What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

UF or FSU?

UF
56
53%
FSU (20k)
50
47%
 
Total votes: 106

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Grizz
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Grizz » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:54 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Barbie wrote:I recently spoke with students at both UF and FSU. The UF students said they are getting a lot of summer opportunities, and that all the top firms are going to UF and not FSU. One of my good friends who goes to UF also said that 20k is not nearly enough incentive to choose FSU over UF, when he has learned that UF is really much better regarded in the legal community. He actually was choosing between the two and chose UF over FSU for random reasons, but said hes glad he did since he has learned all these things.

Also, I've done some research and it seems like the COL in Gainesville will be significantly less than in Tallahassee.

So, I am changing the poll and everything to see if you guys had to decide between FSU (20k) and UF (probably sticker) for me, which you would choose. Again, I appreciate all the help!!

Sidenote: I haven't ruled out Illinois, but I want to decide on a Florida school in the event that I chose to stick around (which is seeming more and more likely)


This is why I voted for Florida.
UF >>>>>> FSU

LOL at "a lot" of job opportunities coming from either school. Let's not be naive


+ over 9000

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Malcolm8X
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Malcolm8X » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:54 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Barbie wrote:I recently spoke with students at both UF and FSU. The UF students said they are getting a lot of summer opportunities, and that all the top firms are going to UF and not FSU. One of my good friends who goes to UF also said that 20k is not nearly enough incentive to choose FSU over UF, when he has learned that UF is really much better regarded in the legal community. He actually was choosing between the two and chose UF over FSU for random reasons, but said hes glad he did since he has learned all these things.

Also, I've done some research and it seems like the COL in Gainesville will be significantly less than in Tallahassee.

So, I am changing the poll and everything to see if you guys had to decide between FSU (20k) and UF (probably sticker) for me, which you would choose. Again, I appreciate all the help!!

Sidenote: I haven't ruled out Illinois, but I want to decide on a Florida school in the event that I chose to stick around (which is seeming more and more likely)


This is why I voted for Florida.
UF >>>>>> FSU

LOL at "a lot" of job opportunities coming from either school. Let's not be naive


Ur actually right. I doubt they get "a lot" but it's definitely more than FSU.

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tea_drinker
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby tea_drinker » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:54 pm

Which school (UF or FSU) is closer to your current place? I feel like for someone in your situation, less disruption in life is better.

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Barbie
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby Barbie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:55 pm

tea_drinker wrote:Which school (UF or FSU) is closer to your current place? I feel like for someone in your situation, less disruption in life is better.


Gville is closer to my home (Tampa) and my fiance's home (Jacksonville).

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lisjjen
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby lisjjen » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:57 pm

ScrabbleChamp wrote:
I don't know where you are getting your stats, so I can't speak to their validity. The most updated info I can find is an average salary of $78k for private sector FSU grads (per FSU website) and $92k private sector for UF grads (per TLS). However, I doubt highly the validity of the UF stat as a friend of mine is a 2nd year BigLaw associate in Tampa and he was hired at $105k. With less than 10% of UF grads getting BigLaw, it's hard to imagine the median is $92k, when the market rate is $105k for BigLaw.


So the poster who is adverse to using statistics whips out FSU's unaudited, proprietary income statistic (which is still lower) to counter TLS's number that they get from USNWR. Then, you use one personal example to try and generalize the entire University's hiring statistics.

Look ScrabbleChamp. You've obviously already made up your mind that you want to attend FSU. Godspeed and good luck, this is a personal decision, and I'm glad you chose the school that's going to be better for what you're looking for [I swear this is not sarcasm]. I'm just trying to answer Barbie's question. She asked what school would I choose. I answer with the school I'd go with and why.

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ScrabbleChamp
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:58 pm

govorett wrote:When I interviewed for NU in Tampa, my interviewer was more than happy to introduce me to all of the FSU grads in his office. If you do well at either school, you should be fine. While you are in Tallahassee, get out and see all of the nice neighborhoods around. I agree that UF is veeery confined and all about the school. I think Tallahassee is better and there is a lot to do in terms of having fun to going hiking.


Who was your interviewer? My NU guy took me out to a nice restaurant, but I'd much rather have met in his office and met other practicing attorneys. My Vandy interview was done at the office, though the interviewer didn't introduce me to anyone.

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Barbie
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby Barbie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:01 pm

ScrabbleChamp wrote:
govorett wrote:When I interviewed for NU in Tampa, my interviewer was more than happy to introduce me to all of the FSU grads in his office. If you do well at either school, you should be fine. While you are in Tallahassee, get out and see all of the nice neighborhoods around. I agree that UF is veeery confined and all about the school. I think Tallahassee is better and there is a lot to do in terms of having fun to going hiking.


