Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

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Cornell vs Columbia

Poll ended at Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:15 pm

Columbia (75K)
40
63%
Cornell (105K) + living assistance
24
38%
 
Total votes: 64

tellimaiee
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Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tellimaiee » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:15 pm

Hello everyone,

This is my first time post and I need help deciding between these two schools. As you see above, I have been given a scholarship of 75K from Columbia and 105K from Cornell. I am completely torn between the two options for several reasons. If I attend Cornell, I will be attending rent free since my boyfriend is currently there doing a PhD (I am a Cornell Alum) and is an RA with a one bedroom apartment (included with his position). Thus, in that sense, Cornell has the best financial offer. However, Columbia is the higher ranked school and has given me a great scholarship as well although the cost of living will significantly increase my debt if I go there. I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics. Also, if I were to go to Cornell, I would have the added advantage of my boyfriend's love and support. I would really appreciate your opinions in this matter and hope that you may help me see things clearer.

I thank you in advance for your responses.

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awahoya
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby awahoya » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:27 pm

tellimaiee wrote:Hello everyone,
This is my first time post and I need help deciding between these two schools. As you see above, I have been given a scholarship of 75K from Columbia and 105K from Cornell. I am completely torn between the two options for several reasons. If I attend Cornell, I will be attending rent free since my boyfriend is currently there doing a PhD (I am a Cornell Alum) and is an RA with a one bedroom apartment (included with his position). Thus, in that sense, Cornell has the best financial offer. However, Columbia is the higher ranked school and has given me a great scholarship as well although the cost of living will significantly increase my debt if I go there. I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics. Also, if I were to go to Cornell, I would have the added advantage of my boyfriend's love and support. I would really appreciate your opinions in this matter and hope that you may help me see things clearer.
I thank you in advance for your responses.


This is tough: I think Columbia (and NYU) unquestionably have the best programs in the country for int. human rights, and 75k from CLS is a lot. That being said, with CoL it would still keep your CoA around 150k. It depends on how risk/debt averse you are and just how difficult it would be to have to be away from your SO...people put a high premium on happiness, and your happiness also seems to come with the advantage of being the more salient money option. However, CLS IS extremely good at human rights, AND NYC isn't THAT far from Ithica, is it? (coming from a non-Northeasterner, I literally don't know haha) Not to make light of the choice, but I thought the conditional of "If I go to Cornell, I will have the love and support" was funny, seeing as what the contrapositive would be... :)

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rayiner
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby rayiner » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:31 pm

As good as Columbia is, I would definitely take Harvard over Columbia with $75k.

ktafive
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby ktafive » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:36 pm

Columbia's LRAP is pretty good from what I hear. So essentially OP is looking at max 40K of debt from Cornell and 120K from Columbia. Its a tough choice, is Columbia worth 80K more than Cornell?

ktafive
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby ktafive » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:48 pm

awahoya wrote:
tellimaiee wrote:Hello everyone,
This is my first time post and I need help deciding between these two schools. As you see above, I have been given a scholarship of 75K from Columbia and 105K from Cornell. I am completely torn between the two options for several reasons. If I attend Cornell, I will be attending rent free since my boyfriend is currently there doing a PhD (I am a Cornell Alum) and is an RA with a one bedroom apartment (included with his position). Thus, in that sense, Cornell has the best financial offer. However, Columbia is the higher ranked school and has given me a great scholarship as well although the cost of living will significantly increase my debt if I go there. I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics. Also, if I were to go to Cornell, I would have the added advantage of my boyfriend's love and support. I would really appreciate your opinions in this matter and hope that you may help me see things clearer.
I thank you in advance for your responses.


This is tough: I think Columbia (and NYU) unquestionably have the best programs in the country for int. human rights, and 75k from CLS is a lot. That being said, with CoL it would still keep your CoA around 150k. It depends on how risk/debt averse you are and just how difficult it would be to have to be away from your SO...people put a high premium on happiness, and your happiness also seems to come with the advantage of being the more salient money option. However, CLS IS extremely good at human rights, AND NYC isn't THAT far from Ithica, is it? (coming from a non-Northeasterner, I literally don't know haha) Not to make light of the choice, but I thought the conditional of "If I go to Cornell, I will have the love and support" was funny, seeing as what the contrapositive would be... :)
Cornell is 4 hours away from NYC. Not too long of a trip

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:36 pm

No YHS?

tellimaiee
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tellimaiee » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:26 am

Hi tea_drinker,

No, no YHS. I only got accepted to Columbia, Cornell, Berkeley, and USC. I have ruled the last two out.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 11:45 am

tellimaiee wrote:Hello everyone,

This is my first time post and I need help deciding between these two schools. As you see above, I have been given a scholarship of 75K from Columbia and 105K from Cornell. I am completely torn between the two options for several reasons. If I attend Cornell, I will be attending rent free since my boyfriend is currently there doing a PhD (I am a Cornell Alum) and is an RA with a one bedroom apartment (included with his position). Thus, in that sense, Cornell has the best financial offer. However, Columbia is the higher ranked school and has given me a great scholarship as well although the cost of living will significantly increase my debt if I go there. I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics. Also, if I were to go to Cornell, I would have the added advantage of my boyfriend's love and support. I would really appreciate your opinions in this matter and hope that you may help me see things clearer.

