WUSTL vs. Emory?

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Washington University in St. Louis vs. Emory?

Poll ended at Thu May 06, 2010 1:34 pm

WUSTL (30k)
28
40%
Emory (60k)
42
60%
 
Total votes: 70

Brdway4212
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WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby Brdway4212 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:34 pm

Really having a hard time deciding between these two. I recognize that the obvious answer to many will be Emory because of the 30k scholarship difference. However, I preferred WashU when I visited (environment, professors, career services department/general job prospects, gut "feeling")...but thinking that these reasons may not be worth 30k.

Further complicating the decision is the fact that I don't want to work in either St. Louis or Atlanta after graduation. Ideal region is Northeast. I was accepted to Fordham, but no scholarship and had to rule it out because of that and overall cost of living. Waitlisted at BC, BU, and UVA (little hope for any of those).

Would really appreciate advice.

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JCougar
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby JCougar » Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:39 pm

WUSTL does better in the Northeast than Emory, it seems. Better enough that it's worth the extra debt.

However, try to get off the waitlist at BC or BU (obviously).

And I say this as someone on the hold list at WUSTL that really really wants people to withdraw so I get in.

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najumobi
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby najumobi » Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:49 pm

JCougar wrote:WUSTL does better in the Northeast than Emory, it seems. Better enough that it's worth the extra debt.

However, try to get off the waitlist at BC or BU (obviously).

And I say this as someone on the hold list at WUSTL that really really wants people to withdraw so I get in.
actually according to usnews a greater percentage of emory grads end up in the northeast than that for wustl (25% compared to 15%). of course this could just be b/c a larger portion of emory students come from the northeast.

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JCougar
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby JCougar » Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:52 pm

najumobi wrote:
JCougar wrote:WUSTL does better in the Northeast than Emory, it seems. Better enough that it's worth the extra debt.

However, try to get off the waitlist at BC or BU (obviously).

And I say this as someone on the hold list at WUSTL that really really wants people to withdraw so I get in.
actually according to usnews a greater percentage of emory grads end up in the northeast than that for wustl (25% compared to 15%). of course this could just be b/c a larger portion of emory students come from the northeast.


Wow...I had no idea Emory was that high.

Still...OP should get into one of BC/BU if he/she had the numbers to get $$ from both WUSTL and Emory.

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najumobi
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby najumobi » Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:55 pm

Brdway4212 wrote:Really having a hard time deciding between these two. I recognize that the obvious answer to many will be Emory because of the 30k scholarship difference. However, I preferred WashU when I visited (environment, professors, career services department/general job prospects, gut "feeling")...but thinking that these reasons may not be worth 30k.

Further complicating the decision is the fact that I don't want to work in either St. Louis or Atlanta after graduation. Ideal region is Northeast. I was accepted to Fordham, but no scholarship and had to rule it out because of that and overall cost of living. Waitlisted at BC, BU, and UVA (little hope for any of those).

Would really appreciate advice.
wustl actually does a little better in placing their students into high paying jobs. and since you think wustl is a better fit for you, i think that could be worth the 30k difference (and really 25k difference since emory cost of attendance is a little higher). so basically, i say go with wustl, b/c i think fit is worth the 25k difference. of course that's with me disregarding the Northeast preference. if you truly want the best shot at being in the northeast and think that is more important than fit go with emory. the money is really inconsequential in this situation. just compare fit vs. northeast desire.

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You Gotta Have Faith
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby You Gotta Have Faith » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:05 pm

Brdway4212 wrote:Really having a hard time deciding between these two. I recognize that the obvious answer to many will be Emory because of the 30k scholarship difference. However, I preferred WashU when I visited (environment, professors, career services department/general job prospects, gut "feeling")...but thinking that these reasons may not be worth 30k.

Further complicating the decision is the fact that I don't want to work in either St. Louis or Atlanta after graduation. Ideal region is Northeast. I was accepted to Fordham, but no scholarship and had to rule it out because of that and overall cost of living. Waitlisted at BC, BU, and UVA (little hope for any of those).

