What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

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Stringer6
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Stringer6 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:52 am

I'm sorry, could you explain the joke?


1. that the NYtimes article about an idiot that when to Thomas Jefferson Law School and used loan money to globetrot is somehow a valuable source of information

2. that the survey referenced is somehow complete BS (it may reference old data, but the data is good)

Rule11
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Rule11 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:04 pm

Could you expand on the second point?

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:18 pm

thexfactor wrote:lawfreak:

Please do not go to carbozo.

I noticed from your previous posts that you have a 158 and a 3.95. Please retake and ED to UVA. If you can get another 2-5 pts you can have a decent chance at getting into UVA. PJO got into UVA with a similar gpa and a 162 or so on his lsats.

The difference between UVA and Carbozo is night and day.

I urge you to retake in June. You have a great GPA don't waste it on a t2 school that places only for the top 10% of it s class.


YOU HAVE A *%^$ing 3.95? HOLY CRAP. DO NOT GO HERE. UP THAT LSAT. 3.95 is killer! Like holy shit, you actually have a chance of working in nyc if you can bump your lsat.

like. ahhh... plz.

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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby bigkahuna2020 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:39 pm

Nicholasnickynic wrote:
thexfactor wrote:lawfreak:

Please do not go to carbozo.

I noticed from your previous posts that you have a 158 and a 3.95. Please retake and ED to UVA. If you can get another 2-5 pts you can have a decent chance at getting into UVA. PJO got into UVA with a similar gpa and a 162 or so on his lsats.

The difference between UVA and Carbozo is night and day.

I urge you to retake in June. You have a great GPA don't waste it on a t2 school that places only for the top 10% of it s class.


YOU HAVE A *%^$ing 3.95? HOLY CRAP. DO NOT GO HERE. UP THAT LSAT. 3.95 is killer! Like holy shit, you actually have a chance of working in nyc if you can bump your lsat.

like. ahhh... plz.


Anyone that uses "like" as a filler word when he/she types does not deserve to give advice

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rocon7383
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby rocon7383 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:02 pm

If I had a 3.95 I would take a year off, work at a moderately enjoyable job, and study for the LSAT for 10 months. Seriously. Lock yourself in a room, hire a tutor, whatever. Get a 170 and you're looking at NYU, Columbia, Yale even, and full rides at the likes of Fordham. Not hating on Cardozo, but don't waste that GPA

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:26 pm

Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:

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Ikki
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Ikki » Tue Feb 15, 2011 8:46 pm

lawfreak wrote:Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:


You are doing yourself (and the American taxpayer) a disservice by not retaking.

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rocon7383
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby rocon7383 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 8:56 pm

Ikki wrote:
lawfreak wrote:Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:


You are doing yourself (and the American taxpayer) a disservice by not retaking.


I have to agree. As "bad" of a standardized taker you are, if you study for a preposterous amount of time so that it becomes second nature, you won't have any choice but to do significantly better. For instance, if you were given a standardized test on how to spell common english words in a limited amount of time you'd do well. So if LSAT games/tricks are second nature you'd get out of your own head. Just sayin.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:33 pm

lawfreak wrote:Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:

Nothing you can do?

So then you've studied to the max and retaken multiple times?

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:35 pm

bigkahuna2020 wrote:Anyone that uses "like" as a filler word when he/she types does not deserve to give advice


Anyone that does not end his/her sentences with a period when he/she types does not deserve to be able criticize anyone else's grammar. Douche.
Last edited by Nicholasnickynic on Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:38 pm

Nicholasnickynic wrote:
lawfreak wrote:Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:

Nothing you can do?

So then you've studied to the max and retaken multiple times?


As a matter of fact I have. I do appreciate the encouragement though.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:40 pm

lawfreak wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:
lawfreak wrote:Thanks guys for the encouragement on my GPA! Unfortunately, I just suck at taking standardized tests so there is really nothing I can do to change that LSAT score. I already applied to schools and I'm just gonna hope for the best. Maybe if I get really lucky Fordham will accept me to their night program :cry:

Nothing you can do?

So then you've studied to the max and retaken multiple times?


As a matter of fact I have. I do appreciate the encouragement though.


If I were you, I'd aim for a different market. There are plenty of T2 schools that you could go to at a decent cost and have a successful (non-big law) career.

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:45 pm

Quite frankly, I don't give a camel's ass which market I'm working in, so long as I am making the max amount of money I can. That being said, based on what I hear, Biglaw is the easiest way to make the big bucks. Although, I am considering starting my own firm one day but that is far from a guarantee. I feel kind of hopless right now, that;s the truth. All I can do is just try my best given my numbers.

