Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

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fatduck
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby fatduck » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:01 pm

ihp12 wrote:
fatduck wrote:
bk1 wrote:
fatduck wrote:Perhaps there's a stigma because the high gpa students massively outnumber the high lsat students...


I would think that high GPA students tend to be the hard working anal types whereas low GPA types tend to be lazy shits who don't give a fuck. I could definitely see the former group being mad at the latter for finding a way into the same position through a lot less work.


Yea that seems pretty accurate. Seems kind of weird to take it out on a law school, though.


Since the LSAT is a better predictor, I guess they should be taking it out on reality. :mrgreen:


score one for laziness :D

all you poli sci majors can suck it

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beachbum
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby beachbum » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:05 pm

fatduck wrote:score one for laziness :D

all you poli sci majors can suck it


Damn straight.

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stratocophic
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby stratocophic » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:13 pm

.
Last edited by stratocophic on Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Kohinoor » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:14 pm

Kswizzie wrote:
beachbum wrote:Shamelessly gaming the rankings probably doesn't help.


Doesn't hurt UVa which people seem to like for some reason

You mad?

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ihp12
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby ihp12 » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:28 pm

beachbum wrote:
fatduck wrote:score one for laziness :D

all you poli sci majors can suck it


Damn straight.


LOL

Remember when your mom said that if you wanted to get ahead in life you needed to work hard in school?

Well....your mom's a filthy liar. :D

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beachbum
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby beachbum » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:37 pm

ihp12 wrote:
beachbum wrote:
fatduck wrote:score one for laziness :D

all you poli sci majors can suck it


Damn straight.


LOL

Remember when your mom said that if you wanted to get ahead in life you needed to work hard in school?

Well....your mom's a filthy liar. :D


TBF, I had to bust my ass in my last two years to overcome the drunken haze of my first two. But yeah, God bless the LSAT. 4-hour test >> 4 years of school.

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ihp12
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby ihp12 » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm

beachbum wrote:
ihp12 wrote:
beachbum wrote:
fatduck wrote:score one for laziness :D

all you poli sci majors can suck it


Damn straight.


LOL

Remember when your mom said that if you wanted to get ahead in life you needed to work hard in school?

Well....your mom's a filthy liar. :D


TBF, I had to bust my ass in my last two years to overcome the drunken haze of my first two. But yeah, God bless the LSAT. 4-hour test >> 4 years of school.


+1 My 3.0 is a combination of two years of 2.0 and 2 years of 4.0.

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20160810
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby 20160810 » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:43 pm

fatduck wrote:Honestly Chicago's probably never going to recover.

THE SKY IS FALLING

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fatduck
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby fatduck » Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:45 pm

SBL wrote:
fatduck wrote:Honestly Chicago's probably never going to recover.

THE SKY IS FALLING


Dear god for the third time ITT it was just a dig at Chicago.

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Attorney
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Attorney » Thu Feb 24, 2011 5:40 pm

There aren't a lot of good answers for the WUSTL hate on TLS. I think the best answer is that it just boils down to it being a small private school in the non-Chicago midwest and that most people aren't very familiar with it. So they assume that it is "gaming the rankings" to be so highly rated at everything. People also accuse WUSTL of gaming rankings for undergrad (where it's been above Ivies such as Brown and Cornell for 10+ years now) and medical schools (where it was recently #1 and is now #4, consistently better than even Yale and Stanford). The undergrad program for instance had over 28,000 applications this year for 1,500 spaces. WUSTL, with its massive endowment and Nobel laureate prowess, will always be highly rated in most fields of study. And yet east and west coasters have never been there and have barely heard of it. Haters gonna hate.

To address concerns about the lawl school specifically:

1. WUSTL takes splitters. No shit. Nearly every school 19 to 30 accepts splitters with a smile. I'm a splitter, and Indiana offered me a $120,000 scholarship based entirely on my LSAT score. It happens. In this era of enormous grade inflation, there's not a lot else to base admissions on than LSAT scores. I'm sorry but your 3.9 from your Physical Education major at Little Sisters of the Poor College in Bakersfield is not terribly impressive if you can't break 165 on your LSAT. Hell, Northwestern takes 17X LSATs with 2.5-2.8 GPAs all the time (albeit with no scholarship support) and they are T14. WUSTL apparently doesn't take any splitters with less than 168+. The main difference between WUSTL and N'western seems to be that WashU may offer scholarships to 17X splitters, whereas NU will not; also that NU prefers older candidates with work experience. No one hates on Northwestern for being the only T14 to accept a bunch of splitters with <3.0 GPAs, do they? Splitterdom is nothing to hold against a school.

