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UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:00 am
by dispatch
I just got in off the wait list to Vandy. I have sent in my deposit and was fully planning on attending UNC this fall (but I haven't signed a lease yet), but I was amazed to get a call from Nashville today.

UNC is in-state for me, and they gave me a small scholarship, so tuition comes out to be a little under 10k a year. Vandy gave me a small scholly, but it's still very close to sticker price.

I want to practice in NYC, and I realize that Vandy seriously trumps UNC in placement outside of NC. My question is: Is Vanderbilt worth full price in this situation?



My gut reaction is Vanderbilt (it was a big reach and a dream school for me); but the extra 120k debt is giving me serious pause.

Thanks, tls. I did one of these before and it was very helpful. I promise this'll be the last one (no more wait lists!).

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:22 am
by bk1
I would say yes since you want to work in NYC.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 8:37 am
by dispatch
Just added a poll.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 8:41 am
by deadpanic
It is really hard to beat under 10K/year in tuition to attend UNC, but if you are dead set on big law in NYC, go to Vandy.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:21 am
by dispatch
Anyone here paying sticker at Vanderbilt currently? or about to start?

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:29 am
by Grizz
I'm going to Vandy and even I wouldn't recommend sticker. However, UNC does not in any way line up with your goal in the least. You have some long, hard thinking to do.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:42 am
by Grizz
dispatch wrote:Anyone here paying sticker at Vanderbilt currently? or about to start?


The responses you get on this question will be mixed from all of TLS. Maybe half will say that Vandy is worth sticker, half won't.

I recommend browsing the admitted students' thread and PMing some of the other WL admits. My guess is that they will be in about the same position in regards to their finances.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:50 am
by KMaine
If you do well, Vandy will get you NYC. It would be very tough from UNC. But 120K is alot, and you will probably still have to be above median at Vandy (how far above will depend on the economy).

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:33 pm
by dispatch
rad law wrote:
dispatch wrote:Anyone here paying sticker at Vanderbilt currently? or about to start?


The responses you get on this question will be mixed from all of TLS. Maybe half will say that Vandy is worth sticker, half won't.

I recommend browsing the admitted students' thread and PMing some of the other WL admits. My guess is that they will be in about the same position in regards to their finances.


That's a good idea, thanks.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:46 pm
by dispatch
I'd love to hear some more opinions. I find myself defending vandy to myself, but I'm really worried about the money.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:55 pm
by interalia
Rising Vandy 2L:

I paid sticker over half-ride at WashU. For me, good choice and not difficult to make. I ended up doing really well and am now looking to transfer, but I would say Vandy is worth sticker. It places decently in NYC. This year they are doing an interview program in NYC (along with WashU and Tulane, so Vandy is the top school in the consortium), and tons of NYC firms are accepting resumes for interviews for this thing (even Cravath, doesn't mean they will hire but still good sign). You're definitely going to want to be dean's list to get these firms, but it is way better odds than having no organized access and just mass-mailing. Also, OCI list shows that many V100 firms will be visiting Vanderbilt for OCI. I didn't count, but between NY firms and other firms hiring for the NY office, NYC is definitely attainable if you do well here.

Sullivan and Cromwell NY is certainly not visiting UNC for OCI (but they visit Vandy every year, require an "A- average" to interview).

Edit: when I say you are going to want to be Dean's list, I mean for NYC V100 generally. Not Cravath, obviously.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:01 pm
by dispatch
interalia wrote:Rising Vandy 2L:

I paid sticker over half-ride at WashU. For me, good choice and not difficult to make. I ended up doing really well and am now looking to transfer, but I would say Vandy is worth sticker. It places decently in NYC. This year they are doing an interview program in NYC (along with WashU and Tulane, so Vandy is the top school in the consortium), and tons of NYC firms are accepting resumes for interviews for this thing (even Cravath, doesn't mean they will hire but still good sign). You're definitely going to want to be dean's list to get these firms, but it is way better odds than having no organized access and just mass-mailing. Also, OCI list shows that many V100 firms will be visiting Vanderbilt for OCI. I didn't count, but between NY firms and other firms hiring for the NY office, NYC is definitely attainable if you do well here.

Sullivan and Cromwell NY is certainly not visiting UNC for OCI (but they visit Vandy every year, require an "A- average" to interview).

Edit: when I say you are going to want to be Dean's list, I mean for NYC V100 generally. Not Cravath, obviously.


