Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

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Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Fordham (going to negotiate, but assume no $)
30
34%
Cardozo (23k/year, top 85% requirement)
33
38%
Brooklyn (don't know yet, but assume 20-40k/year)
8
9%
St. Johns (full scholarship, top 40% requirement)
16
18%
 
Total votes: 87

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Stringer6
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Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:01 pm

Thanks for any responses.

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northwood
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby northwood » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:07 pm

I like the Cardozo scholarship since its easier to keep. However, living in NYC will cost a lot of money, so you will have to decide for yourself. If you get a scholarship with stipuations, try to see what it would cost for all 3 years if you lose the scholarship. IF you need to keep that scholarship to make going there justified in your mind, then I would choose another school.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby BarbellDreams » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:36 pm

How much would Dozo cost you total over the 3 years?

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2011L1
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby 2011L1 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:43 pm

good ? op, but I think it's a 2 man race between Fordham and Dozo. I'm dealing with a similar issue also, but I'm waiting on a purple envelope to decide for me

BeachandRun23
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby BeachandRun23 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:36 pm

I'd say this is def a two man race between fordham and dozo. Dozo's scholly is easy to keep which is good.

What type of law do you want to go into?

ClayDavis
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby ClayDavis » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:41 pm

OP, do not listen to people saying this is a "2-man race" between Fordham and Cardozo. If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job. Go wherever you can get the most guaranteed - or as close to guaranteed as possible -scholarship money.

BeachandRun23
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby BeachandRun23 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:43 pm

ClayDavis wrote:OP, do not listen to people saying this is a "2-man race" between Fordham and Cardozo. If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job. Go wherever you can get the most guaranteed - or as close to guaranteed as possible -scholarship money.


This is true. But If the OP wants biglaw, that is pretty much not happening from dozo unless he/she is in the top 5-10%.

From fordham, he/she might be able to get biglaw in the top 20% or so.

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2011L1
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby 2011L1 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:45 pm

ClayDavis wrote:OP, do not listen to people saying this is a "2-man race" between Fordham and Cardozo. If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job. Go wherever you can get the most guaranteed - or as close to guaranteed as possible -scholarship money.


I dont hate your response but please explain further. where do you go? and would you choose st. johns full ride over dozo partial?

ClayDavis
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby ClayDavis » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:49 pm

2011L1 wrote:
ClayDavis wrote:OP, do not listen to people saying this is a "2-man race" between Fordham and Cardozo. If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job. Go wherever you can get the most guaranteed - or as close to guaranteed as possible -scholarship money.


I dont hate your response but please explain further. where do you go? and would you choose st. johns full ride over dozo partial?

I don't go to LS and probably will not anytime in the near future, and I say that as someone who just got into one of CCN at sticker and one of MVP w/ a $30k/year scholarship. The market is dead. I know tons of bright kids with good grades at better schools than Fordham who have nothing lined up. Taking on a quarter of a million dollars in debt for a lottery ticket with a 1/20 chance of winning is a terrible idea.

binghamtonalum
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby binghamtonalum » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:57 pm

I'm in the same boat as you are (minus the Fordham acceptance), but even if I had been, at sticker, it's foolish considering the market we're in. At a certain point, all those warnings have to hit home. I will be deciding between St. John's and Dozo

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:28 pm

I don't go to LS and probably will not anytime in the near future, and I say that as someone who just got into one of CCN at sticker and one of MVP w/ a $30k/year scholarship. The market is dead. I know tons of bright kids with good grades at better schools than Fordham who have nothing lined up. Taking on a quarter of a million dollars in debt for a lottery ticket with a 1/20 chance of winning is a terrible idea.

If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job.


thanks for the advice. hadn't heard anything like this before. i'm not gonna go to law school anymore.

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Zarathustraspoke
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Zarathustraspoke » Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:38 pm

Stringer6 wrote:
I don't go to LS and probably will not anytime in the near future, and I say that as someone who just got into one of CCN at sticker and one of MVP w/ a $30k/year scholarship. The market is dead. I know tons of bright kids with good grades at better schools than Fordham who have nothing lined up. Taking on a quarter of a million dollars in debt for a lottery ticket with a 1/20 chance of winning is a terrible idea.

If you're not getting any $ from Fordham, don't go there. It'll leave you $200k+ in debt without a job.


thanks for the advice. hadn't heard anything like this before. i'm not gonna go to law school anymore.


I always seem to wander too far into a thread to get me utterly depressed
Last edited by Zarathustraspoke on Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby bk1 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:46 pm

I'd negotiate with St. John's to get your scholarship stipulations removed and go there.

IsleMet
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby IsleMet » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:04 pm

I'm in at Fordham with 0 and Dozo with a full ride, so I'm in a similar situation. If I can't get anything at Fordham, I would have to go with Dozo...200k is too scary to face given the current economic climate (think about paying off law school loans for the next 15-20 years of your life if you don't land a big law job).

Though, I'm also in at BC...so it'll depend on what kind of money I see from them. And on a waitlist at Gtown and Cornell, so I have a lot to consider still.

Snape
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Snape » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:12 pm

None of the options look good....either way too much debt or three years of school for a non-salaried crappy legal job....if you have close family connections in the legal world with a guaranteed job once you pass the bar, then choose the cheapest, otherwise, do something else next year and think about a new career path.