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Ikki
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Ikki » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:47 pm

lawfreak wrote:Quite frankly, I don't give a camel's ass which market I'm working in, so long as I am making the max amount of money I can. That being said, based on what I hear, Biglaw is the easiest way to make the big bucks. Although, I am considering starting my own firm one day but that is far from a guarantee. I feel kind of hopless right now, that;s the truth. All I can do is just try my best given my numbers.


It's a shame to have such a great GPA coupled with a shitty LSAT, I wouldn't go to Cardozo if I were you. Is law the only option for you right now? With that GPA, I'm certain you could do other things (Military, start a business, sales, teach English abroad, etc.)

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:53 pm

Ikki wrote:
lawfreak wrote:Quite frankly, I don't give a camel's ass which market I'm working in, so long as I am making the max amount of money I can. That being said, based on what I hear, Biglaw is the easiest way to make the big bucks. Although, I am considering starting my own firm one day but that is far from a guarantee. I feel kind of hopless right now, that;s the truth. All I can do is just try my best given my numbers.


It's a shame to have such a great GPA coupled with a shitty LSAT, I wouldn't go to Cardozo if I were you. Is law the only option for you right now? With that GPA, I'm certain you could do other things (Military, start a business, sales, teach English abroad, etc.)


I don't understand, why are these law schools even open if virtually everyone that goes there wont get jobs and will basically ruin their lives? Why is the volume of law school applications so freakin high if law school is such a bad idea? I can understand if a 100 people can make such a bad mistake, but thousands upon thousands of people making that mistake just sounds too crazy to me. There must be something good about law schools (especially tier 1 and 2) based on the sheer number of applicants alone. I can't imagine all these people are just blindly going in with false hopes destined for poverty.

In regards to those suggestions, none of them sounds like a better option to me than law school. Anyone can start a business. That has nothing to do with GPA, and yes, law school is really my only option right now. Thanks for trying though.

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Ikki
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Ikki » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:01 pm

lawfreak wrote:
Ikki wrote:
lawfreak wrote:Quite frankly, I don't give a camel's ass which market I'm working in, so long as I am making the max amount of money I can. That being said, based on what I hear, Biglaw is the easiest way to make the big bucks. Although, I am considering starting my own firm one day but that is far from a guarantee. I feel kind of hopless right now, that;s the truth. All I can do is just try my best given my numbers.


It's a shame to have such a great GPA coupled with a shitty LSAT, I wouldn't go to Cardozo if I were you. Is law the only option for you right now? With that GPA, I'm certain you could do other things (Military, start a business, sales, teach English abroad, etc.)


I don't understand, why are these law schools even open if virtually everyone that goes there wont get jobs and will basically ruin their lives? Why is the volume of law school applications so freakin high if law school is such a bad idea? I can understand if a 100 people can make such a bad mistake, but thousands upon thousands of people making that mistake just sounds too crazy to me. There must be something good about law schools (especially tier 1 and 2) based on the sheer number of applicants alone. I can't imagine all these people are just blindly going in with false hopes destined for poverty.

In regards to those suggestions, none of them sounds like a better option to me than law school. Anyone can start a business. That has nothing to do with GPA, but thatnks for trying though.


Well, you sure knew how to get almost straight A's throughout UG, you are certainly no idiot, and not everyone can run a successful business.

I don't want to repeat what others have already said in this thread (yeah, I'm lazy) but if you're going to Cardozo because you are set on biglaw, I bet there's more than a 90% possibility you don't get any callbacks. Just look at the employment numbers other posters have linked on this thread, Cardozo was no sure thing before the economic downturn and it certainly isn't getting any better. You don't have to look that far, there are Columbia, Northwestern, UT grads here on TLS that did not get ANY callbacks, that's right, they are currently unemployed. You really think you'll fare that much better?

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:05 pm

What about the fact that there are so many people still applying to law schools? I'm also lazy to repeat what I wrote lol, so please see my above post.

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bk1
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby bk1 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:06 pm

lawfreak wrote:I don't understand, why are these law schools even open if virtually everyone that goes there wont get jobs and will basically ruin their lives? Why is the volume of law school applications so freakin high if law school is such a bad idea? I can understand if a 100 people can make such a bad mistake, but thousands upon thousands of people making that mistake just sounds too crazy to me. There must be something good about law schools (especially tier 1 and 2) based on the sheer number of applicants alone. I can't imagine all these people are just blindly going in with false hopes destined for poverty.