Thanks for the info. Is that interview program for rising 2Ls? Are you working this summer or just working on transfer stuff?

Good luck, by the way. Where do you think you'll end up?

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:04 pm
by MrKappus
If your LSAT's ridiculously above median at UNC, then you have some evidence to suggest you'll be able to do well enough at UNC for that degree to travel to NYC. That said, the odds are (obviously) stacked pretty hard against you. I'd say go w/ Vandy, esp given the fact that they gave you some scholly off the WL.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:08 pm
by interalia
dispatch wrote:
interalia wrote:Rising Vandy 2L:

I paid sticker over half-ride at WashU. For me, good choice and not difficult to make. I ended up doing really well and am now looking to transfer, but I would say Vandy is worth sticker. It places decently in NYC. This year they are doing an interview program in NYC (along with WashU and Tulane, so Vandy is the top school in the consortium), and tons of NYC firms are accepting resumes for interviews for this thing (even Cravath, doesn't mean they will hire but still good sign). You're definitely going to want to be dean's list to get these firms, but it is way better odds than having no organized access and just mass-mailing. Also, OCI list shows that many V100 firms will be visiting Vanderbilt for OCI. I didn't count, but between NY firms and other firms hiring for the NY office, NYC is definitely attainable if you do well here.

Sullivan and Cromwell NY is certainly not visiting UNC for OCI (but they visit Vandy every year, require an "A- average" to interview).

Edit: when I say you are going to want to be Dean's list, I mean for NYC V100 generally. Not Cravath, obviously.


Thanks for the info. Is that interview program for rising 2Ls? Are you working this summer or just working on transfer stuff?

Good luck, by the way. Where do you think you'll end up?



Yeah I'm doing two internships, unpaid, but I got a stipend.

I'm hoping for CCN. I want to do NYC big law as well.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:19 pm
by Snoopy1216
u r lucky ur behind got any $ off the waitlist... count ur blessings and work ur ass off in law school...

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:25 am
by krj02004
I understand your dilemna. I'm currently deposited at Vandy.. but received a full ride from Iowa a couple weeks ago. I visited Vandy and a lot of current students had interesting advice to give me.

While everyone said they LOVED Vandy and don't regret their time there... all those students also said that if they were to do it again, they would have chased the money. They said debt is no joke, whether you are in biglaw or not, and will seriously hang a cloud over your "great" experience at Vandy post-grad. Then again, the job market for 3L's was dismal this year. Only 2/3's of the class had jobs when I visited in April and many of those were "deferrments". They did place very well in clerkships, however.

I'm currently in talks with Vandy to raise my scholarship money ($) to a bit more to even justify taking on $150k more in debt over Iowa. Most likely Iowa it will be though. Without so much debt and that stress over my head, I will be less pressured to score a biglaw job if I decide that's not the route I want to take post-grad. However, if I do want biglaw, all it requires is for me to work hard and make sure my grades are there. There is this huge misconception on TLS that unless you are top10 or 20, no one gets a biglaw job, which is totally false. In fact my former employer (biglaw attorney in LA), thinks it's funny rising 0L think this. While top20 does give you significant advantage in you initial placing at a firm, what you do after will determine how far you go in your legal career.

Don't know if this gives you some fresh perspective or not, but this is my 2cents worth. You can't go "wrong" with either choice.... there will just be much more pressure to land that top paying biglaw ob post-grad if you attend Vandy. With where the economy is heading, that is something to seriously consider.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:15 pm
by interalia
krj02004 wrote:I understand your dilemna. I'm currently deposited at Vandy.. but received a full ride from Iowa a couple weeks ago. I visited Vandy and a lot of current students had interesting advice to give me.

While everyone said they LOVED Vandy and don't regret their time there... all those students also said that if they were to do it again, they would have chased the money. They said debt is no joke, whether you are in biglaw or not, and will seriously hang a cloud over your "great" experience at Vandy post-grad. Then again, the job market for 3L's was dismal this year. Only 2/3's of the class had jobs when I visited in April and many of those were "deferrments". They did place very well in clerkships, however.

