Joining Military before LS

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jhare
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Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 1:39 pm

Well this passed year I was all excited about LS to the poin that I applied to several schools of all rankings. Then I did tons of research and realized that the T2 schools I got money from weren't good enough and the T14 schools I miraculously got into were too expensive.
Instead I decided to join the the Army as an Intelligence Analyst. The new GI bill will cover more than half of the costs of any law school (at the least) and I will also receive a couple thousand dollars a month from the military for living expenses.
My commitment to the army is 3 years so by the time I'm done with army and LS I'll be 28.

I'm posting this for those of you who may have gotten into great schools but have no way to pay for it. Although joining the military is a big commitment and I'll be 3 years older when I graduate LS, I think it's worth it to graduate with a quarter of the debt or less, and not to mention that the economy will definately be better by then (if historical trends continue).

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fenderjsm88
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby fenderjsm88 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 7:02 pm

What kind of qualifications did you need to become an intelligence analyst? Do they usually give safer, higher-up jobs to college grads that join the military, or are there so many college grads in the military these days that they just throw them to the front lines with everyone else? Not really considering joining the military, just wondering..

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 7:34 pm

Qualifications are very high to enter intelligence. You have to have a very good ASVAB score and be able to obtain a top secret clearance. The college degree helps with regard to rank and promotions. They have plenty of infantry to go to the front lines so the chances of them throwing me in the trenches is small.

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bk1
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby bk1 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 7:53 pm

Were loans not an option for you or do you just not want to be in debt?

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MrKappus
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby MrKappus » Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:02 pm

I thought the minimum commitment for joining the Army was 8 years.

dukelawguy144
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby dukelawguy144 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:03 pm

That sounds like a pretty solid plan. I think having the military discipline will be helpful for the field of law. I am fairly debt averse, so anything that helps one reduce the amount of debt from LS seems like a good plan.

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby Great Satchmo » Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:17 pm

MrKappus wrote:I thought the minimum commitment for joining the Army was 8 years.


I think you generally sign up for a certain length of active-duty, but no matter what commitment you sign up for, you have to be on the inactive reserves for a period of time no matter what (which means you can be activated).

I almost joined once or twice (and still have a strong itch to do so), but ultimately I think I'm just too afraid of setting back the rest of my life.

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MrKappus
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby MrKappus » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:01 pm

Great Satchmo wrote:
MrKappus wrote:I thought the minimum commitment for joining the Army was 8 years.


I think you generally sign up for a certain length of active-duty, but no matter what commitment you sign up for, you have to be on the inactive reserves for a period of time no matter what (which means you can be activated).

I almost joined once or twice (and still have a strong itch to do so), but ultimately I think I'm just too afraid of setting back the rest of my life.


I'm about top 5% at a T1 (not T20), and I continue to have this "itch." My greatest concern, articulated from some SF buddies of mine, is that I can't get out without a near-decade-long commitment. If this isn't true, then the Army should advertise it...

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:08 pm

bk1 wrote:Were loans not an option for you or do you just not want to be in debt?



Loans were definitely an option, but I was worried about going into too much debt simply because I may want to enter public service after law school. I also have a wife and child to think about, and all that debt would have been a burden.

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:15 pm

MrKappus wrote:
Great Satchmo wrote:
MrKappus wrote:I thought the minimum commitment for joining the Army was 8 years.


I think you generally sign up for a certain length of active-duty, but no matter what commitment you sign up for, you have to be on the inactive reserves for a period of time no matter what (which means you can be activated).

I almost joined once or twice (and still have a strong itch to do so), but ultimately I think I'm just too afraid of setting back the rest of my life.


I'm about top 5% at a T1 (not T20), and I continue to have this "itch." My greatest concern, articulated from some SF buddies of mine, is that I can't get out without a near-decade-long commitment. If this isn't true, then the Army should advertise it...


the 8 year commitment is a little misleading: Lets say your active duty commitment is 4 years, then your inactive reserves commitment will be another 4 years. The Inactive reserves is very different than the Active reserves. Active reserves means you have to go to training regularly, and you're second in line behind the active duty army when it comes to deploying and such. No one has been called up from the INACTIVE RESERVES, and it won't happen short of WWIII, and if that happens then there will probably be a draft anyway. lol.

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bk1
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby bk1 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:17 pm

jhare wrote:Loans were definitely an option, but I was worried about going into too much debt simply because I may want to enter public service after law school. I also have a wife and child to think about, and all that debt would have been a burden.