In regards to those suggestions, none of them sounds like a better option to me than law school. Anyone can start a business. That has nothing to do with GPA, and yes, law school is really my only option right now. Thanks for trying though.


People are ignorant of the truth because schools purposefully obscure the truth (e.g. Cardozo says it has a median starting salary of 137.5k). People also are just very ignorant of the legal market and just go assuming that the legal field is great. This also ignores the fact that the law school tuition, as well as the way the legal field is set up, has changed drastically in recent years yet people are unaware of this.

To sum it up, people are stupid and they do stupid things in droves. This should be obvious and law school is no exception. It's really easy to go into financial suicide when loans are so readily available. It's not like they have to pony up that much cash to start out.

Also, law school is not your only option right now unless someone has a gun to your head. Then, in that case, it might be your only option.

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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby bk1 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:06 pm

lawfreak wrote:What about the fact that there are so many people still applying to law schools? I'm also lazy to repeat what I wrote lol, so please see my above post.


So just because a lot of people do something automatically makes it intelligent and/or financially worthwhile?

You do realize that lots of people buy lotto tickets, right?

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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:15 pm

bk1 wrote:
lawfreak wrote:What about the fact that there are so many people still applying to law schools? I'm also lazy to repeat what I wrote lol, so please see my above post.


So just because a lot of people do something automatically makes it intelligent and/or financially worthwhile?

You do realize that lots of people buy lotto tickets, right?


First of all, who ever said there's anything wrong with buying lotto tickets? People doing that are probably not putting themselves in any risk of financial hell. It actually makes a lot of sense.

Aside from that, I'm not just talking about a few hundred people. I'm talking about crazy numbers of people making "stupid" decisions according to you. Oh, and by the way, didn't YOU and all you guys on this forum choose law school? If it's such a bad idea even for harvard students then why are you people in law school?

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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby bk1 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:20 pm

lawfreak wrote:Aside from that, I'm not just talking about a few hundred people. I'm talking about crazy numbers of people making "stupid" decisions according to you. Oh, and by the way, didn't YOU and all you guys on this forum choose law school? If it's such a bad idea even for harvard students then why are you people in law school?


It's not a bad idea for Harvard students, you're hyperbolic.

I'd say that if you can keep your debt under 100k total, that a strong regional school is not financial suicide. You will be just making ends meet after debt payments (assuming you fail to land biglaw), but if you really want to be a lawyer then it isn't the worst idea. Those of us on this forum are going to law school because we want to be lawyers, ideally it won't be financial suicide for most of us. Also, TLS isn't representative of the average law grad a lot more people on this forum get large scholarships and/or go to top schools compared to the rest of law applicants.

People are ignorant and stupid and make stupid decisions in droves. How is that complicated to understand? The legal market is also fundamentally different than it was 3-4 years ago and people fail to realize this because they think that law school is a shelter from the economy. Not to mention that a lot them don't even realize that the main time for getting biglaw is at the beginning of your 2L year and that if you don't get it then you are basically shut out forever. You are really going to crowdsource your decision to go to law school based on people who are uninformed about the very basics of legal hiring?

lawfreak wrote:First of all, who ever said there's anything wrong with buying lotto tickets? People doing that are probably not putting themselves in any risk of financial hell. It actually makes a lot of sense.


If you are being serious that buying a lotto ticket makes any sort of financial sense then there really is no hope in convincing you.

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Ikki
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby Ikki » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:23 pm

lawfreak wrote:
bk1 wrote:
lawfreak wrote:What about the fact that there are so many people still applying to law schools? I'm also lazy to repeat what I wrote lol, so please see my above post.


So just because a lot of people do something automatically makes it intelligent and/or financially worthwhile?

You do realize that lots of people buy lotto tickets, right?


First of all, who ever said there's anything wrong with buying lotto tickets? People doing that are probably not putting themselves in any risk of financial hell. It actually makes a lot of sense.

Aside from that, I'm not just talking about a few hundred people. I'm talking about crazy numbers of people making "stupid" decisions according to you. Oh, and by the way, didn't YOU and all you guys on this forum choose law school? If it's such a bad idea even for harvard students then why are you people in law school?


There is something wrong buying a lotto ticket that has a $150,000 price tag.

This is not JDU, I don't recall anyone saying Harvard was a bad idea for anyone. Cardozo however, is a bad idea for a person that has a GPA in the 75th at all law schools, is set on biglaw, but wants to go to Cardozo. Unless Uncle Charlie has a job lined up for you at Cravath or some NLJ250 firm, I (and most knowledgeable TLS posters) really doubt that you'll get big law. Are you really not scared what being unemployed and being buried in almost $150,000 in loans (or more) might feel like?

