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Non-Chalant1
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Non-Chalant1 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:04 pm

Knock wrote:
Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing. So really it would just come down to the difference in tuition and you have to decide for yourself if you feel that it's worth it. Furthermore, Chicago and NYC have different personalities they are not exactly alike. NY people have an entirely different persona.

Also, are you interested in clinicals? Do you think that you might want to do something else besides corporate law?


If you want, you can find housing for cheaper than regents.

That is also true. But I don't think most 1Ls would. But it's a fair point.

For the record I voted CLS. The fact that it's even on this list with those two offers at hand lets me know that's where you really want to go. I hope Chi can change your mind though. 50k is 50k.

eaa1537
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby eaa1537 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:07 pm

sonervous88 wrote:fyi i'm in a similar situation (but have received no money from columbia) and i've ruled out uchicago because i didn't like it when I visited. go visit. if you don't like it then stop worrying about this. lol you have great options and you will be fine.

Yeah, basically what I've taken away is to go visit for myself. I fell in love with Columbia when I visited so I keep trying to justify attending. But obviously it makes sense to go visit Chicago cause I could easily love it there too.

Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing. So really it would just come down to the difference in tuition and you have to decide for yourself if you feel that it's worth it. Furthermore, Chicago and NYC have different personalities they are not exactly alike. NY people have an entirely different persona.

Also, are you interested in clinicals? Do you think that you might want to do something else besides corporate law?


I'm very interested in clinical programs, and am also pretty sure I want to stick with corporate law at least for the first few years, although I guess it's possible I could be swayed once in school.

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Sentry
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Sentry » Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:11 pm

Columbia. Your chi/penn debt still leaves you needing biglaw or ibr/lrap. If you really want Columbia go there.

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dresden doll
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby dresden doll » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:05 pm

absolutazn87 wrote:I'm not trying to compare the math or say that Chicago is worse than Penn or even that they're the same. I'm just saying it's comparable, especially when talking about clerkships.

And you're not really backing up the assertion that any Chicago grads that self-select into Chicago can DEFINITELY get NYC. I don't see any numbers backing that up.


No one ever told you that NYC biglaw is much easier to get than Chicago biglaw, did they?

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absolutazn87
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby absolutazn87 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:09 pm

dresden doll wrote:
absolutazn87 wrote:I'm not trying to compare the math or say that Chicago is worse than Penn or even that they're the same. I'm just saying it's comparable, especially when talking about clerkships.

And you're not really backing up the assertion that any Chicago grads that self-select into Chicago can DEFINITELY get NYC. I don't see any numbers backing that up.


No one ever told you that NYC biglaw is much easier to get than Chicago biglaw, did they?

We covered this on the last page.

Chicago is an objectively harder market to break into but it's much easier for Chicago grads. The premier school in its home market has a large home-field advantage (also see Northwestern's Chicago placement). I seriously doubt that it's easier for Chicago grads to go to NYC than it is for them to stay in their home market.

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dresden doll
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby dresden doll » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:10 pm

Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing.


Incorrect. I say that as someone familiar with both Regents and CLS subsidized housing. Rooming at Regents comes to around 700 dollars a month. Rooming in a CLS subsidized housing will approach a 1000 at minimum. Maybe you'd say it's minimal but that's not how I'd label 200-300 dollar difference per month.

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dresden doll
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby dresden doll » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:18 pm

absolutazn87 wrote:
Chicago is an objectively harder market to break into but it's much easier for Chicago grads. The premier school in its home market has a large home-field advantage (also see Northwestern's Chicago placement). I seriously doubt that it's easier for Chicago grads to go to NYC than it is for them to stay in their home market.


Let me cover it again, as a 2L who learned a thing or two from OCI: Chicago biglaw is on average significantly harder to get than NYC biglaw, and, yes, that is after accounting for Chicago's top dog position in the home market.

First, you can't argue with the sheer differences in terms of SA positions available. NYC is bigger and has more firms that need to fill out their summer classes. That alone makes a great deal of difference.

Furthermore, the sheer fact that many Chicago kids actively want Chicago biglaw creates advantage for the NYC-wanting minority. If you're going after NYC from Chicago, you'll simply be competing with fewer of your classmates than you would for Chicago biglaw (or, for that matter, if you were competing for NYC out of CLS - most CLSers want to stay in NYC). Since firms like to have a smattering of students from different top notch schools in their summer programs, this too matters.

