Duke vs. GULC

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Duke vs. GULC

Poll ended at Thu Apr 28, 2011 1:55 pm

GULC (106.5K in debt)
23
46%
Duke (135K in debt)
27
54%
 
Total votes: 50

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:33 pm

justhoping wrote:Congrats by the way, forgot to say last time!

Wow that's not much of an extension. Good luck on deciding. I really don't think there's a wrong choice. Though I must say, I have never been a fan of a large class so I think I'd choose Duke if I were you. OR MAYBE GULC because for the past few days I've been trying to get the best loans and it's not fun. So I'll just vote after Duke's deadline (Apr.29 for me)....

I am actually torn between Duke and Cornell (withdrew from GULC today, they gave me $0 in aid...). Cornell being about 10k cheaper than Duke in 3 years but the even more important factor is that it's close to my parents home (5 hr drive is as close as I could get within T14).


thanks man, congrats on your options too. I personally could never do Cornell (didn't even apply). My brother went there for undergrad and hated it, so that made me partial. They placed high as hell last year in Biglaw though

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:43 pm

do people expect the T14 NLJ numbers to rebound? Or are these the new normals...
(http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1)

anyone have links to any good articles on the subject?

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beachbum
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby beachbum » Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:51 pm

Redsgomarchingon wrote:do people expect the T14 NLJ numbers to rebound? Or are these the new normals...
(http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1)

anyone have links to any good articles on the subject?


There was a pretty good discussion on these numbers when they were released. Basically, this data (for the class of 2010) and next year's data (class of 2011) represent the very bottom of the recession. The current numbers also skew things in favor of NYC-heavy schools (i.e. Cornell) and against southern schools (i.e. Duke, Vandy), as NYC was fairly stable during this time period, while many southern markets (i.e. Atlanta, Charlotte, Birmingham) no-offered like crazy.

Reports are that things got better for the Class of 2012, and are expected to again get better for the Class of 2013 (current 1Ls). However, the magnitude of this upswing is debatable, and many reports indicate that progress (in terms of SA class sizes) has been slow. Things should continue to improve, but it could be a while before we see a "healthy" (i.e. ~2004-2005) legal hiring market.

kobebeef
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby kobebeef » Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:59 pm

im in the exact same situation (Duke/GULC, same amount of money) as you but unfortunately have about 3 hours before the post office closes to get my deposit out. I've talked to a few california friends out there and they have a hard time adjusting mainly because a college town in the deep south is drastically different than LA.

I've also taken into consideration Duke's prestige, its NLJ250 numbers vs GULC and its smaller class size which are all definite perks but I think at this point, it matters more about how well you will do within your class rather than the school. I don't think anyone (other than some people on this forum) will turn their noses at GULC. That is, unless GULC somehow slips out of the top 14.

I figure 3 years in DC sound much much better than Durham.

edit: I took a look at the apartment/loft complexes around duke and they look fantastic. DC apartments on the other hand look like shit.

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:31 pm

kobebeef wrote:im in the exact same situation (Duke/GULC, same amount of money) as you but unfortunately have about 3 hours before the post office closes to get my deposit out. I've talked to a few california friends out there and they have a hard time adjusting mainly because a college town in the deep south is drastically different than LA.

I've also taken into consideration Duke's prestige, its NLJ250 numbers vs GULC and its smaller class size which are all definite perks but I think at this point, it matters more about how well you will do within your class rather than the school. I don't think anyone (other than some people on this forum) will turn their noses at GULC. That is, unless GULC somehow slips out of the top 14.

I figure 3 years in DC sound much much better than Durham.

edit: I took a look at the apartment/loft complexes around duke and they look fantastic. DC apartments on the other hand look like shit.


Since I got in so late Duke extended my deposit due date to May 3rd, so I don't have to overnight it (if I choose it) until Saturday.

Are you choosing GULC?

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:41 pm

beachbum wrote:
Redsgomarchingon wrote:do people expect the T14 NLJ numbers to rebound? Or are these the new normals...
(http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1)

anyone have links to any good articles on the subject?


There was a pretty good discussion on these numbers when they were released. Basically, this data (for the class of 2010) and next year's data (class of 2011) represent the very bottom of the recession. The current numbers also skew things in favor of NYC-heavy schools (i.e. Cornell) and against southern schools (i.e. Duke, Vandy), as NYC was fairly stable during this time period, while many southern markets (i.e. Atlanta, Charlotte, Birmingham) no-offered like crazy.

Reports are that things got better for the Class of 2012, and are expected to again get better for the Class of 2013 (current 1Ls). However, the magnitude of this upswing is debatable, and many reports indicate that progress (in terms of SA class sizes) has been slow. Things should continue to improve, but it could be a while before we see a "healthy" (i.e. ~2004-2005) legal hiring market.


I'm not too picky about where I end up, but I wasn't planning on the South (although I wouldn't mind Texas or Miami). For the Duke grads that choose NY, are they on equal ground with Cornell grads? (assuming equal class ranking)

haha, I like how Duke has Alaska as an option too. Never even considered that until I read their handbook

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beachbum
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby beachbum » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:47 pm

Redsgomarchingon wrote:
beachbum wrote:
Redsgomarchingon wrote:do people expect the T14 NLJ numbers to rebound? Or are these the new normals...
(http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1)

anyone have links to any good articles on the subject?