Would really appreciate advice.


There's a lot to be said for your gut "feeling" at a school. You want to be happy wherever you are. Although I *more likely* would have picked Emory with 30K more were I in your situation, if I preferred a school substantially more it just might be worth that difference. StL is slightly cheaper to live in than ATL, but I don't think the difference is huge.

If you want the Northeast, as someone has already mentioned, keep working on BU and BC. (but for what it's worth, I wouldn't take either at sticker given what you have here). If you're really sold in every way, shape and form on the Northeast (and especially NY), then re-consider Fordham.

In the end though, I don't think you can go wrong with the schollies at WUSTL or Emory. Either school will work with you and try hard to place you in the Northeast. Good luck!

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najumobi
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby najumobi » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:17 pm

Brdway4212 wrote:Really having a hard time deciding between these two. I recognize that the obvious answer to many will be Emory because of the 30k scholarship difference. However, I preferred WashU when I visited (environment, professors, career services department/general job prospects, gut "feeling")...but thinking that these reasons may not be worth 30k.

Further complicating the decision is the fact that I don't want to work in either St. Louis or Atlanta after graduation. Ideal region is Northeast. I was accepted to Fordham, but no scholarship and had to rule it out because of that and overall cost of living. Waitlisted at BC, BU, and UVA (little hope for any of those).

Would really appreciate advice.

oh and also since you said you don't actually want to work in either st. louis or atlanta, 45% of emory grads end up working in atlanta, whereas only 25% of wustl grads end up working in st. louis.

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stratocophic
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby stratocophic » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:21 pm

najumobi wrote:
Brdway4212 wrote:Really having a hard time deciding between these two. I recognize that the obvious answer to many will be Emory because of the 30k scholarship difference. However, I preferred WashU when I visited (environment, professors, career services department/general job prospects, gut "feeling")...but thinking that these reasons may not be worth 30k.

Further complicating the decision is the fact that I don't want to work in either St. Louis or Atlanta after graduation. Ideal region is Northeast. I was accepted to Fordham, but no scholarship and had to rule it out because of that and overall cost of living. Waitlisted at BC, BU, and UVA (little hope for any of those).

Would really appreciate advice.

oh and also since you said you don't actually want to work in either st. louis or atlanta, 45% of emory grads end up working in atlanta, whereas only 25% of wustl grads end up working in st. louis.
Good call. That's probably the most relevant stat for OP.

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DerrickRose
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby DerrickRose » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:22 pm

You don't have perfect options here, but I would lean towards Emory.

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romothesavior
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby romothesavior » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:23 pm

Tough call, given your preference for the NE. I'm really not sure which way I would fall on this issue.

Just something to consider... the COL in St. Louis is dirt cheap. No idea what it costs to get an apartment around Emory, but apartments near WUSTL can be as low as $500-600 for a single bedroom, and I plan on spending about $400 with a 2BR. That obviously won't close the gap between the cost of Emory, but it is still something to consider.

I'm going to go ahead and vote WUSTL on this one, since you say your gut tells you to go there. Personal happiness and that "gut feeling" are not something to disregard. I'm taking WUSTL over a couple of "better" offers because I feel like I will be the most comfortable there.

PS. I also am voting WUSTL because I've voted against it a lot lately in these types of threads. :D

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DerrickRose
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby DerrickRose » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:25 pm

How the heck can you have 60k at Emory and not even get in at BC? Are you a splitter?

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stratocophic
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby stratocophic » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:31 pm

DerrickRose wrote:How the heck can you have 60k at Emory and not even get in at BC? Are you a splitter?

Gotta be that or else an LSAT one point lower than BC's median paired with a high GPA. I think Emory has a 166 and BC has a 167, but I may be wrong. The high GPA would also explain the lower offer from WUSTL, given that they evidently value splitters more highly than reverse splitters. Just a thought :?

rando
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby rando » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:35 pm

Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?

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romothesavior
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby romothesavior » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:37 pm

rando wrote:Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?