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BrownBears09
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby BrownBears09 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:18 pm

Snape wrote:None of the options look good....either way too much debt or three years of school for a non-salaried crappy legal job....if you have close family connections in the legal world with a guaranteed job once you pass the bar, then choose the cheapest, otherwise, do something else next year and think about a new career path.


Why all the 0L job banter? What happened? You were so cheerful in your first few posts.

Snape
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Snape » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:24 pm

Huh? Im just being realistic. Its unfair for all of these schools to put these people into debt when their chances of a good paying job are slim. Fordham is so overshadowed by other students in New York I cant beleive anyone would ever pay more than half tuition. Think about it, people at Michigan, Penn, Duke, UVA, Cornell, Georetown, Vandy, WUSTL, Notre Dame, BU and BS, and elsewhere are still looking for jobs---the average person from Fordham waits behind all of those schools---not even mentioning the guaratneed schools already taking all the jobs like NYC, Columbia, harvard, Yale, Stanford....anything from Fordham is a long shot at best....the other schools are a pipe dream.

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:33 pm

Huh? Im just being realistic. Its unfair for all of these schools to put these people into debt when their chances of a good paying job are slim. Fordham is so overshadowed by other students in New York I cant beleive anyone would ever pay more than half tuition. Think about it, people at Michigan, Penn, Duke, UVA, Cornell, Georetown, Vandy, WUSTL, Notre Dame, BU and BS, and elsewhere are still looking for jobs---the average person from Fordham waits behind all of those schools---not even mentioning the guaratneed schools already taking all the jobs like NYC, Columbia, harvard, Yale, Stanford....anything from Fordham is a long shot at best....the other schools are a pipe dream.


i didn't know WUSTL, notre dame, BU, and BC placed better in NYC than fordham.

i'm glad someone that knows a lot about this told me.

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bk1
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby bk1 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:38 pm

Stringer6 wrote:i didn't know WUSTL, notre dame, BU, and BC placed better in NYC than fordham.

i'm glad someone that knows a lot about this told me.

Maybe BU/BC, but lol @ WUSTL/ND.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby BarbellDreams » Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:52 pm

bk1 wrote:
Stringer6 wrote:i didn't know WUSTL, notre dame, BU, and BC placed better in NYC than fordham.

i'm glad someone that knows a lot about this told me.

Maybe BU/BC, but lol @ WUSTL/ND.


+1.

Lol @ WUSTL or ND taking NY jobs away from Fordham kids. Assuming same credentials this isn't close.

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OperaSoprano
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby OperaSoprano » Mon Jan 24, 2011 10:45 pm

BarbellDreams wrote:
bk1 wrote:
Stringer6 wrote:i didn't know WUSTL, notre dame, BU, and BC placed better in NYC than fordham.

i'm glad someone that knows a lot about this told me.

Maybe BU/BC, but lol @ WUSTL/ND.


+1.

Lol @ WUSTL or ND taking NY jobs away from Fordham kids. Assuming same credentials this isn't close.


They don't. We place next behind the T14 (possible argument for Vandy) in NYC biglaw hiring. It's far from a guarantee, but for someone from a solid undergraduate school with some work experience and good grades (this varies-- I've seen people in the top third get it this year if they had something good to offer, otherwise they would have needed to be slightly higher for a V100 job ITE. Everything I've seen from my class year is anecdotal, since there are no official numbers out yet.)

Should you come to any of these schools if you are dead set on biglaw? No. Fordham will offer you by far the best chance, but I recommend the school for people who are more open in the kind of law they want to practice. You have to go in knowing all the facts. Will you get a job? The odds are most definitely in your favor. One of the school's strengths is its insanely large and very concentrated alumni network. There are Fordham grads in every NYC law firm and organization-- count on it. (In fact, the school would like us to unconcentrate some, but nobody's leaving. Go figure.)

I personally feel that scholarship stipulations are a terrible deal for students, since the schools get to benefit from your numbers, and they can leave you high and dry after a year, once you've sacrificed your chance to go to a better school. If you are even considering taking money, ask to get them removed as a matter of principle and as a safeguard (though I am very hopeful you won't fall outside the top 85% of your class-- this stip is at least not ridiculous. I have seen top 30% requirements.)

I am very happy with my school and feel it was worth the money. Because of IBR, I'll be able to manage the debt I took on to attend. This is something you should look into if you are considering it, and absolutely explain your situation to the school. I would also talk to current students and graduates of all the schools, if possible, in order to get as full a picture as possible of the current employment situation.

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:34 pm

I was just kidding. I know Fordham places better in NYC than those schools.

binghamtonalum
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby binghamtonalum » Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:32 pm

.

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2011L1
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby 2011L1 » Tue Jan 25, 2011 3:02 pm

why does it seem that Brooklyn's rep is slipping fast? I'm not even relating it to that diesel photo shoot

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham v. Cardozo v. Brooklyn v. St. Johns

Postby Stringer6 » Tue Jan 25, 2011 3:07 pm

why does it seem that Brooklyn's rep is slipping fast?


it's not. it's probably the same as it always was. people on this board don't like it.




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