Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

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willyj
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Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby willyj » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:21 am

I've got borderline numbers for t14 schools (167, 3.9 w/ strong softs), so I plan to apply to several of the t14, basically Berkeley and below, but, of course, there's the chance that I don't get into any of them, but I feel like I should get into a few of the t20, and U of Texas looks interesting. My question is, is the Texas brand strong enough to leave Texas/southwestern US? I'd really like to go to DC or somewhere back east to live. Any opinions on UT in general would be appreciated.

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merichard87
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby merichard87 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:23 am

Probably depends on where you are in the class.

But if it was me I would target Georgetown, Duke or Virginia before I plan to take a Texas degree to D.C.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby vanwinkle » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:26 am

You could ED to one of the lower T14 (UVA or GULC might be good options) with that really strong GPA. You'd at least have a chance of getting admitted.

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:27 am

Vanderbilt is a possibility; so is Texas.

DC is tough to break into anyways, even from top school. Retake?

willyj
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby willyj » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:34 am

rad law wrote:Vanderbilt is a possibility; so is Texas.

DC is tough to break into anyways, even from top school. Retake?


Not without a fight.

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kalvano
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby kalvano » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:27 am

Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:38 am

kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


Probably.

A not insignificant number of grads got jobs there in 2009. I don't recall exactly how many, and I can't look it up because I'm at work. But the data is available on observationalist's Law School Transparency site I think.

willyj
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby willyj » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:39 am

kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:43 am

willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Explain exactly where you want to live.

Pearalegal
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Pearalegal » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:44 am

willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Then Texas is not the correct choice here. I'm a member of UT's class of 2013 with a goal of getting back to DC after graduation, but you need to be realistic. Plenty of UT grads place in DC, and there are a few very elite DC firms that do OCI at Texas over a bunch of T14s (ok, all I can really think of is W&C). BUT, you'd have to rank very strongly in your class and so on (though thats really true in any school at this point) to get such prospects. Almost all big DC firms are part of Texas' OCI, so its not like you have no shot.

I'm going into it with the mentality of working hard to get back here, but also made sure I wouldn't be devestated if I end up in Texas for a few years. If you hate Texas, don't go to school in Texas.

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kalvano
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby kalvano » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:44 am

willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.



No, it matters. Definitely try and go Vanderbilt over UT.

berkeleykel06
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby berkeleykel06 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:45 am

willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


This is exactly the point in the rankings when it begins to matter. If you want the east and you don't want Texas, Vanderbilt makes more sense for you. Plus Vanderbilt is more likely to give you a substantial scholarship than UT, judging by lawschoolnumbers.

Pearalegal
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Pearalegal » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:48 am

willyj wrote:At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


And again, a few places in the rankings really doesn't matter, its about where they place. Vandy places better in DC, not because its a better school or whatever, but because it places better in DC. End of story.

Still, you're talking about one of the roughest markets to break into. You're going to have to be a rockstar at either UT or Vandy to get the sort of position you'd be looking at in DC.

willyj
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby willyj » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:50 am

rad law wrote:
willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Explain exactly where you want to live.


Atlanta, Charlotte, DC, Baltimore, New York, Philly, Boston; basically, the stronger east coast markets

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vanwinkle
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby vanwinkle » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:52 am

If you don't want to live in Texas, and don't want to live in Atlanta, and know what a longshot DC would be from Texas, don't go to UT.

You should really be EDing to a lower T14 school of your choice (again, UVA or GULC seem like good targets for you; maybe also Penn).

Pearalegal
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Pearalegal » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:55 am

willyj wrote:
rad law wrote:
willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Explain exactly where you want to live.


Atlanta, Charlotte, DC, Baltimore, New York, Philly, Boston; basically, the stronger east coast markets


I'd say throw out the idea of likely paying more at UT or Vandy and go to school on the east coast. You'll get a ton of money at slightly lower-ranked schools and have a good shot at a T14 ED, with a better shot of being on the east coast. If you end up at a lower ranked school will pretty much only place on the east coast, as opposed to Vandy and UT, but you'll probably be better off in the long run.

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:58 am

willyj wrote:
rad law wrote:
willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Explain exactly where you want to live.


Atlanta, Charlotte, DC, Baltimore, New York, Philly, Boston; basically, the stronger east coast markets


I'd try for Vanderbilt. You might be able to get money. ATL and Charlotte are probably in play, as well as NYC. A plurality of Vanderbilt grads took the NY bar last year actually. DC will be tough. Philly, Boston, and Baltimore I'm not sure, but your regional preferences have such a wide variance that no school you can get into will open up the doors in all the places you want.

kmap
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby kmap » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:01 pm

willyj wrote:
rad law wrote:
willyj wrote:
kalvano wrote:Wouldn't Vanderbilt be better for DC?


At that point in the rankings, I don't think it would matter, right? I'm not totally fixed on DC, I just don't really want to live in Texas; any of the markets back east, DC of course being ideal, would be fine. Rather stay away from Atlanta, but it'd be better than being in Texas for me.