Who was your interviewer? My NU guy took me out to a nice restaurant, but I'd much rather have met in his office and met other practicing attorneys. My Vandy interview was done at the office, though the interviewer didn't introduce me to anyone.


Are the stats in your profile right? If so, thats pretty epic getting a vandy and NU interview.

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ScrabbleChamp
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:04 pm

So the poster who is adverse to using statistics whips out FSU's unaudited, proprietary income statistic (which is still lower) to counter TLS's number that they get from USNWR. Then, you use one personal example to try and generalize the entire University's hiring statistics.

Look ScrabbleChamp. You've obviously already made up your mind that you want to attend FSU. Godspeed and good luck, this is a personal decision, and I'm glad you chose the school that's going to be better for what you're looking for [I swear this is not sarcasm]. I'm just trying to answer Barbie's question. She asked what school would I choose. I answer with the school I'd go with and why.[/quote]

Dude, I didn't even apply to FSU... And, in case you didn't know, USNWR uses what the schools provide, they don't commission some independent study. The figure I used from the FSU website is the same thing that they provide to USNWR. I'm not saying that makes it valid, simply stating the numbers (what is reported on the school website and what is reported to USNWR) are the same. And, my personal example is pointed. BigLaw market is BigLaw market. If less than 10% of the class is going to make $105k, it's hard to imagine the median of that same class is $92k. I don't know why that's a hard concept to grasp.

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:05 pm

Malcolm8X wrote:
Ur actually right. I doubt they get "a lot" but it's definitely more than FSU.

In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.
Last edited by Mickey Quicknumbers on Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ResolutePear
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby ResolutePear » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:07 pm

Why would anybody want to go to FSU? It was a woman's school when it started out.

UF on the other hand was part of the southern "ivy" schools. Jeeez - tough choice here!!



(No, really - it is a tough choice. Good luck.)

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ScrabbleChamp
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:09 pm

Barbie wrote:
ScrabbleChamp wrote:
govorett wrote:When I interviewed for NU in Tampa, my interviewer was more than happy to introduce me to all of the FSU grads in his office. If you do well at either school, you should be fine. While you are in Tallahassee, get out and see all of the nice neighborhoods around. I agree that UF is veeery confined and all about the school. I think Tallahassee is better and there is a lot to do in terms of having fun to going hiking.


Who was your interviewer? My NU guy took me out to a nice restaurant, but I'd much rather have met in his office and met other practicing attorneys. My Vandy interview was done at the office, though the interviewer didn't introduce me to anyone.


Are the stats in your profile right? If so, thats pretty epic getting a vandy and NU interview.


Haha... I'll try not to take that personally. :-) The interviews really aren't that hard to get... you just request them, at least that's how it worked for me. I wouldn't even have scheduled them if I knew what my LSAT was going to be. I took it 7 years ago and got a 174, but that score was obviously not going to be applicable for this cycle. I retook, assuming I'd score similarly, but I was very wrong. I didn't study long enough. It was much easier to be in the "test" mindset while I was still in undergrad. Now, with a family, 50+ hour work weeks, and some other random stuff, I just didn't study the way I should have. But, everything happens for a reason. :-)

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tea_drinker
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby tea_drinker » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:14 pm

Barbie wrote:
tea_drinker wrote:Which school (UF or FSU) is closer to your current place? I feel like for someone in your situation, less disruption in life is better.


Gville is closer to my home (Tampa) and my fiance's home (Jacksonville).


I had to google map FL to see Jacksonville is closer to UF than FSU :D If that's the case, I think UF may be a more sensible choice between the two. How does your fiance feel about the two schools? Would he be able to keep his job if you go to UF? What'd happen if you go to FSU? The debt difference isn't much, and I assume placements aren't much different between these two as well. So, whatever school works best for you, your situation, your fiance's work and your peace of mind should be the one.

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:17 pm

Barbie wrote:
ScrabbleChamp wrote:
Really? I'm going to have a better idea after this month, but from the few times I've been to both cities I would put UF >> FSU for my personal preference. Like I said, I'll definitly have to put more time, etc into it while I'm visitng both.


Tallahassee is a real city that has a lot more going for it than the hideous Orange and Blue that Gainesville does. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, in Gainesville revolves around the school's athletic programs. Gainesville is the perfect definition of a college town... Nothing but the college and college students. The housing in the area is pretty disgusting, the town is pretty disgusting, and you'll never find a dearth of drunken Greek life types walking around. Tallahassee, on the other hand, has so much more going for it than the university. There are actual people that don't obsess about "Gator Nation."

If you want to relive your undergrad years and be surrounded by inebriated, fanatical students in a filthy town for 3 years, choose UF. If you want to live amongst real humans, choose FSU.