I thank you in advance for your responses.


If I were you, I will take the money at Columbia and run with it. Here is why:

1. Sure, your total COA will be cheaper at Cornell, but a 75K scholarship at Columbia making a total debt around $130 is very attractive in terms of cost benefits

2. As you already said and known, Columbia is ranked higher. Both schools do not have a strong public interest slant like NYU or Michigan, so Columbia's prestige is an advantage.

3. Columbia's location in Manhattan will allow you to participate in many available intern- and externship not just during summer but throughout three years of law school. (think about UN headquarter, Redcross, WHO, etc.)

4. There are different opinions about law school and relationship. In my opinion, I am not sure if having a love and support of your boyfriend in proximity is a good thing, especially during your 1L. I mean you will spend most of your days, weeks and months studying in the library, while your boyfriend even though in his PhD program will not be as intense as you are. You guys will become more isolated despite living in the same space, and that can create all kinds of problem. Put a geographical barrier between you two, so you can focus on school works during the week. In addition, NYC and Cornell is not too far apart (as some posters mentioned above). Thus, you can plan weekend trips to visit one another.

Congrats on the amazing options and good luck!

tellimaiee
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tellimaiee » Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:34 pm

Thank you tea_drinker!

Cornell's isolated location has been the biggest drawback from choosing to attend even though my boyfriend is there. The expense, however, has been making this decision hard. Added to the mix is that we have been long distance already for two years (I work in Los Angeles[where I'm originally from]) and he is not being supportive of the idea of another three years. Thus, my heart is being pulled in different directions and I wasn't sure if Columbia was worth all the loss (money and relationship wise).

I welcome more opinions! Thanks!

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BigBenD
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby BigBenD » Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:44 pm

I am completely shocked about how close this poll is. I think Columbia is hands down the better option here. Columbia and Cornell are not even slightly comparable for employment prospects, and for a career in Int'l Human Rights law (which is wildly elusive, by the way), you are going to want to be as high as possible in the rankings. For your interests and ambitions, Columbia w/ 75K is absolutely TCR.

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bk1
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby bk1 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:48 pm

tellimaiee wrote:I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics.


Both of these things will be incredibly unlikely coming out of either school. People who are saying go to Columbia so that you have a better shot at it aren't realizing that while the chance is better, it is still absurdly low and like hitting the lottery.

Because of that, you should go to Cornell. It will cost far less and you will be with your SO. Because of the less debt, you will be better off with whatever job you end up at once you, in all likelihood, fail to get a job out of school doing international human rights or politics.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:00 pm

Should be an esay choice since the two options present totally different environments.
If your relationship is serious, then Cornell.
If you are a big city person, then downtown Ithaca is out of the running.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:00 pm

bk1 wrote:
tellimaiee wrote:I am looking to do a career in public interest, specifically international human rights and possibly a career in politics.


Both of these things will be incredibly unlikely coming out of either school. People who are saying go to Columbia so that you have a better shot at it aren't realizing that while the chance is better, it is still absurdly low and like hitting the lottery.

Because of that, you should go to Cornell. It will cost far less and you will be with your SO. Because of the less debt, you will be better off with whatever job you end up at once you, in all likelihood, fail to get a job out of school doing international human rights or politics.



Ok, I think you are a bit melodramatic about public interest employment prospects coming out of Columbia. In addition, Columbia LRAP is bit better than Cornell as well.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=62094&start=25
http://www.lawschool.cornell.edu/admiss ... P-info.pdf

I understand if OP ends up choosing Cornell to be with her SO. But arguing choosing Cornell over Columbia for the possibility of avoiding school loan default is not sound.

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bk1
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby bk1 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:16 pm

tea_drinker wrote:Ok, I think you are a bit melodramatic about public interest employment prospects coming out of Columbia. In addition, Columbia LRAP is bit better than Cornell as well.


I realize that I didn't make it clear, but I meant the latter part of OP's statement (regarding international/politics), not PI generally.

Neither of these schools is a PI powerhouse or anything but CLS probably has at least a small advantage. That being said, if I were gunning for PI and someone offered me less loans and no LRAP versus more loans and using LRAP, I would definitely take less loans.

