50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

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seriously????
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby seriously???? » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:45 pm

first in terms of big law placement, its definitely the first 17 schools with pretty good chances, then use the "goto law schools for nlj250". You'd be surprised to see some T2 schools on the list, and some higher T1 (mainly indiana) off the list.
congrats to all those who got accepted to t14 and are possibly considering a great scholarship at a 17-30 type school. I think this decision is hit or miss. If you definitely want big law for the long haul take the t14 and debt. However, if you want to goto a school that places 20-30 percent of its students in big law and have no debt, thats not a bad choice but you can get burned. Just heard of an acquaintance of mine who went to GWU on a full ride, who is currently doing temp doc review. But who knows, if he finds a good job in the next year, he still may have made the right choice.

Now, as far as asking if ones T1, T2, T3, T4 places well, you can do your own research. It is hard to trust what admissions people tell you, if they tell you anything. One thing I have been doing is looking at past Law Review staff's, then looking up those people online. Usually you can find out where they are working, or if they are working. You can also find more students names by finding out who was on moot court teams, etc. Finally, you can just search "nlj250 law firms" and all the biglaw firms will show up with links. Find the biglaw firms in the area of interest, and find bio's on people who went to the school you are researching. On these bio's they also have email addreses, and I will soon be emailing some of these people about how they landed their jobs. It is harder to know what the average graduate is doing, but at least you can gauge how some of the better students are doing.

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pilchc
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby pilchc » Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:40 am

Thank you sidewaysglance and thesealocust for posting those links. I love statistics and what you sent was exactly what I was looking for.

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romothesavior
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby romothesavior » Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:47 am

smittelman6 wrote:
romothesavior wrote: Why do you assume that we assume that everyone coming out of law school expects to be making 160k? Because I've never seen anyone say that, and I'm getting sick and f***ing tired of people (mostly 0Ls) putting words in our mouths.


no need for the hostility. a lot of times, t14s on TLS do take "get a job" to be equivalent with "get a biglaw job" which, as you may already know but clearly they do not, many of us don't want/care about.

And that's perfectly fine. But a PI/gov't/smalllaw/biglaw/midlaw/etc-oriented student at a T3 needs to know that their odds will be worse than a student at a T1. And a T1 student needs to know their odds are worse than someone at a T14, and those students need to know their odds are going to be worse than someone at HYSCCN.

This persistent myth/assumption that biglaw placement is the only major difference between a T14 and the rest needs to stop. This isn't to say that a non-T14 is necessarily a bad investment for an individual person (I am fine with my decision and I don't go to a T14), but in general and in nearly all aspects, they are worse investments. That is why (again, like I've said 100s of times before), the key in going to any school outside of the uber-elite is minimizing risk, which usually means keeping debt low. But you'd be fooling yourself if you didn't think there was a tangible difference in employment prospects across the board between the elites and the rest.

Gleason
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby Gleason » Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:31 am

I can't claim I know anything first hand, but when I was considering law school this past fall I did a lot, way too much, research on USD and the San Diego market. I would, with all my powers of persuasion, urge against USD now. The market is thin. It's in a very desirable location near a lot of top schools. There's no way I can convey all the information I found, but one very easy thing to do would be to search "San Diego" right in this forum and go through everything. I made myself read every thread that had San Diego in it. Then limit the search to the "Legal Employment" and concentrate there. People in this section aren't as informed as you'd like. Actual law students and grads don't care anymore about "Which law school should I choose." So you won't find them here.

Also talk to professors at USD. They can be surprisingly forthcoming when you talk to them by voice. And, of course, students and recent grads. If you find someone from USD in the legal employment section, PM them. They'll likely give you their impressions. I found a few, to be somewhat sure I wasn't just getting the one disgruntled bottom 1% guy
What I found out wasn't pretty when I did it, but you'll have to do it yourself.

For me, personally, after all the research, going to USD and Davis and a couple other schools nearer to me, I decided not to apply at all. It's too crazy out there. My LSAT score and all my recommendations and transcripts are with LSAC, and I managed to get an LSAC fee waiver. Still, well, you'll have to balance everything yourself. Lucky for you there is a lot more information out there than there was just a few years ago.

Edit: As for Hastings. I know less about Hastings, as I preferred Davis and there's only so much time in the day. Davis, which is generally considered to be almost identical to Hastings in a lot of ways, did look a lot better. Night and day better. But my impression was that you would have to be happy to stick in NorCal, but that prospects in San Diego were the same, or at least not significantly worse, than with USD.
Soo, if it's an either/or, I'd say Hastings, or Davis! But I'm still not convinced that's the route to a happy existence.

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RickyRoe
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby RickyRoe » Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:00 am

mrwarre85 wrote:University of Oklahoma is tier two and is the highest ranked of the three schools in Oklahoma. Its great if you want to work in Oklahoma. University of New Mexico is the only school in New Mexico. Killer placement in that state obviously. University of Denver is tier 2 like the others and is one of two schools in Colorado. I think like half of the practicing lawyers in the state went there.

Like they said its really where you want to live. Tier two in California or Florida sounds terrifying, but in some states it isn't a bad bet at all.



Why single out Florida? Is there some T14 in Florida I am unaware of? The theme of this thread has been to go to a school that only has T2 schools and Florida fits that model. Yes, they have 3 T2 schools (Miami, FSU, UF) and a ton of TTTs (Nova SE, Stetson, FL Coastal, FIU, St. Thomas, Barry, Fl A&M), but I have to believe that going to UF, even at in-state sticker, is not a death sentence.

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thesealocust
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby thesealocust » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:24 am

RickyRoe wrote:
mrwarre85 wrote:University of Oklahoma is tier two and is the highest ranked of the three schools in Oklahoma. Its great if you want to work in Oklahoma. University of New Mexico is the only school in New Mexico. Killer placement in that state obviously. University of Denver is tier 2 like the others and is one of two schools in Colorado. I think like half of the practicing lawyers in the state went there.

Like they said its really where you want to live. Tier two in California or Florida sounds terrifying, but in some states it isn't a bad bet at all.



Why single out Florida? Is there some T14 in Florida I am unaware of? The theme of this thread has been to go to a school that only has T2 schools and Florida fits that model. Yes, they have 3 T2 schools (Miami, FSU, UF) and a ton of TTTs (Nova SE, Stetson, FL Coastal, FIU, St. Thomas, Barry, Fl A&M), but I have to believe that going to UF, even at in-state sticker, is not a death sentence.


The problem is that legal markets don't track perfectly with human markets. Florida is big but the Florida legal market is relatively small. Pull up the big firms and you'll see a lot of grads from the various florida schools, but you will also see a lot of people from T14 schools 'coming home' to Florida. The reason Florida and Cali get singled out is because they are particularly overcrowded in terms of the grads : available local jobs ratio.

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pilchc
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Re: 50 - 100 schools = what career prosects?

Postby pilchc » Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:02 pm

What about Illinios? Compared to other states is it overcrowded too?




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