The inebriated greeks and undergrad-nation is actually how I've always pictured FSU (visited only on big football weekends). I'm hoping scholars day will change my mind.

Not sure if this was addressed, but the location of the law school is kinda crazy, it's almost a straight line where

[capitol building]=====[downtown area]=====[law school][sorority house][sorority hours][sorority house][wescott/begin campus]

and you're RIGHT next to potbelly's. So it's kindof the best/worst of both worlds.

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98234872348
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby 98234872348 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:18 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.

All of the big firms that came to UF this year at the very least extended some call backs, so I don't think they were necessarily courtesy interviews. Although, when GT is interviewing 33 people through OCI and only planning to hire 1, I guess you could say that the majority of the interviews were courtesy interviews.

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Barbie
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby Barbie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:21 pm

tea_drinker wrote:
Barbie wrote:
tea_drinker wrote:Which school (UF or FSU) is closer to your current place? I feel like for someone in your situation, less disruption in life is better.


Gville is closer to my home (Tampa) and my fiance's home (Jacksonville).


I had to google map FL to see Jacksonville is closer to UF than FSU :D If that's the case, I think UF may be a more sensible choice between the two. How does your fiance feel about the two schools? Would he be able to keep his job if you go to UF? What'd happen if you go to FSU? The debt difference isn't much, and I assume placements aren't much different between these two as well. So, whatever school works best for you, your situation, your fiance's work and your peace of mind should be the one.


He is literally the biggest gator fan I've ever met that doesn't go to UF. When we first moved in together, I had to HIDE his gator bedsheets, comforter, chair, blankets, posters, footballs, rugs, doormats, mugs (this list really goes on...) so that I could have a well decorated home. So, he is voting UF all the way haha-- hoping we can score some football tickets. At either place it looks like he will be getting a brand new job. He has a business degree and is hoping to score a gig at least managing a bar or restaurant but I have no idea how this will pan out. He knows the rugby folk at UF pretty well and I'm sure they would help him.

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dr123
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby dr123 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:22 pm

tea_drinker wrote:
Barbie wrote:
tea_drinker wrote:Which school (UF or FSU) is closer to your current place? I feel like for someone in your situation, less disruption in life is better.


Gville is closer to my home (Tampa) and my fiance's home (Jacksonville).


I had to google map FL to see Jacksonville is closer to UF than FSU :D If that's the case, I think UF may be a more sensible choice between the two. How does your fiance feel about the two schools? Would he be able to keep his job if you go to UF? What'd happen if you go to FSU? The debt difference isn't much, and I assume placements aren't much different between these two as well. So, whatever school works best for you, your situation, your fiance's work and your peace of mind should be the one.


gainesville and tallahassee are what 2 hours apart? I don't think a distance that miniscule isn't a reason to choose uf over fsu.

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GATORTIM
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby GATORTIM » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:24 pm

Barbie wrote:He is literally the biggest gator fan I've ever met that doesn't go to UF.


This is 95% of our fan base...I voted UF.

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Malcolm8X
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Malcolm8X » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:25 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Ur actually right. I doubt they get "a lot" but it's definitely more than FSU.

In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.


I agree. But I DO predict the market for lawyers will be better 3 years from now. Dunno why but I'm banking on it. Either way, relatively low debt at UF/UF is still THE major law school in Florida makes it a clear win. The Florida bar is really tough in order to preserve the market for grads from Florida schools.

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:25 pm

mistergoft wrote:
Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.

All of the big firms that came to UF this year at the very least extended some call backs, so I don't think they were necessarily courtesy interviews. Although, when GT is interviewing 33 people through OCI and only planning to hire 1, I guess you could say that the majority of the interviews were courtesy interviews.

yeah, I was being a bit hyperbolic. But I think the point (and let me know if you disagree with this) is that 93+% of the kids from UF are going to have to network and find jobs outside of school provided career services. Probably 95+% of kids from FSU are going to have to do the same thing. So UF holds and advantage, but it's not realistic for anyone coming in to expect to actually utilize that advantage.

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tea_drinker
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby tea_drinker » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:27 pm

Barbie wrote:He is literally the biggest gator fan I've ever met that doesn't go to UF. When we first moved in together, I had to HIDE his gator bedsheets, comforter, chair, blankets, posters, footballs, rugs, doormats, mugs (this list really goes on...) so that I could have a well decorated home. So, he is voting UF all the way haha-- hoping we can score some football tickets. At either place it looks like he will be getting a brand new job. He has a business degree and is hoping to score a gig at least managing a bar or restaurant but I have no idea how this will pan out. He knows the rugby folk at UF pretty well and I'm sure they would help him.