Explain exactly where you want to live.


Atlanta, Charlotte, DC, Baltimore, New York, Philly, Boston; basically, the stronger east coast markets


Trust me, you don't want to live in Baltimore ... :|

But in all seriousness, don't trust these naysayers. An LSAT score one point lower than yours and a GPA 0.1 higher got me into multiple T14's, and I didn't have to ED anywhere. Blanket them and you'll probably be fine.

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:03 pm

kmap wrote:But in all seriousness, don't trust these naysayers. An LSAT score one point lower than yours and a GPA 0.1 higher got me into multiple T14's, and I didn't have to ED anywhere. Blanket them and you'll probably be fine.


168/4.0 is a lot different than a 167/3.9. When you start getting higher in the rankings, 1 LSAT point and .1 GPA can easily be the difference in different tiers. Not saying OP shouldn't apply, but your advice is misleading.

misterswick
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby misterswick » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:10 pm

rad law wrote:
kmap wrote:But in all seriousness, don't trust these naysayers. An LSAT score one point lower than yours and a GPA 0.1 higher got me into multiple T14's, and I didn't have to ED anywhere. Blanket them and you'll probably be fine.


168/4.0 is a lot different than a 167/3.9. When you start getting higher in the rankings, 1 LSAT point and .1 GPA can easily be the difference in different tiers. Not saying OP shouldn't apply, but your advice is misleading.


Wouldn't it be a 166/4.0?

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:12 pm

misterswick wrote:
rad law wrote:
kmap wrote:But in all seriousness, don't trust these naysayers. An LSAT score one point lower than yours and a GPA 0.1 higher got me into multiple T14's, and I didn't have to ED anywhere. Blanket them and you'll probably be fine.


168/4.0 is a lot different than a 167/3.9. When you start getting higher in the rankings, 1 LSAT point and .1 GPA can easily be the difference in different tiers. Not saying OP shouldn't apply, but your advice is misleading.


Wouldn't it be a 166/4.0?


My bad. Illustrates my point even better

167/3.9 - In at Vanderbilt
166/4.0 - WL at Vanderbilt

http://vanderbilt.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats

edit: again, the point is: apply to T14, but don't bank on getting in.

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Ty Webb
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Ty Webb » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:17 pm

rad law wrote:
misterswick wrote:
rad law wrote:
kmap wrote:But in all seriousness, don't trust these naysayers. An LSAT score one point lower than yours and a GPA 0.1 higher got me into multiple T14's, and I didn't have to ED anywhere. Blanket them and you'll probably be fine.


168/4.0 is a lot different than a 167/3.9. When you start getting higher in the rankings, 1 LSAT point and .1 GPA can easily be the difference in different tiers. Not saying OP shouldn't apply, but your advice is misleading.


Wouldn't it be a 166/4.0?


My bad. Illustrates my point even better

167/3.9 - In at Vanderbilt
166/4.0 - WL at Vanderbilt

http://vanderbilt.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats

edit: again, the point is: apply to T14, but don't bank on getting in.


You seem to have missed the point here. The guy was giving OP advice on the basis of his OWN LSAT being 1 point lower, while still getting into a T14.

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Grizz
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby Grizz » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:20 pm

Ty Webb wrote:You seem to have missed the point here. The guy was giving OP advice on the basis of his OWN LSAT being 1 point lower, while still getting into a T14.


I understood perfectly. Kmap had slightly different stats and made it in. I stand by my advice, which seems pretty reasonable.

rad law wrote:apply to T14, but don't bank on getting in.

paralegal
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby paralegal » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:37 pm

Hi, willyj.....you know what I'm going to say; right?......DUKE!!!!!!

Seriously, you should add Duke to your list. DC is a very competitive legal market to break into. It can become even more competitive to get into DC from a school such as Georgetown or even UVA when there is a regional tie to that area and as a result a lot more students head into one market and compete against one another for offers, especially ITE when fewer offers exist. There can be a definite advantage applying to DC firms from a smaller school with great placement into the DC market. I've seen the stats for Duke's Class of 2010 Post Graduation Employment, and they placed grads into all of the top biglaw firms in DC.... Plus Duke has a great program called "Duke in DC" with fantastic networking and connections into that market.

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stratocophic
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Re: Trying to prepare for t14 rejections; Texas anyone?

Postby stratocophic » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:40 pm

rad law wrote:
Ty Webb wrote:You seem to have missed the point here. The guy was giving OP advice on the basis of his OWN LSAT being 1 point lower, while still getting into a T14.


I understood perfectly. Kmap had slightly different stats and made it in. I stand by my advice, which seems pretty reasonable.

rad law wrote:apply to T14, but don't bank on getting in.
This. 167 is golden for WUSTL on down, but below median for Vandy and T14 schools. If you aren't above both medians, don't count on anything. ED to UVA early if you want T14. If that fails, ED to GTown. If you have less interest in T14, look at BC/BU/Fordham/GW.




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