I see. Why is the military a more enticing option than using your prospective school's LRAP?

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:34 pm

bk1 wrote:
jhare wrote:Loans were definitely an option, but I was worried about going into too much debt simply because I may want to enter public service after law school. I also have a wife and child to think about, and all that debt would have been a burden.


I see. Why is the military a more enticing option than using your prospective school's LRAP?



I didn't like some of the strings attached to the LRAPs at the schools I got into. For example, at Duke the income eligibility is cut off at 60k/year. The amount of loans I'd have to take out for Duke would be 200k. If I got a job making a little over 60k/year I wouldn't be eligible. I'm still not sure exactly what I want to do after law school, but whatever the LRAP I wouldn't be comfortable with that much in student loans.

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Paichka
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby Paichka » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:56 pm

EDIT: I f-ed up the quoting. My response is a response to another poster's assertion that IRR Soldiers are not called up.

Where did you hear this? It's not true, btw. Particularly for MOS's that are in demand -- intelligence, military police, some medical specialities and (funnily enough) law being the most common.

I don't believe they've gone after anyone for failing to show after being called up, but that's not exactly the same.
Last edited by Paichka on Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mardimar
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby mardimar » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:59 pm

.
Last edited by mardimar on Fri Aug 19, 2011 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:12 pm

Paichka wrote:Where did you hear this? It's not true, btw. Particularly for MOS's that are in demand -- intelligence, military police, some medical specialities and (funnily enough) law being the most common.

I don't believe they've gone after anyone for failing to show after being called up, but that's not exactly the same.


Hmm, that's surprising to hear, let me know if you have evidence of this, that would be great. I'd like to know.


mardimar wrote:This sounds like you're enlisted. as a former Army Captain: Have. Fun. With. That.


Yeah, the wait time for Officer was about a year, and I didn't really want to wait that long. As of right now the Army is a means to an end for me (LS), so the rank I am isn't all that important to me. I'm just glad I can serve my country and earn money for college/a paycheck at the same time.

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MrKappus
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby MrKappus » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:15 pm

Paichka: your ability (or, rather, inability) to quote accurately has amounted to a misleading thread.

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Paichka
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby Paichka » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:26 pm

MrKappus wrote:Paichka: your ability (or, rather, inability) to quote accurately has amounted to a misleading thread.


Thanks! Fixed for you! HTH.

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MrKappus
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby MrKappus » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:29 pm

Paichka wrote:
MrKappus wrote:Paichka: your ability (or, rather, inability) to quote accurately has amounted to a misleading thread.


Thanks! Fixed for you! HTH.


What does IRR mean? Wasn't doubting your knowledge, just your quoting. I want to serve my country, but not to the tune of a decade (more like ~4-6 years).

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:34 pm

Paichka wrote:
MrKappus wrote:Paichka: your ability (or, rather, inability) to quote accurately has amounted to a misleading thread.


Thanks! Fixed for you! HTH.



Still waiting for your info about when IRR soldiers have been called up...

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Paichka
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby Paichka » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:35 pm

jhare wrote:
Paichka wrote:Where did you hear this? It's not true, btw. Particularly for MOS's that are in demand -- intelligence, military police, some medical specialities and (funnily enough) law being the most common.

I don't believe they've gone after anyone for failing to show after being called up, but that's not exactly the same.


Hmm, that's surprising to hear, let me know if you have evidence of this, that would be great. I'd like to know.


mardimar wrote:This sounds like you're enlisted. as a former Army Captain: Have. Fun. With. That.


Yeah, the wait time for Officer was about a year, and I didn't really want to wait that long. As of right now the Army is a means to an end for me (LS), so the rank I am isn't all that important to me. I'm just glad I can serve my country and earn money for college/a paycheck at the same time.


I've served with IRR officers who were called up -- our defense counsel my last go-round was an IRR call up. On our off cycle after my first deployment, my battalion ran the training center at Fort Stewart for IRR soldiers who needed a 2 week crash course before heading out to backfill units already downrange. IRR is a big program, so I'm not sure exactly how many folks get called up each year...and again, I don't know how likely a prosecution would be if you ignore the call-up order, but orders DO come.

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MrKappus
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby MrKappus » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:39 pm

Paichka wrote:I've served with IRR officers who were called up -- our defense counsel my last go-round was an IRR call up. On our off cycle after my first deployment, my battalion ran the training center at Fort Stewart for IRR soldiers who needed a 2 week crash course before heading out to backfill units already downrange. IRR is a big program, so I'm not sure exactly how many folks get called up each year...and again, I don't know how likely a prosecution would be if you ignore the call-up order, but orders DO come.