These are simple facts. To contend otherwise is to mislead OP, plain and simple.

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Non-Chalant1
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Non-Chalant1 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:32 am

dresden doll wrote:
Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing.


Incorrect. I say that as someone familiar with both Regents and CLS subsidized housing. Rooming at Regents comes to around 700 dollars a month. Rooming in a CLS subsidized housing will approach a 1000 at minimum. Maybe you'd say it's minimal but that's not how I'd label 200-300 dollar difference per month.

Go ahead and link me to the Chicago regents apartment that is 700 for a single with all utilities. I'm going to say it doesn't exist.

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:44 am

I never understood the logic that people who go to elite schools will have trouble going to a certain area because of geography, especially when that area is NY. There are probably ~75 UChi grads each year that want to go to NY (and that's probably a high estimate). Each NY firm probably would like one of those graduates to have diversity of schools in their associates. You're telling me that a median student at NYU/Columbia has a better shot at a NYC biglaw firm than a median student at Chicago? I don't believe it. That same firm probably already has tons of NYU/Columbia students in their associate program for that summer. Supply and demand.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Lawquacious » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:50 am

NikaneOkie wrote:tell columbia what chicago gave you and see if they match it
good luck! this looks like such a hard decision. my only advice would be dont go somewhere you're not excited about; it'll probably adversely affect your performance.


+1

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ahduth
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby ahduth » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:59 am

JollyGreenGiant wrote:I never understood the logic that people who go to elite schools will have trouble going to a certain area because of geography, especially when that area is NY. There are probably ~75 UChi grads each year that want to go to NY (and that's probably a high estimate). Each NY firm probably would like one of those graduates to have diversity of schools in their associates. You're telling me that a median student at NYU/Columbia has a better shot at a NYC biglaw firm than a median student at Chicago? I don't believe it. That same firm probably already has tons of NYU/Columbia students in their associate program for that summer. Supply and demand.


This is basically what I've heard. U of C plays well with NYC big law.

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ahduth
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby ahduth » Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:06 am

Non-Chalant1 wrote:
dresden doll wrote:
Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing.


Incorrect. I say that as someone familiar with both Regents and CLS subsidized housing. Rooming at Regents comes to around 700 dollars a month. Rooming in a CLS subsidized housing will approach a 1000 at minimum. Maybe you'd say it's minimal but that's not how I'd label 200-300 dollar difference per month.

Go ahead and link me to the Chicago regents apartment that is 700 for a single with all utilities. I'm going to say it doesn't exist.


700 is the maximum I'd pay to live in Hyde Park, but I've never lived in Regents.

trudat15
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby trudat15 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:38 pm

Non-Chalant1 wrote:
dresden doll wrote:
Non-Chalant1 wrote:Regents where most UChi 1Ls live is barely cheaper than the subsidized Columbia housing.


Incorrect. I say that as someone familiar with both Regents and CLS subsidized housing. Rooming at Regents comes to around 700 dollars a month. Rooming in a CLS subsidized housing will approach a 1000 at minimum. Maybe you'd say it's minimal but that's not how I'd label 200-300 dollar difference per month.

Go ahead and link me to the Chicago regents apartment that is 700 for a single with all utilities. I'm going to say it doesn't exist.


I think 700 each is for a 2 bedroom, without utilities, but including internet. I assumed the 1000/min a month at Columbia was also each for a 2 bedroom.

But in any case, OP is looking at 200k+ at Columbia and 130k at Chicago (if the COA numbers are correct) for basically peer schools.

Chicago is TCR here unless OP hates it on her visit. Then it becomes 200k+ at Columbia vs. 130k at Penn.

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dresden doll
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby dresden doll » Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:18 pm

I have friends who live in Regents in two bedrooms that cost less than 1400 per month (so less than 700 between two people). I'm going to say that skeptics should inquire into that simple fact come this weekend's ASW.

Personally, I live within spitting distance of the Water Tower (a.k.a. in Chicago's most expensive area) for less than 800 per month. And, yes, I live alone and yes that does include utilities. Good luck getting the equivalent of that anywhere in NYC, to speak nothing of its better parts.

