. I'm from PA and very familiar with the local market. Although both are a long shot for BigLaw.


Thanks for providing the info!
I understand they only have the regional reputation so BigLaw might not be the thing.
Which school do people in PA think is better in terms of academics, Penn State of Pitt?


Penn State


wow, I thought Pitt has a better name since Penn State is considered to be a party school


Penn State used to be far ahead of Pitt in terms of academics, but Pitt pretty much closed the gap in the 1980s. Penn State is better in some programs (like business and engineering), and Pitt is better in others (like the health sciences and certain liberal arts departments). Overall, it's pretty much a wash. That being said, Penn State was, and remains, light years ahead in terms of lay prestige.

As far as law schools go, both are pretty solidly regional, the main difference being that Pitt feeds into a larger primary legal market than Penn Statae.




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