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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby cmraider » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:27 pm

lawfreak wrote:I don't understand, why are these law schools even open if virtually everyone that goes there wont get jobs and will basically ruin their lives? Why is the volume of law school applications so freakin high if law school is such a bad idea? I can understand if a 100 people can make such a bad mistake, but thousands upon thousands of people making that mistake just sounds too crazy to me. There must be something good about law schools (especially tier 1 and 2) based on the sheer number of applicants alone. I can't imagine all these people are just blindly going in with false hopes destined for poverty.

In regards to those suggestions, none of them sounds like a better option to me than law school. Anyone can start a business. That has nothing to do with GPA, and yes, law school is really my only option right now. Thanks for trying though.


I've been reading this thread, and while I don't have a dog in this fight, here's my .02.

Judging from your responses, nothing anyone says, good or bad, is going to keep you from choosing Cardozo. Each time someone says anything disparaging, you attack their credibility. Likewise, when someone posts positively, you take their side. My impression is that you want justification for your decision to choose Cardozo. However, you are unlikely to find it on this message board, partly because a lot of TLS people are very caustic, but also because they are trying to inform you about what your expectations should be.

If you absolutely have to go to LS this year, and you're not tied to NYC, then why are you so dead-set on Cardozo? Not all t2s are created equal. Location plays a huge factor. If you can stand to leave NYC, you could try your hand at a similarly ranked school, such as Tulane. In Louisiana, Tulane is the big dog, and while I don't have first-hand knowledge, I would guess that Tulane grads get top New Orleans jobs because it has a significantly better ranking than the No. 2 LS (LSU). These are two schools with similar ranks nationally, but if you break it down to regional reputation, Tulane is better in its region than Cardozo.

FWIW, I don't know anything about the NYC legal market. I'm just an unbiased reader making an observation.

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:29 pm

"You don't have to look that far, there are Columbia, Northwestern, UT grads here on TLS that did not get ANY callbacks, that's right, they are currently unemployed."

I don't know how to quote specific parts of your text so i did it this way.

In regards to the other guy who said if you don't get a biglaw job after 2L, you're shut out forever - I can think of at least 1 person off the top of my head that started with a government job, and got biglaw later on in life. I know I used only 1 person, but I don;t know that many lawyers so it's a large percentage for me.

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lawfreak
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Re: What is your opinion on Cardozo Law School?

Postby lawfreak » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:31 pm

cmraider wrote:
lawfreak wrote:I don't understand, why are these law schools even open if virtually everyone that goes there wont get jobs and will basically ruin their lives? Why is the volume of law school applications so freakin high if law school is such a bad idea? I can understand if a 100 people can make such a bad mistake, but thousands upon thousands of people making that mistake just sounds too crazy to me. There must be something good about law schools (especially tier 1 and 2) based on the sheer number of applicants alone. I can't imagine all these people are just blindly going in with false hopes destined for poverty.

In regards to those suggestions, none of them sounds like a better option to me than law school. Anyone can start a business. That has nothing to do with GPA, and yes, law school is really my only option right now. Thanks for trying though.


I've been reading this thread, and while I don't have a dog in this fight, here's my .02.

Judging from your responses, nothing anyone says, good or bad, is going to keep you from choosing Cardozo. Each time someone says anything disparaging, you attack their credibility. Likewise, when someone posts positively, you take their side. My impression is that you want justification for your decision to choose Cardozo. However, you are unlikely to find it on this message board, partly because a lot of TLS people are very caustic, but also because they are trying to inform you about what your expectations should be.

If you absolutely have to go to LS this year, and you're not tied to NYC, then why are you so dead-set on Cardozo? Not all t2s are created equal. Location plays a huge factor. If you can stand to leave NYC, you could try your hand at a similarly ranked school, such as Tulane. In Louisiana, Tulane is the big dog, and while I don't have first-hand knowledge, I would guess that Tulane grads get top New Orleans jobs because it has a significantly better ranking than the No. 2 LS (LSU). These are two schools with similar ranks nationally, but if you break it down to regional reputation, Tulane is better in its region than Cardozo.

FWIW, I don't know anything about the NYC legal market. I'm just an unbiased reader making an observation.


I am not trying to attack anyones credibelity,. I am just playing devil's advocate . In regards to leaving NYC, given my circumstances, I am sort of tied to NY.

I noticed we have similar numbers. May I ask where you are planning on going?
Last edited by lawfreak on Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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