OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

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Lawst
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby Lawst » Wed Apr 06, 2011 8:24 pm

ahduth wrote:
sbalive wrote:
ahduth wrote:
introversional wrote:Defintely trolling, b/c I think you're already decided on UCLA. Although you'll probably be annoyed at all the phoneys on the west coast as well.


No, I've roughly decided on NYU - 25k isn't a massive scholarship, but it's a T6 and it seems to fit with what I'm looking for.

sbalive wrote:Nice troll -- but, seriously, as a Columbia student, I'd be thrilled if you didn't come. Enjoy making $30K doing personal injury work in Fontana 8)


I hope you actually belong in this thread. You're 30+ and at Columbia? I'd like to hear your perspective. I did not get a good feel out of the ASW.

WTF is Fontana?


Are you from LA? I just randomly picked one of the many crappy towns in the IE.

Anyway, yeah, I belong in this thread. I've had a great time at Columbia, both academically and socially. I haven't found it stuffy -- there are some stuffy students, but there are like over 400 people. I choose not to focus on the negative of a group of people but rather embrace the positive, and I think that's worked out well for me. Also, I've made some very careful decisions in navigating law school -- choosing how I would study, how I would socialize, and what classes / activities I would take on so that I would be happy and fulfilled, without regard to what I thought might be expected or "the right thing to do." But, hey, if I'm going to have all the downsides of being "old," I may as well take advantage of my wisdom & experience 8)

All the options you've got on the table are great. I picked Columbia for three major reasons. First, it seemed like it would open more doors, especially outside New York City and just BigLaw since I didn't want to stay here after graduation & I don't want to live out my life at a BigLaw firm -- and so far, so good. Second, I didn't want the pressure to be at or near the top of my class that I feel I'd have if I went to a lower-ranked school. Third, I'm living in New York but with relatively affordable housing in a neighborhood that is great for running & generally being outdoors -- while still being able to take a subway and quickly get to the city proper... PM if you have other questions.


Cool, sorry about all the rage before, I shouldn't be allowed to post after drinking martinis.

For me, I have a similar concern about not rotting in Big Law forever. So that cuts both ways - on the one hand, CLS and NYU give me a great shot at finding more interesting positions, or at least ones that get me into a GC's office or something along those lines earlier. The profs I spoke with at NYU about my background definitely thought my experience was an asset, but that I would have to be selective about the firms I looked at. Firms that pulled work from a shared pool and didn't allow for very much partner contact would be poor fits for me, for example.

The flipside is that UCLA would have me graduating with only 75k in debt. I'm just concerned the opportunities wouldn't be there, because in the end I'm going to law school to do something both different and interesting, and I don't want to be debt-free but lacking for interesting career options. UCLA is a very good school, but it's still a notch below the T6.

The cultural thing at CLS was definitely a point for me. The admitted students seemed a lot younger (piles and piles of people graduating college in 2011), and if I remember correctly that impression is borne out by their class profile (relatively to NYU anyhow). The problem with it was that I didn't really talk with very many people who seemed like they had much fire to them. Interestingly one of the people with who I was most impressed was a non-trad 2L, who seemed to be weaving together his current studies with his prior background in a neat way.

At the end of the day, NYU over CLS is purely a fit thing for me. I just question if I should take the money from UCLA, because of my age. Everyone would rather be debt free sooner rather than later, but I feel a little bit of... urgency to it, I suppose.

edit: Oh I'm not from LA at all, I'm from Chicago. I applied to UCLA for the weather. :D


My choices are waaaay further down in the rankings than yours, but I'm going with the school that is offering me the better scholarship/tuition, because of my age and the fact that I want to go into public-interest law. I just can't justify paying full-tuition for a better school. I'll be 38 next month. I like the idea of leaving the door open to biglaw in case I have a change of heart in school, but are many firms looking to hire a 41-year-old first-year associate? Yeah, age discrimination, blah, blah, but in reality I think they'd want someone younger who is more malleable and can be made to work 80+ hours a week without raising those pesky quality-of-life issues that we think more about as we're older, no?

ETA: I really like the school that is a better deal, btw. There were some others that offered me good scholarships or had low tuition, but I cut them because I didn't like them for various reasons. So it's not JUST cost, but the least expensive of the schools that I actually liked.