I'm currently in talks with Vandy to raise my scholarship money ($) to a bit more to even justify taking on $150k more in debt over Iowa. Most likely Iowa it will be though. Without so much debt and that stress over my head, I will be less pressured to score a biglaw job if I decide that's not the route I want to take post-grad. However, if I do want biglaw, all it requires is for me to work hard and make sure my grades are there. There is this huge misconception on TLS that unless you are top10 or 20, no one gets a biglaw job, which is totally false. In fact my former employer (biglaw attorney in LA), thinks it's funny rising 0L think this. While top20 does give you significant advantage in you initial placing at a firm, what you do after will determine how far you go in your legal career.

Don't know if this gives you some fresh perspective or not, but this is my 2cents worth. You can't go "wrong" with either choice.... there will just be much more pressure to land that top paying biglaw ob post-grad if you attend Vandy. With where the economy is heading, that is something to seriously consider.




You can't lose what you don't put on the table...but you can't win much either.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:18 pm
by traehekat
krj02004 - join us at Iowa. :mrgreen:

OP, if you want NYC you have to bite the bullet and choose Vanderbilt, I think. If you didn't have a big regional preference, though, then I would probably go with UNC.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:18 pm
by Grizz
interalia wrote:You can't lose what you don't put on the table...but you can't win much either.


OP, that's the gist of it.

$5 says you end up at Vandy though.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:53 pm
by dispatch
interalia wrote:
krj02004 wrote:I understand your dilemna. I'm currently deposited at Vandy.. but received a full ride from Iowa a couple weeks ago. I visited Vandy and a lot of current students had interesting advice to give me.

While everyone said they LOVED Vandy and don't regret their time there... all those students also said that if they were to do it again, they would have chased the money. They said debt is no joke, whether you are in biglaw or not, and will seriously hang a cloud over your "great" experience at Vandy post-grad. Then again, the job market for 3L's was dismal this year. Only 2/3's of the class had jobs when I visited in April and many of those were "deferrments". They did place very well in clerkships, however.

I'm currently in talks with Vandy to raise my scholarship money ($) to a bit more to even justify taking on $150k more in debt over Iowa. Most likely Iowa it will be though. Without so much debt and that stress over my head, I will be less pressured to score a biglaw job if I decide that's not the route I want to take post-grad. However, if I do want biglaw, all it requires is for me to work hard and make sure my grades are there. There is this huge misconception on TLS that unless you are top10 or 20, no one gets a biglaw job, which is totally false. In fact my former employer (biglaw attorney in LA), thinks it's funny rising 0L think this. While top20 does give you significant advantage in you initial placing at a firm, what you do after will determine how far you go in your legal career.

Don't know if this gives you some fresh perspective or not, but this is my 2cents worth. You can't go "wrong" with either choice.... there will just be much more pressure to land that top paying biglaw ob post-grad if you attend Vandy. With where the economy is heading, that is something to seriously consider.




You can't lose what you don't put on the table...but you can't win much either.


Great movie, and a very apt quote. I'm completely on the fence. Every time I get excited about going to vandy, I think of the interest on a $180,000 loan...

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:19 am
by interalia
I feel you dude. It is a risk, there is no doubt about that. Clearly, I thought it was worth it. Did that add to my stress level throughout the year? Absolutely. Do I feel good about it now? Absolutely.

You've gotta decide what you want. If you want a shot at the big time legal jobs (and in big legal markets), Vandy is your choice, no questions asked. If you are happy to be a lawyer without a lot of debt but with no shot at models and bottles, maybe UNC isn't looking so bad.

The flip side is, no one from Vandy is going to do so terribly in the long run. Just don't fuck around, know that you're there for a reason... idk I'm looking in hindsight now but you get the point.

Also, and I'm not speaking to you personally, but going to UNC on $$ doesn't mean you'll do well there. It could be a good thing to have the debt hanging over you if it motivates you to work your ass off and excel. I know people at Vanderbilt who turned down significantly higher ranked schools for $$$-$$$$ and are at median because they treated it like vacation for 12 weeks a semester. Having that rope around your neck, while not comfortable by any means, can really make you fight.

Honestly, I think Vanderbilt is the best choice in this case.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 4:05 pm
by Barolo
Not peer schools so cost difference is less of an issue. For NYC: Vandy>>>>UNC. If you can stomach the money, this is not even a close contest.

Re: UNC($$) Vs. Vandy

Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 4:28 pm
by World B. Free
Barolo wrote:Not peer schools so cost difference is less of an issue. For NYC: Vandy>>>>UNC. If you can stomach the money, this is not even a close contest.

+1 -- I voted Vandy, hands down.