2. WUSTL is big only in Chicago and St. Louis. More or less accurate, but outside of the upper T14 nearly every school is regional. Georgetown is really only for DC and maybe NYC, Texas is only big in Texas, USC only in California, etc. Granted Chicago and possibly StL were hit hard in the recession, but where we are now is called the recovery. Corporate profits are higher than they were in 2008. The law hiring market is going to be pretty darned decent for the Class of 2014 in Chicago and St. Louis (and probably everywhere except California, heh).

3. WUSTL's placement is worse than its ranking. Hold on there. WUSTL, at #19, places MASSIVELY better than say the University of Minnesota at #22. In overlapping markets. The only schools placing better than WUSTL that are ranked lower are located in BosWash (BC, BU, GW, Fordham), a massive placement advantage over St. Louis. And those schools only place very, very marginally better ITE than WUSTL. http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843

Add it all up and WUSTL doesn't deserve the TLS hate in the least. Hate top-ranked schools accepting sub-3.0 splitters? Hate on Northwestern. It's ranked higher and does the same damn thing. Hate schools that place worse than their ranking? Hate on Minnesota and Indiana. They are ranked right behind WUSTL in the 20s but place worse than some TT schools (such as Temple and Loyola-Chicago). WUSTL's "Big Law" placement is at least twice as good as some of the schools right behind them in the rankings, and really its ITE placement is surprisingly high given its geographic location in what some would consider BFE.

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Blindmelon
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Blindmelon » Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:44 pm

Attorney wrote:
3. WUSTL's placement is worse than its ranking. Hold on there. WUSTL, at #19, places MASSIVELY better than say the University of Minnesota at #22. In overlapping markets. The only schools placing better than WUSTL that are ranked lower are located in BosWash (BC, BU, GW, Fordham), a massive placement advantage over St. Louis. And those schools only place very, very marginally better ITE than WUSTL. http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843



By your numbers, since WUSTL places MASSIVELY better than Minnesota, then BC and BU place MASSIVELY better than WUSTL (almost same differential). So you agree that its way over ranked?

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bk1
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby bk1 » Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:45 pm

Blindmelon wrote:
Attorney wrote:
3. WUSTL's placement is worse than its ranking. Hold on there. WUSTL, at #19, places MASSIVELY better than say the University of Minnesota at #22. In overlapping markets. The only schools placing better than WUSTL that are ranked lower are located in BosWash (BC, BU, GW, Fordham), a massive placement advantage over St. Louis. And those schools only place very, very marginally better ITE than WUSTL. http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843



By your numbers, since WUSTL places MASSIVELY better than Minnesota, then BC and BU place MASSIVELY better than WUSTL (almost same differential). So you agree that its way over ranked?


I lol'ed.

MrAnon
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby MrAnon » Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:58 pm

fatduck wrote:
MrAnon wrote:St. Louis is not exactly a major hiring market.

It attracts students who want to feel like they go to a destination school. Emory is another example. So they criss cross the country to attend what is very much a regional school. Not exactly the brightest student body.

Who knows really how many of the students find jobs.


Was your post carefully crafted to make as little sense as possible?

If WUSTL were a destination school it would mean people go to WUSTL so they can live and work in the Midwest. By saying WUSTL is "very much a regional school" you're saying its placement is limited to the Midwest.

In other words, what the fuck are you on about?


No. Harvard is a destination school. Yale is a destination school. Do those students want to work in Boston and New Haven? No, they want to go to New York. And they can, because the schools have national cachet. WUSTL does not. However it draws a type of student that wants for that, because they can't stomach the thought of going to the local T2. Its a T1 that attracts T2 students.

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romothesavior
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby romothesavior » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:01 pm

MrAnon wrote:Its a T1 that attracts T2 students.

Yeah, T2 students with T10 LSAT scores. :roll:

I actually sorta agreed with your post (even as a WUSTL student) up until you said that. Get a grip bro.

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FuManChusco
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby FuManChusco » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:01 pm

MrAnon wrote:
fatduck wrote:
MrAnon wrote:St. Louis is not exactly a major hiring market.

It attracts students who want to feel like they go to a destination school. Emory is another example. So they criss cross the country to attend what is very much a regional school. Not exactly the brightest student body.

Who knows really how many of the students find jobs.


Was your post carefully crafted to make as little sense as possible?

If WUSTL were a destination school it would mean people go to WUSTL so they can live and work in the Midwest. By saying WUSTL is "very much a regional school" you're saying its placement is limited to the Midwest.

In other words, what the fuck are you on about?


No. Harvard is a destination school. Yale is a destination school. Do those students want to work in Boston and New Haven? No, they want to go to New York. And they can, because the schools have national cachet. WUSTL does not. However it draws a type of student that wants for that, because they can't stomach the thought of going to the local T2. Its a T1 that attracts T2 students.


You're right. Having a 168+ definitely makes you a T2 student. Fucking troll.

