William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

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TyrodTaylor
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William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby TyrodTaylor » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:22 pm

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Last edited by TyrodTaylor on Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby bk1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:28 pm

If you can get the stips removed from your full ride to UR, I don't see this as being that bad of an idea. Free school is a wonderful thing.

ran12
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby ran12 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:29 pm

TyrodTaylor wrote:So I had never dreamed of becoming a big time lawyer or anything, I studied PT's for 4 months and got a 167, which I am very happy with. I was Pting 163 and have a gpa of 3.13 from va tech, so I was thinking UR would be a great option. Now with my 167, I am getting a lot of advice that I should apply and go to William and mary, and that I will probs get money there. (I am from williamsburg originally, so free housing as well, coupled with in state tuition). PAying for school is a big deal for me, and I would potentially have the option of a free ride to UR. I intend to practice in Richmond in the long run and hopefully live there. What are yalls thoughts? Is it so much of a better school that my job prospects in the Richmond area will be much greater from WM? Advice welcome


Obviously Richmond firms will give UR grads a good shot at employment but I think you're better off going to WM. WM prob does pretty well in VA overall considering UVA students don't really stay in VA leaving WM as the best school in the state. Also, while you want to go to Richmond for work, WM will give you more opportunities in other cities in case you end up wanting to go to a bigger market.

SrLaw
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby SrLaw » Sun Jan 09, 2011 4:52 pm

I doubt you will get any merit $$$ from W&M. Your 3.13 will make sure of that. However, Richmond + huge scholarship is your best bet by a mile.

I have been to UR's campus and it is one of the best I have ever seen.

UR + $$$

/thread.

tarp
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby tarp » Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:12 pm

Richmond is a great law school, you will be very happy there. The city of Richmond, on the other hand, is a different story... you couldn't pay me to live there.

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vamedic03
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby vamedic03 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:40 am

I'm from Richmond, though I don't have any desire to go back there.

Apply to W&M and W&L. If you get any money from either of those, go there over UR. Richmond as a legal market cares about prestige just like other markets do. The job options coming out of W&M and W&L are far better than UR. That said, don't load up on tons of debt just to go to W&M or W&L.

Also, you should apply to UVa - yes, it's an outside shot, but you still have a shot (especially in-state).

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megaTTTron
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby megaTTTron » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:41 am

bk1 wrote:If you can get the stips removed from your full ride to UR, I don't see this as being that bad of an idea. Free school is a wonderful thing.


this.

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oscodasa
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby oscodasa » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:55 am

Absolutely UR. W&M just doesn't have the same presence in the Richmond legal market that UR has. Plus going to UR would enable you to begin making contacts immediately. If you are absolutely positive you want to work in Richmond and can get a better deal than W&M, you would be foolish not to take it.

tarp
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby tarp » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:46 pm

The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond

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LSATWIZ
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby LSATWIZ » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:59 pm

Also, you probably won't get $ from W&M so late in the cycle. I know people with a better LSAT score and 3.5's who only got 15k with October apps.

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AreJay711
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby AreJay711 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 1:06 pm

Remember that living at home will save you around 10K a year. I'd definitely apply to W&M (and probably choose it) since it is relatively inexpensive for in-state applicants and that UR scholarship might not be there after your first year.

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RVP11
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby RVP11 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:26 pm

ran12 wrote:WM prob does pretty well in VA overall considering UVA students don't really stay in VA leaving WM as the best school in the state.


You're kidding yourself if you don't think there are a tons of people at UVA who would LOVE to get a job in Richmond (or just a job).

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RVP11
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby RVP11 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:27 pm

tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.

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oscodasa
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby oscodasa » Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:49 pm

RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?

Aqualibrium
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby Aqualibrium » Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:54 pm

oscodasa wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?


I have a little bit of knowledge on the Richmond legal market. I'd reiterate RVP's statement. From what I understand, UR's OCI was an absolute bloodbath this past year. For the most part, only top 10% had a chance.

W&M is pretty cheap in state, and op wouldn't be hit hard by cost of living because of his situation. Sounds like the best deal to me. Also, op doesn't have a full ride offer in hand from Richmond yet. His stats may look good for one, but stranger things have happened. At this point, we're essentially making a comparison between Richmond at sticker and W&M at sticker.

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oscodasa
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby oscodasa » Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:35 pm

Aqualibrium wrote:
oscodasa wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?


I have a little bit of knowledge on the Richmond legal market. I'd reiterate RVP's statement. From what I understand, UR's OCI was an absolute bloodbath this past year. For the most part, only top 10% had a chance.

I'm not trying to say that UR grads are guaranteed employment. I have lived and worked in Richmond for nearly my entire life and the legal market's largest representation is from UR. It is highly regarded in the area and I don't believe W&M grads have any particular advantage over UR grads in Richmond.

W&M is pretty cheap in state, and op wouldn't be hit hard by cost of living because of his situation. Sounds like the best deal to me. Also, op doesn't have a full ride offer in hand from Richmond yet. His stats may look good for one, but stranger things have happened. At this point, we're essentially making a comparison between Richmond at sticker and W&M at sticker.