What is IRR? Please!

Edit: Sorry. Google tells me it's Individual Ready Reserve. I still have no clue what that means. Is that Active Reserve or Inactive?

Edit #2 (post directly below): Paichka answers my post. Sorry for all the questions. I just would love to talk to ppl who know about this stuff.
Last edited by MrKappus on Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Paichka
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby Paichka » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:40 pm

MrKappus wrote:
Paichka wrote:
MrKappus wrote:Paichka: your ability (or, rather, inability) to quote accurately has amounted to a misleading thread.


Thanks! Fixed for you! HTH.


What does IRR mean? Wasn't doubting your knowledge, just your quoting. I want to serve my country, but not to the tune of a decade (more like ~4-6 years).


Sorry, I was a dickhead just there.

Okay, most people serve 4 years or so. After your initial tour, you can choose not to re-up. You're then transitioned into the individual ready reserves. In that, you basically just "float" until you're called up -- there aren't any training requirements (though you do "have" to respond to muster calls, which is how the Army keeps accountability of you). My point was just that the IRR isn't the safe zone people are making it out to be. You DO have a chance of being mobilized. Your obligations to the Army are up after 8 years, not before. That's all I was trying to say.

CyLaw
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby CyLaw » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:42 pm

jhare wrote:No one has been called up from the INACTIVE RESERVES, and it won't happen short of WWIII, and if that happens then there will probably be a draft anyway. lol.


Not true. While not very likely to be called up from IRR, it has happened. If they need a particular skill for an individual augmentee, they may call you up. Also you have about a 50-50 chance depending on branch and location to be at least called in for weight checks and to make sure you are alive, but that would only be for a weekend or so. Did not happen to me, but has happened to more than a couple of my buddies. So don't let any recruiter tell you that it can't happen, or hasn't happened. But know that it is very unlikely to happen that you are called up for a full deployment (but again it has happened, and recently).

Edit: And yeah, the Chapter 33 GI Bill is great. With what is left of mine (used 36 months of Chapter 30 in undergrad) my first 3 semesters at Cornell are 100% covered (Tuition, Fees, Health (since it is a fee at Cornell) and cost of living). So anyone with the full allotment of Chapter 33 can go to Cornell (and a couple other T14s) for free under the Yellow Ribbon Program.

jhare
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby jhare » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:48 pm

CyLaw wrote:
jhare wrote:No one has been called up from the INACTIVE RESERVES, and it won't happen short of WWIII, and if that happens then there will probably be a draft anyway. lol.


Not true. While not very likely to be called up from IRR, it has happened. If they need a particular skill for an individual augmentee, they may call you up. Also you have about a 50-50 chance depending on branch and location to be at least called in for weight checks and to make sure you are alive, but that would only be for a weekend or so. Did not happen to me, but has happened to more than a couple of my buddies. So don't let any recruiter tell you that it can't happen, or hasn't happened. But know that it is very unlikely to happen that you are called up for a full deployment (but again it has happened, and recently).



Ok, so let me get this straight. In IRR there is a very slight chance I could maybe possibly be called up to get my weight checked and maybe possibly get turned active. Sounds good.

CyLaw
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Re: Joining Military before LS

Postby CyLaw » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:52 pm

jhare wrote:
CyLaw wrote:
jhare wrote:No one has been called up from the INACTIVE RESERVES, and it won't happen short of WWIII, and if that happens then there will probably be a draft anyway. lol.


Not true. While not very likely to be called up from IRR, it has happened. If they need a particular skill for an individual augmentee, they may call you up. Also you have about a 50-50 chance depending on branch and location to be at least called in for weight checks and to make sure you are alive, but that would only be for a weekend or so. Did not happen to me, but has happened to more than a couple of my buddies. So don't let any recruiter tell you that it can't happen, or hasn't happened. But know that it is very unlikely to happen that you are called up for a full deployment (but again it has happened, and recently).



Ok, so let me get this straight. In IRR there is a very slight chance I could maybe possibly be called up to get my weight checked and maybe possibly get turned active. Sounds good.


Yep. Just know that that chance is always there.

For me, I was always confident I would never get mobilized from IRR, as it would require a reinvestigation of my TS clearance and a language refresher course. It would have taken them ~9 months just to get me ready for deployment in my AFSC. But I never denied that there was a chance of deployment in the middle of school, and was very glad when I got my paperwork saying my IRR obligation was over.




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