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Lisi
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Lisi » Wed Apr 06, 2011 9:47 am

I lived in Columbia subsidized housing for $850 a month - which included internet and utilities. This was about 2 years ago, so I'm not sure what has changed, but I doubt all that much has changed. A friend of mine in grad school had a roommate from the law school. He was paying a similar price. I don't know of anyone in Columbia housing paying $1,000+ if they have roommates (rather than living in a studio or 1-bedroom). I just wanted to clarify this, because "at least $1,000/month" for Columbia subsidized housing sounds very off given my experiences and the experiences of all of my friends who are currently living in Columbia housing.

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hiddenfist
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby hiddenfist » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:37 am

Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

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Dany
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Dany » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:50 am

hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

Take the money at Chi unless you have reasons for really wanting to be in NYC for three years or strongly prefer it.

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OutCold
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby OutCold » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:04 pm

bk1 wrote:
eaa1537 wrote:
Knock wrote:This is the thread i've been looking for: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=151221.
Cost of Attendance:
CLS- $222,000
Chi- $204,030
Penn- $204,450

Those are scary numbers, and I'm actually fairly certain that Columbia's COA has gone up to 77,000/year... not helping my case for wanting to attend haha


If USNWR is right then I think Chi and Penn didn't go up (assuming I'm reading it right).


Penn's COA is $213,780 or $71,260/year according to the financial aid page.

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Sentry
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby Sentry » Thu Apr 14, 2011 4:29 pm

Dany wrote:
hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

Take the money at Chi unless you have reasons for really wanting to be in NYC for three years or strongly prefer it.

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hiddenfist
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby hiddenfist » Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:26 pm

Sentry wrote:
Dany wrote:
hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

Take the money at Chi unless you have reasons for really wanting to be in NYC for three years or strongly prefer it.


:-(

bellamy
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby bellamy » Thu Apr 14, 2011 8:13 pm

hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

I am in almost exactly that situation and will probaly choose CLS. The $ difference is substantial ( particularly given the higher COL in NYC rather than Chicago) but amortizing it over a 35 year career hepls me put it in perspective

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hiddenfist
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby hiddenfist » Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:29 pm

bellamy wrote:
hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

I am in almost exactly that situation and will probaly choose CLS. The $ difference is substantial ( particularly given the higher COL in NYC rather than Chicago) but amortizing it over a 35 year career hepls me put it in perspective


That's the first response that doesn't make me feel crazy for feeling somewhat similarly.

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bk1
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby bk1 » Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:35 pm

bellamy wrote:
hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

I am in almost exactly that situation and will probaly choose CLS. The $ difference is substantial ( particularly given the higher COL in NYC rather than Chicago) but amortizing it over a 35 year career hepls me put it in perspective


But the difference between Chicago and Columbia isn't that substantial.

If you end up in the bottom 1/3 of the class (e.g. no biglaw, no PI/gov), you're gonna be much happier that you took out 50k+ less while you're paying back your loans on a meager salary.

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hiddenfist
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby hiddenfist » Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:40 pm

bk1 wrote:
bellamy wrote:
hiddenfist wrote:Not to necro this thread but what is the best choice between:

Columbia with 25k
NYU with 50k
Chicago with 75k?

I am in almost exactly that situation and will probaly choose CLS. The $ difference is substantial ( particularly given the higher COL in NYC rather than Chicago) but amortizing it over a 35 year career hepls me put it in perspective


But the difference between Chicago and Columbia isn't that substantial.

If you end up in the bottom 1/3 of the class (e.g. no biglaw, no PI/gov), you're gonna be much happier that you took out 50k+ less while you're paying back your loans on a meager salary.


LRAP?

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bk1
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Re: Columbia $ vs. Chicago $$ vs. Penn $$

Postby bk1 » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:04 pm

hiddenfist wrote:But the difference between Chicago and Columbia isn't that substantial.

If you end up in the bottom 1/3 of the class (e.g. no biglaw, no PI/gov), you're gonna be much happier that you took out 50k+ less while you're paying back your loans on a meager salary.


LRAP?[/quote]

Hence why I said "no PI/gov." There is a non-insignificant amount of T14 grads (and yes even at CC) who end up at small firms with low pay that does not qualify for LRAP (it might qualify for 25 year IBR but big fucking whoop on that).




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