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RVP11
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby RVP11 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:30 pm

oscodasa wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?


Why is intimate knowledge needed for that?

Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the Dallas legal market to know that UT > SMU in Dallas? Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the San Diego legal market to know that UCLA > USD in San Diego?

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bergg007
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby bergg007 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:50 pm

RVP11 wrote:
oscodasa wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?


Why is intimate knowledge needed for that?

Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the Dallas legal market to know that UT > SMU in Dallas? Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the San Diego legal market to know that UCLA > USD in San Diego?


Yes, you do. I've talked to lawyers in Dallas who have told me that they hire more people from SMU year to year than UT grads. They hire them because they can pay them less and they are less of a flight risk. Lawyers i talked to in indianapolis said that if I intended to work in indy then i had no business going to Indiana Bloomington over Indiana indianapolis, even though bloomington is like 50 places higher. Tons of firms have strong ties to the colleges that are supposedly not as good as the higher ranked firms. the best thing for OP to do is talk to a bunch of lawyer in richmond and then compare the schools that way. U.S. News isn't worshiped in the real world the way it is on TLS.

Ask hiring partners then decide.

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oscodasa
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby oscodasa » Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:00 pm

RVP11 wrote:
oscodasa wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
tarp wrote:The last poster is correct. Richmond Law is the place to be if you are sure you want to work in Richmond


That's TERRIBLE advice. W&M is the second best school in the state and will arguably cost less (when/if OP loses his full scholarship from UR). If you think Richmond firms are hiring deeper from UR than from W&M then I have a bridge to sell you.


I assume then that you have some intimate knowledge of the Richmond legal market to back this up?


Why is intimate knowledge needed for that?

Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the Dallas legal market to know that UT > SMU in Dallas? Do you need "intimate knowledge" of the San Diego legal market to know that UCLA > USD in San Diego?


I was asking as someone with immediate knowledge to the contrary and wanted to know why the OP thought otherwise.

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AreJay711
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby AreJay711 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:24 pm

W&M isn't the same as UT but rather a well respected second best. While the degree isn't as limited as one from UR, I'm sure most VA firms don't look at W&M as a significant flight risk. I agree about asking hiring partners though -- I was told by a few in Baltimore that they would be really skeptical about me going to Michigan rather than a local school but W&M IS a local school for Virgina firms.

Image

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RVP11
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby RVP11 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:20 pm

bergg007 wrote:Yes, you do. I've talked to lawyers in Dallas who have told me that they hire more people from SMU year to year than UT grads.


That says nothing about how deep into each class they're going to get people. They're going deeper into UT's class - who cares if they end up with more people from SMU?

bergg007 wrote:They hire them because they can pay them less and they are less of a flight risk.


A) How exactly are people who went to UT a "flight risk" in Dallas any more than people who went to SMU?

B) Big firms pay their first year associates the same salary, and they certainly aren't paying people from a given school less simply because they went to that school.

bergg007 wrote:U.S. News isn't worshiped in the real world the way it is on TLS.


What does USNWR have to do with this?

tarp
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby tarp » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:45 pm

I am from Virginia and I can pretty much say that UR and W&M are both good choices if you want to practice in Richmond, but the connections you will make and the fact that you are IN richmond at UR, can easily do externships and attend local bar events, and will likely have some local attorneys as your instructors, will give you an advantage. In the end, they are both good schools and you will get a J.D. so finding a job is your own responsibility.

Aqualibrium
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby Aqualibrium » Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:10 pm

I'm trying to figure out why there was a paragraph added to what I said...

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vamedic03
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby vamedic03 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:45 pm

tarp wrote:I am from Virginia and I can pretty much say that UR and W&M are both good choices if you want to practice in Richmond, but the connections you will make and the fact that you are IN richmond at UR, can easily do externships and attend local bar events, and will likely have some local attorneys as your instructors, will give you an advantage. In the end, they are both good schools and you will get a J.D. so finding a job is your own responsibility.


This is sorta BS reasoning. Yes, UR is in Richmond; however, W&M is only 40 minutes away. W&M is a far better school, has a cheaper sticker price, and provides far better exit options both in Virginia and the Mid-Atlantic.

Concept
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Re: William and Mary vs. URichmond, hear me out

Postby Concept » Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:51 pm

vamedic03 wrote:
tarp wrote:I am from Virginia and I can pretty much say that UR and W&M are both good choices if you want to practice in Richmond, but the connections you will make and the fact that you are IN richmond at UR, can easily do externships and attend local bar events, and will likely have some local attorneys as your instructors, will give you an advantage. In the end, they are both good schools and you will get a J.D. so finding a job is your own responsibility.


This is sorta BS reasoning. Yes, UR is in Richmond; however, W&M is only 40 minutes away. W&M is a far better school, has a cheaper sticker price, and provides far better exit options both in Virginia and the Mid-Atlantic.


/thread




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