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Non-Chalant1
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby Non-Chalant1 » Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:57 pm

ahduth wrote:Alright, I'm just here to troll it up.

I got back from the CLS/NYU admitted student things. How can CLS students be more boring than me already? Sweater vest city, and I've dealt with a lot of boring people in my life. It was aggravating. You can shove the Columbia "name" up your ass.

Am I not approaching this seriously enough? My feeling is that if law firms kick me due to age during EIW/OCI/whatever, I didn't want to end up there anyhow. I know piles of accounting and am not interested in doing copying for two years after school.

I am bona fide unattached, and I'm basically looking at a 100k bump in free money at UCLA over NYU. But it seems insane to turn down a top 5 school. 100k is just money. I can't figure out how to quantify the NYU opportunities but... it sounds hot.

Should I be lettting UCLA pay my ride, or go to NYU?

Disclaimer: I'm not old enough for this thread and I would be one of those 2011s you seem to hate. I bet they're more interesting than you think, but I wouldn't be trying to hard to impress people I just met...that seems more phoney. I'd rather show people what I'm about than talk about it and that goes for most people in know in 2011 going to T6s. With that said, this showed up while I was doing a search on Columbia housing and I felt that I'd just say a couple things. I know people much older than me (granted they're about to graduate) at CLS and they're much more interesting than I am lol. But if you're making a CLS/NYU comparison and NYU seemed more fun or lively or whatever...that's what they told me as well...and then they started law school and they didn't feel the student bodies were all that different. From one of them that I know who turned that HLS for CLS (strictly for money/family purposes and wanting to stay/live in NYC)...they felt HLS and CLS gave sort of the same kind of deal. They tried to sell you on the opportunities and prestige and perhaps not the character of the school/people. For what it's worth I'm in the CLS facebook group right now and people seem pretty passionate/not stuffy. Just thought I'd make my sales pitch to a potential classmate. You can all kick me out of this thread now....gotta keep searching these forums for Columbia housing inside info anyhow.

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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby crysmissmichelle » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:54 am

Hello guys, I've been in and out of this thread for a few months now, but haven't really posted. I'm not looking at schools as high in the rankings as most of you, but I have modest goals and a school I really like.

I've been offered a $20,000 scholarship to Richmond, whose tuition is $35,000. I was a runner-up for an extra $10,000 prize, but my GPA was just a little low and I did not get it.

I am 30 y/o with a two year old daughter and am feeling really crappy about the prospect of leaving my job that provides her health care insurance and my family living on loans for three years which would have to include pricey COBRA insurance for the family because my husband does not have the option of benefits at his job and will not in the next three years.

I already have student loans and it appears my grand total after graduation with everything included would be around $103,000 in debt. It makes me cringe just to write it.

I'm sorry for the long note, but I really want to go, and feel horribly irresponsible at the moment.

What do you guys think?

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introversional
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby introversional » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:57 am

crysmissmichelle wrote:Hello guys, I've been in and out of this thread for a few months now, but haven't really posted. I'm not looking at schools as high in the rankings as most of you, but I have modest goals and a school I really like.

I've been offered a $20,000 scholarship to Richmond, whose tuition is $35,000. I was a runner-up for an extra $10,000 prize, but my GPA was just a little low and I did not get it.

I am 30 y/o with a two year old daughter and am feeling really crappy about the prospect of leaving my job that provides her health care insurance and my family living on loans for three years which would have to include pricey COBRA insurance for the family because my husband does not have the option of benefits at his job and will not in the next three years.

I already have student loans and it appears my grand total after graduation with everything included would be around $103,000 in debt. It makes me cringe just to write it.

I'm sorry for the long note, but I really want to go, and feel horribly irresponsible at the moment.

What do you guys think?


Loan Balance: $103,000.00
Adjusted Loan Balance: $103,000.00
Loan Interest Rate: 6.80%
Loan Fees: 0.00%
Loan Term: 30 years
Minimum Payment: $0.00
Total Years in College: 3 years
Average Debt per Year: $34,333.33


Monthly Loan Payment: $671.48
Number of Payments: 361

$671.48/month isn't that bad, imo.

plugkev
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby plugkev » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:03 am

That's funny, I did pretty much the same calculation this week and my thought was...