Cornell is going to be around 50-60k whereas Columbia is going to be 3 times that (150k). I really think this is pretty easily Cornell.

bartleby
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby bartleby » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:21 pm

because 90k makes that big of a difference over three years w/ the #4 law school? go to columbia. nyc > > > ithaca

WhirledWorld
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby WhirledWorld » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:25 pm

.
Last edited by WhirledWorld on Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:27 pm

bk1 wrote:
tea_drinker wrote:Ok, I think you are a bit melodramatic about public interest employment prospects coming out of Columbia. In addition, Columbia LRAP is bit better than Cornell as well.


I realize that I didn't make it clear, but I meant the latter part of OP's statement (regarding international/politics), not PI generally.

Neither of these schools is a PI powerhouse or anything but CLS probably has at least a small advantage. That being said, if I were gunning for PI and someone offered me less loans and no LRAP versus more loans and using LRAP, I would definitely take less loans.

Cornell is going to be around 50-60k whereas Columbia is going to be 3 times that (150k). I really think this is pretty easily Cornell.


You are definitely right that getting international/politics will be hard from either of these schools (hell, it's hard from most places except YHS). However, for both international legal works and politics, lay prestige is a considerable factor and that's why I think Columbia's worth the extra $100K given their decent LRAP.

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bk1
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby bk1 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:30 pm

tea_drinker wrote:You are definitely right that getting international/politics will be hard from either of these schools (hell, it's hard from most places except YHS). However, for both international legal works and politics, lay prestige is a considerable factor and that's why I think Columbia's worth the extra $100K given their decent LRAP.


It's still hard from HYS. Yes CLS will be better than Cornell for those things, but they are so absurdly rare and hard to get that the extra 100k is not justified. It's like saying you should pay 3 times as much for a lottery ticket because it triples your chances of winning the lottery and the problem with that is that 3 times of next to nothing is still pretty close to nothing.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:39 pm

bk1 wrote:
It's still hard from HYS. Yes CLS will be better than Cornell for those things, but they are so absurdly rare and hard to get that the extra 100k is not justified. It's like saying you should pay 3 times as much for a lottery ticket because it triples your chances of winning the lottery and the problem with that is that 3 times of next to nothing is still pretty close to nothing.


Oh, no. I definitely don't think CLS will triple OP's chance to get either one of international PI or politics. I guess the way I am thinking about this is if OP runs for an elected office one day in LA, where she's originally from, the name of Columbia may give her an advantage compared to Cornell. Also, being in NYC with numerous internship and externship will provide her more opportunities to network and what not to solidify her career path.

And if everything fails, OP still has Columbia's decent LRAP.
Last edited by tea_drinker on Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby bk1 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:41 pm

tea_drinker wrote:Oh, no. I definitely don't think CLS will triple OP's chance to get either one of international PI or politics. I guess the way I am thinking about this is if OP runs for an elected office one day in LA, where she's originally from. The name of of Columbia may give her an advantage compared to Cornell. Also, being in NYC with numerous internship and externship will provide her more opportunities to network and what not to solidify her career path.

And if everything fails, OP still has Columbia's decent LRAP.


I wasn't trying to say it actually tripled, it was just an metaphor. :P

I mean I see your line of reasoning, I just believe that freedom from significant debt is a far better position to be in even when LRAPs come into play considering the difference between these schools isn't a chasm.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:47 pm

bk1 wrote:
I wasn't trying to say it actually tripled, it was just an metaphor. :P

I mean I see your line of reasoning, I just believe that freedom from significant debt is a far better position to be in even when LRAPs come into play considering the difference between these schools isn't a chasm.


:oops:

I feel these types of comparison are like buying cars. Sometimes you just have to believe a Mercedez is much faster and far better than an Acura. :mrgreen:

tellimaiee
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tellimaiee » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:47 pm

Thank you for the responses! And yes tea_drinker I definitely want to believe that! As for international work/politics, I realize both of these are a stretch, but considering my background and how far I've gotten at this point, I will push for it ( I realize I am sounding completely idealistic at this point, but hey I do believe in the American dream).

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:52 pm

I forgot to ask, and shoud have asked, this question: did you try to negotiate more money from Cornell?

tellimaiee
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tellimaiee » Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:16 pm

I didn't try to negotiate more money from Cornell, but I did write an appeal to Columbia for an increase in the grant. They don't have a timeline of getting back to me though since they are still generating finaid packages for other admits. I also forgot to mention in this thread that I will have no savings of my own (I was unemployed several months after undergrad and will barely manage to pay off debts before starting law school) and parents, although they would love to, do not have any means to assist me.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Columbia (75K) vs Cornell (105K) + living assistance

Postby tea_drinker » Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:33 pm

Ok, so unless you have made your decision to attend Columbia, I suggest you let Cornell know about your $75K at Columbia and see it they will give you some more money.




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