Since you are pretty determined to go to either school, I suggest your fiance starts looking for job now in both areas, and if he can secure a job before your deposit deadline, your choice is a bit easier. But given all facts that you said, welcome to the Gators Nation! :D

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:29 pm

Malcolm8X wrote:
Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Ur actually right. I doubt they get "a lot" but it's definitely more than FSU.

In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.


I agree. But I DO predict the market for lawyers will be better 3 years from now. Dunno why but I'm banking on it. Either way, relatively low debt at UF/UF is still THE major law school in Florida makes it a clear win. The Florida bar is really tough in order to preserve the market for grads from Florida schools.

It will get better. But it will never get a LOT better. Florida is already looking at a crippling over-saturation of law school graduates with no out of state portability who will flock to literally any job that opens up. It's an incredibly depressing scene (both me and goft are hunting in it right now.)
I think at this stage in the game, minimizing debt is going to be absolutely the key, because employment is a absurd uphill battle, and the smaller the debt waiting in the wings the better.

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ScrabbleChamp
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Re: What school would you choose? (New Poll: FSU or UF)

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:34 pm

He is literally the biggest gator fan I've ever met that doesn't go to UF. When we first moved in together, I had to HIDE his gator bedsheets, comforter, chair, blankets, posters, footballs, rugs, doormats, mugs (this list really goes on...) so that I could have a well decorated home. So, he is voting UF all the way haha-- hoping we can score some football tickets. At either place it looks like he will be getting a brand new job. He has a business degree and is hoping to score a gig at least managing a bar or restaurant but I have no idea how this will pan out. He knows the rugby folk at UF pretty well and I'm sure they would help him.


One thing to consider... because G-ville is really all about UF, he'll probably have a much easier (though, nothing is easy in FL right now) time finding a job in Tallahassee.

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Barbie
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Barbie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:35 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:yeah, I was being a bit hyperbolic. But I think the point (and let me know if you disagree with this) is that 93+% of the kids from UF are going to have to network and find jobs outside of school provided career services. Probably 95+% of kids from FSU are going to have to do the same thing. So UF holds and advantage, but it's not realistic for anyone coming in to expect to actually utilize that advantage.


This is essentially the reason I'm leaning towards FSU/UF over Illinois. I have networked, and will continue to. I've worked at law firms, my dad owns a business that works in close knit with a lot of lawyers, I have a handful of family members that work in law in Atlanta (south east, at least), and I have a lot of good friends who would be willing to help me as well (who have lawyer dads, etc). I just know a lot of people who I know would be willing to help me put a foot in the door somewhere, as with Illinois I know absolutely no one and will be alone.

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Malcolm8X
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Malcolm8X » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:36 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
Malcolm8X wrote:
Ur actually right. I doubt they get "a lot" but it's definitely more than FSU.

In the boom times, UF's OCI was looking better than FSU. Even then, you had to be top 15% to have a realistic chance at OCI placement (they were reporting right around 10% of the class at the NLJ). That was in the boom times. ITE it's realistic for anyone coming into FSU/UF to find jobs almost exclusively through networking, and that renders the power of job opportunity of either school negligible when pitted against each other.
Yes, it's great that big firms come to UF that don't come to FSU, it's also irrelevant when they don't hire anyone because that kid from UVA who grew up in Tampa struck out in DC and decided to take one of the two SA positions for that firm, leaving them with the job of holding courtesy interviews for UF law review kids.


I agree. But I DO predict the market for lawyers will be better 3 years from now. Dunno why but I'm banking on it. Either way, relatively low debt at UF/UF is still THE major law school in Florida makes it a clear win. The Florida bar is really tough in order to preserve the market for grads from Florida schools.

It will get better. But it will never get a LOT better. Florida is already looking at a crippling over-saturation of law school graduates with no out of state portability who will flock to literally any job that opens up. It's an incredibly depressing scene (both me and goft are hunting in it right now.)
I think at this stage in the game, minimizing debt is going to be absolutely the key, because employment is a absurd uphill battle, and the smaller the debt waiting in the wings the better.


Wow.. This does not bode well. Either way, your debt load I'm sure is NOT that heavy. $90K debt is manageable even with a $50K a year job. You have hindsight to share with us though. Would you do it again or choose a T25 or higher at a higher tuition near sticker?

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Barbie
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Re: What school would you choose?

Postby Barbie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:38 pm

Malcolm8X wrote:Wow.. This does not bode well. Either way, your debt load I'm sure is NOT that heavy. $90K debt is manageable even with a $50K a year job. You have hindsight to share with us though. Would you do it again or choose a T25 or higher at a higher tuition near sticker?


Curious ab this too.
My debt is only going to be my tuition (assuming hubby finds ANY job) so I'm looking at @ 30k for FSU or @ 50k for UF. Debt in general scares me because a few years after law school I'm going to want to take a few years off (I think...) and start a family. Bah... idk..




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