'holy crap $650 a month is a lot'

atmo

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introversional
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby introversional » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:07 am

plugkev wrote:That's funny, I did pretty much the same calculation this week and my thought was...

'holy crap $650 a month is a lot'

atmo


I guess it's all relative, but I'm considering it from a "benefit over a lifetime" approach, in which case $650 or so a month isn't that much.

$650 x 12 = only $7,800 per year.

Do you think you'd make $7,800 more per year after law school vs. not going?

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Leira7905
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby Leira7905 » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:20 am

introversional wrote:
plugkev wrote:That's funny, I did pretty much the same calculation this week and my thought was...

'holy crap $650 a month is a lot'

atmo


I guess it's all relative, but I'm considering it from a "benefit over a lifetime" approach, in which case $650 or so a month isn't that much.

$650 x 12 = only $7,800 per year.

Do you think you'd make $7,800 more per year after law school vs. not going?


I certainly hope so, or WTH are we all thinking!

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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby plugkev » Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:08 am

Good point, that makes it seem more reasonable.

Right now we have two incomes though and I am hoping to be the lone breadwinner in the future so we would drop an entire salary and add loan payments.

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crysmissmichelle
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby crysmissmichelle » Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:46 am

That makes especially good sense since I am currently a middle school teacher. Contrary to what I heard on the news the other day, the money is just not that good :/

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masochist
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby masochist » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:08 pm

Also remember that your total income would have to be $72,248.40 or greater in order for you to qualify for the full 671.48 monthly payment under IBR.

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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby sarahh » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:14 pm

crysmissmichelle wrote:Hello guys, I've been in and out of this thread for a few months now, but haven't really posted. I'm not looking at schools as high in the rankings as most of you, but I have modest goals and a school I really like.

I've been offered a $20,000 scholarship to Richmond, whose tuition is $35,000. I was a runner-up for an extra $10,000 prize, but my GPA was just a little low and I did not get it.

I am 30 y/o with a two year old daughter and am feeling really crappy about the prospect of leaving my job that provides her health care insurance and my family living on loans for three years which would have to include pricey COBRA insurance for the family because my husband does not have the option of benefits at his job and will not in the next three years.

I already have student loans and it appears my grand total after graduation with everything included would be around $103,000 in debt. It makes me cringe just to write it.

I'm sorry for the long note, but I really want to go, and feel horribly irresponsible at the moment.

What do you guys think?


Your school does not offer health insurance? Have you seen how much it would cost to purchase it on your own? When I was paying for my health insurance, I was paying much less than my company pays for me now.

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crysmissmichelle
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby crysmissmichelle » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:30 pm

sarahh wrote:
Your school does not offer health insurance? Have you seen how much it would cost to purchase it on your own? When I was paying for my health insurance, I was paying much less than my company pays for me now.


The school offers health insurance, but I do have a condition that requires frequent check-ups/lab work (that it won't really cover) and once you add the family it becomes extremely expensive. For some reason insurance on your own seems really, really expensive in my state. I'm doing more research, but it is really eye-opening.

firemed
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby firemed » Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:22 pm

crysmissmichelle wrote:
sarahh wrote:
Your school does not offer health insurance? Have you seen how much it would cost to purchase it on your own? When I was paying for my health insurance, I was paying much less than my company pays for me now.


The school offers health insurance, but I do have a condition that requires frequent check-ups/lab work (that it won't really cover) and once you add the family it becomes extremely expensive. For some reason insurance on your own seems really, really expensive in my state. I'm doing more research, but it is really eye-opening.


Medicaid? or CHIP or whatever they call it where they cover your kid's insurance? These may well be options. Look into them too.

And try not to worry too much about the debt.

ArghItsBlarg
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby ArghItsBlarg » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:43 pm

For my family of four in Illinois, Cobra will be roughly equivalent in price to both school insurance and ICHIP, that being $1,000-$1,300 per month. It's insane. If I can get private insurance at the rates I'm seeing online, I can "only" pay somewhere between $500-600 per month. Medicaid may or may not be in our future.

ArghItsBlarg
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby ArghItsBlarg » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:53 am

An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:

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homestyle28
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby homestyle28 » Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:07 am

ArghItsBlarg wrote:An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:


Woot! What did you think this weekend?