There was a pretty good discussion on these numbers when they were released. Basically, this data (for the class of 2010) and next year's data (class of 2011) represent the very bottom of the recession. The current numbers also skew things in favor of NYC-heavy schools (i.e. Cornell) and against southern schools (i.e. Duke, Vandy), as NYC was fairly stable during this time period, while many southern markets (i.e. Atlanta, Charlotte, Birmingham) no-offered like crazy.

Reports are that things got better for the Class of 2012, and are expected to again get better for the Class of 2013 (current 1Ls). However, the magnitude of this upswing is debatable, and many reports indicate that progress (in terms of SA class sizes) has been slow. Things should continue to improve, but it could be a while before we see a "healthy" (i.e. ~2004-2005) legal hiring market.


I'm not too picky about where I end up, but I wasn't planning on the South (although I wouldn't mind Texas or Miami). For the Duke grads that choose NY, are they on equal ground with Cornell grads? (assuming equal class ranking)


Anecdotal evidence suggests they are, but you might want to run it by current students. I've also heard that you might be at an advantage, as fewer Duke students bid on NYC (relative to Cornell), and firms like to diversify their classes.

kobebeef
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby kobebeef » Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:00 pm

Redsgomarchingon wrote:
kobebeef wrote:im in the exact same situation (Duke/GULC, same amount of money) as you but unfortunately have about 3 hours before the post office closes to get my deposit out. I've talked to a few california friends out there and they have a hard time adjusting mainly because a college town in the deep south is drastically different than LA.

I've also taken into consideration Duke's prestige, its NLJ250 numbers vs GULC and its smaller class size which are all definite perks but I think at this point, it matters more about how well you will do within your class rather than the school. I don't think anyone (other than some people on this forum) will turn their noses at GULC. That is, unless GULC somehow slips out of the top 14.

I figure 3 years in DC sound much much better than Durham.

edit: I took a look at the apartment/loft complexes around duke and they look fantastic. DC apartments on the other hand look like shit.


Since I got in so late Duke extended my deposit due date to May 3rd, so I don't have to overnight it (if I choose it) until Saturday.

Are you choosing GULC?


I believe so

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Sat Apr 30, 2011 2:42 pm

mail goes out in 4 hours

Probably going to GULC

kobebeef
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby kobebeef » Wed May 04, 2011 12:09 am

did you decide?

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Redsgomarchingon
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Wed May 04, 2011 4:04 am

kobebeef wrote:did you decide?


GULC

I'm sure I'll be kicking myself if Duke makes T10 next year, but I figured GULCs NLJ numbers were somewhat deceptive because they have significant numbers of students going into PI and govt. Also, I know a partner at a V10 in DC (through my fraternity), and going to GULC will allow me to have lunch with him on occasion.

I liked Duke's campus, but it seemed like I would need a car in Durham, since the apartments near campus seemed to be either luxury or full of undergrads.

see you in DC?

kobebeef
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:43 pm

Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby kobebeef » Wed May 04, 2011 10:51 am

Redsgomarchingon wrote:
kobebeef wrote:did you decide?


GULC

I'm sure I'll be kicking myself if Duke makes T10 next year, but I figured GULCs NLJ numbers were somewhat deceptive because they have significant numbers of students going into PI and govt. Also, I know a partner at a V10 in DC (through my fraternity), and going to GULC will allow me to have lunch with him on occasion.

I liked Duke's campus, but it seemed like I would need a car in Durham, since the apartments near campus seemed to be either luxury or full of undergrads.

see you in DC?


See you there! About the rankings, I'm pretty sure people weren't avoiding Berkeley because of its precipitous drop this year. It just seems like a damn dog and pony show every year.

Are you considering Curriculum B at all?

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Redsgomarchingon
Posts: 457
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Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby Redsgomarchingon » Wed May 04, 2011 3:03 pm

kobebeef wrote:
Redsgomarchingon wrote:
kobebeef wrote:did you decide?


GULC

I'm sure I'll be kicking myself if Duke makes T10 next year, but I figured GULCs NLJ numbers were somewhat deceptive because they have significant numbers of students going into PI and govt. Also, I know a partner at a V10 in DC (through my fraternity), and going to GULC will allow me to have lunch with him on occasion.

I liked Duke's campus, but it seemed like I would need a car in Durham, since the apartments near campus seemed to be either luxury or full of undergrads.

see you in DC?


See you there! About the rankings, I'm pretty sure people weren't avoiding Berkeley because of its precipitous drop this year. It just seems like a damn dog and pony show every year.

Are you considering Curriculum B at all?


I spoke with a few associates I know and they suggested that a T10 firm distinction is significant in hiring practices at many law firms. But yea, there seems to be no way for us, the investors, to accurately judge which school is going to rise or fall.

I am, but I'm a little concerned about the increased quantity of reading. I read pretty slowly and like to write very detailed outlines, so curriculum B might suffocate me.

Are you considering it?

kobebeef
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:43 pm

Re: Duke vs. GULC

Postby kobebeef » Thu May 05, 2011 9:58 pm

I was an english and poli sci major and did my thesis in philosophy so I naturally gravitate towards a more theoretical learning style. That being said, I have no idea how well i would do but it does seem pretty interesting.

A counterpoint to your T10 rule: I spoke at length today to a partner at a big law firm and the prestige of schools is an ambiguous, hazy predictor when it comes to hiring. Big firms wont hire beyond 15-20 but Its not like T10 has a leg up over T14. If you go to HYS, then that's a different story. He actually went to UCLA and the hiring partner was more interested in his Cornell undergrad than anything else.




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