MrAnon
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby MrAnon » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:02 pm

splitters.

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romothesavior
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby romothesavior » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:04 pm

MrAnon wrote:splitters.

Except that even with the "splitter-friendly" reputation of WUSTL, the majority of students aren't splitters. Most of my friends and I are 166-168/3.5+ students.

If you wanna knock us, knocking the caliber of our student body is a bad place to start.

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Hannibal
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Hannibal » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:06 pm

romothesavior wrote:
MrAnon wrote:splitters.

Except that even with the "splitter-friendly" reputation of WUSTL, the majority of students aren't splitters. Most of my friends and I are 166-168/3.5+ students.

If you wanna knock us, knocking the caliber of our student body is a bad place to start.


MrAnon = troll.

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FuManChusco
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby FuManChusco » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:09 pm

romothesavior wrote:
MrAnon wrote:splitters.

Except that even with the "splitter-friendly" reputation of WUSTL, the majority of students aren't splitters. Most of my friends and I are 166-168/3.5+ students.

If you wanna knock us, knocking the caliber of our student body is a bad place to start.


+1. Doesn't it still have a 3.7 gpa median? They clearly just accept splitters because they'll accept anyone with a high LSAT. Most of those 95th percentile and up scorers will find themselves at other schools. The midwest is not the most desirable place for a majority of people. WUSTL just needs to hedge their bets so they can keep their LSAT median up. It might not be pretty, but it's effective. You just can't attend the school with unrealistic expectations or you will leave disappointed. It's still a great school.

And yes, mr.anon is a giant troll.
Last edited by FuManChusco on Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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fatduck
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby fatduck » Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:09 pm

Hannibal wrote:
romothesavior wrote:
MrAnon wrote:splitters.

Except that even with the "splitter-friendly" reputation of WUSTL, the majority of students aren't splitters. Most of my friends and I are 166-168/3.5+ students.

If you wanna knock us, knocking the caliber of our student body is a bad place to start.


MrAnon = troll.


I initially thought he was just an idiot but having reviewed his post history Hannibal is correct.

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Attorney
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Attorney » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:20 pm

Blindmelon wrote:
Attorney wrote:
3. WUSTL's placement is worse than its ranking. Hold on there. WUSTL, at #19, places MASSIVELY better than say the University of Minnesota at #22. In overlapping markets. The only schools placing better than WUSTL that are ranked lower are located in BosWash (BC, BU, GW, Fordham), a massive placement advantage over St. Louis. And those schools only place very, very marginally better ITE than WUSTL. http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843



By your numbers, since WUSTL places MASSIVELY better than Minnesota, then BC and BU place MASSIVELY better than WUSTL (almost same differential). So you agree that its way over ranked?


Perhaps you're just bad at math. The difference between 10% and 1% is far larger than the difference between 100% and 91%. Start with that concept, and then move forward.

For the math-challenged who are attending law school (this is not especially surprising I suppose), WUSTL has 50% better placement than Minnesota (.275/.194 = ~1.5). To get that much better than WUSTL, you have to go up to Cornell and Georgetown (.413/.275 = ~1.5). This is just Big Law placement of course, but the reason I'm using those numbers is that TLS is incredibly Big Law obsessed.

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Verity
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Verity » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:39 pm

This is more directed toward some of the earlier comments ITT, but people need to stop all the anti-splitter trolling. Admitting that WUSTL gets a bad rap because it admits splitters isn't just anti-WUSTL trolling: it's anti-splitter. And I'm not even a splitter myself.

That said, WUSTL has consistently held an awesome ranking, and for good reason. Their only problem is location; but if you're set on the Midwest, with the amount of $$$ they give out, you'd be a fool for not going there.

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Attorney
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Attorney » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:44 pm

To drive the point home, here are some schools' 19-30 US News rankings versus their ordinal Big Law placement rankings.

WUSTL 19/24 (-5)
Minnesota 22/35 (-13)
Indiana 27/50+ (-23)
UC Davis 28/39 (-11)
UNC 28/48 (-20)

It seems a bit ignorant to say WUSTL's placement ranking is so much worse than its USN ranking, when other schools ranked right behind it appear to "game the rankings" to a much larger extent.

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Verity
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby Verity » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:00 pm

MrAnon wrote:splitters.


Splitters are the ones you should be afraid of. They're the ones that are going to fuck your curve and then eat your lunch. Why? Because they're hungry. And smart.

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PomasThynchon
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Re: Why do people here make WUSTL out to be worse than...

Postby PomasThynchon » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:05 pm

beachbum wrote:Shamelessly gaming the rankings probably doesn't help.


I don't buy it. A strong entering class is a strong entering class. You can't quantify how much students "want" a school just because of the $$$ they get. Strong students are strong students, period.




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