ArghItsBlarg
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby ArghItsBlarg » Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:58 am

Loved it. I was only there Saturday, but between what I saw of the students, the mock class, and the passion evinced by the staff, I think the next few years are going to be awesome.

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nygrrrl
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby nygrrrl » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:27 pm

ArghItsBlarg wrote:An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:

Holy cow! ARGH! Congratulations, man!!!
I have many friends at Northwestern (who LOVE it) and it would have been my first choice, if I'd been able to reach for FT programs.
Yipppeeeee!!!!

firemed
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby firemed » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:07 pm

ArghItsBlarg wrote:An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:



YAY!!!! CONGRATS!!!!!

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introversional
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby introversional » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:08 pm

ArghItsBlarg wrote:An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:


Good call - and congrats!

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Lawst
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby Lawst » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:35 pm

ArghItsBlarg wrote:An update - I'm going to Northwestern. Made my seat deposit and have withdrawn from my other schools. I start 5 weeks from today. :shock:


Congrats! I've been mostly a lurker in this thread, but I really related to your rant. Glad to see you going for it.

mdwannabejd
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby mdwannabejd » Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:04 pm

nygrrl and firemed suggested that I check out this thread and I am so glad that they did. I enjoy the younger folks' threads but it is also nice to see folks talking about things like renting out houses, finding places to live that are family friendly, schools and the whole concept of should I leave my current career and really do this. I am a 41 y.o. surgeon in TX that wants to study and practice law.....perhaps in a field that will utilize my medical training and experience or perhaps not. I took the LSAT 20 years ago in College and will be taking again this June with an eye towards possibly applying in the fall. So glad to have found this thread

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nygrrrl
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby nygrrrl » Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:24 pm

mdwannabejd wrote:nygrrl and firemed suggested that I check out this thread and I am so glad that they did. I enjoy the younger folks' threads but it is also nice to see folks talking about things like renting out houses, finding places to live that are family friendly, schools and the whole concept of should I leave my current career and really do this. I am a 41 y.o. surgeon in TX that wants to study and practice law.....perhaps in a field that will utilize my medical training and experience or perhaps not. I took the LSAT 20 years ago in College and will be taking again this June with an eye towards possibly applying in the fall. So glad to have found this thread

:lol: Hooray! You made it! Welcome!

mdwannabejd
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby mdwannabejd » Sun Apr 17, 2011 11:59 pm

So nice to be able to participate in the 30 and over thread. Check out what the youngsters are placing on my thread about my chances of applying as a 41 year old surgeon. Nice!


I want to echo (politely) Dr. Dolittle's initial skepticism at seeing someone in your position expressing such a late interest in the law. Although it would be pretty sick to have the trifecta of professional degrees, what is it you want to do with a JD? You said in your original post that you want to pursue your passion of "studying the law," but what then? If you get your shit together, apply this fall, take the October LSAT (you're too late for June), you'll be 45 when you graduate.

There is no possibility of you working in biglaw as a first-year associate at 45 (and frankly you wouldn't want to at your age). Do you know any lawyers working at medical malpractice firms? Do you want to go into academia? I'm just having a hard time thinking of what a JD would allow someone in your position to do that you couldn't with an MD and an MBA.

pkt63
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Re: OLD SCHOOL (must be 30 and over ITT)

Postby pkt63 » Mon Apr 18, 2011 12:38 am

Well, I haven't read your thread, so I don't know all the context, but that is a bummer to hear from people. I think sometimes people just love to tell other people, "Whoa, that is a *bad* idea and let me tell you why." Not that these people were doing it for sure, but I do think internet forums are more common for this type of behavior. I know people doing this realy believe they are just sharing important information with you. But, at forums with so many people like this one, it seems like there will always be at least one person that thinks any individual idea is a *bad* idea, and wants to tell you why. It becomes a big downer when every issue you want to explore gets shot down.

I will say, however (and yes, right after my hyperbolic statement about it seeming like every single idea gets shot down), I had a really good conversation in a thread I started about long distance relationships. To be very fair to the good posters here, not a single person came in and told me all about how my marriage is imminently going to be ruined.

TL;DR version: glad you are taking other posters' posts with a grain of salt. It'll keep you sane.




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