Not quite. Chicago is WUSTL's main market, with St. Louis being second.

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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby rando » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:45 pm

romothesavior wrote:
rando wrote:Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?


Not quite. Chicago is WUSTL's main market, with St. Louis being second.


Fair enough. I should have been clearer that if you don't have your choice of where to be... ex, roomate from college went to WUSTL and was pretty bummed at having to be in ST. Louis due to less than stellar grades because he was planning on going to Chi.

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You Gotta Have Faith
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby You Gotta Have Faith » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:48 pm

romothesavior wrote:
rando wrote:Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?


Not quite. Chicago is WUSTL's main market, with St. Louis being second.


In order of prevalence at WUSTL, it is:

1. Chicago
2. St Louis
3. DC/New York (goes back and forth)
5. LA/Atlanta (also can go back and forth)


Have no idea what it is for Emory so I won't comment on them. But to the OP, again, I really think that you can't go wrong with either option. Both schools CAN get you into the Northeast. It might not be quite the job you WANT in the Northeast. But they WILL get you into the Northeast, likely at mid-law (unless you do really well and pull off big-law).

In response to Rando's comment... this makes some sense. But I guess my point is that this person COULD get something in Chicago, but it wouldn't be practical. Because the job they'd get in St Louis is better than the one they would get in Chicago. If that makes sense. In the same way, OP could go to the Northeast, but would want to do really well to be guaranteed any sort of Big Law in that region.

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romothesavior
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby romothesavior » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:52 pm

You Gotta Have Faith wrote:
romothesavior wrote:
rando wrote:Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?


Not quite. Chicago is WUSTL's main market, with St. Louis being second.


In order of prevalence at WUSTL, it is:

1. Chicago
2. St Louis
3. DC/New York (goes back and forth)
5. LA/Atlanta (also can go back and forth)


Have no idea what it is for Emory so I won't comment on them. But to the OP, again, I really think that you can't go wrong with either option. Both schools CAN get you into the Northeast. It might not be quite the job you WANT in the Northeast. But they WILL get you into the Northeast, likely at mid-law (unless you do really well and pull off big-law).

In response to Rando's comment... this makes some sense. But I guess my point is that this person COULD get something in Chicago, but it wouldn't be practical. Because the job they'd get in St Louis is better than the one they would get in Chicago. If that makes sense. In the same way, OP could go to the Northeast, but would want to do really well to be guaranteed any sort of Big Law in that region.


Not really sure what you're basing that last paragraph on. Why would St. Louis jobs be better than Chicago jobs? Top WUSTL grads are going to be looking at market-paying biglaw jobs at top Chicago firms (Kirkland and Ellis, Mayer, etc.) They also will have the opportunity for St. Louis big law. Personally, I would prefer St. Louis biglaw because it is slightly less stress, I prefer St. Louis over Chicago, and the lower COL appeals to me. Others would rather be in Chicago for the city life and the higher salary (usually). It just comes down to personal preferences.

I don't really see your point as to WUSTL grads will get better jobs in St. Louis than in Chicago. In some ways, it can actually be harder for Wash U grads to stay in St. Louis.

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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby Grizz » Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:57 pm

rando wrote:Emory's two big contingents are Atlanta and NY. I love it here. And I hate ST. Louis. That's why I chose Emory. Seriously though, COL in both places are very low. You should think about where you would rather be in the event you can't get to the NE. ST. Louis or Atlanta as a backup?


This, plus the money, makes me vote for Emory unhesitatingly.

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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby ze2151 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:01 pm

only go to emory if you really want to be there. if you're going to spend your time pining for wustl, then you're better off there. big decision.

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You Gotta Have Faith
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby You Gotta Have Faith » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:10 pm

romothesavior wrote:Not really sure what you're basing that last paragraph on. Why would St. Louis jobs be better than Chicago jobs? Top WUSTL grads are going to be looking at market-paying biglaw jobs at top Chicago firms (Kirkland and Ellis, Mayer, etc.) They also will have the opportunity for St. Louis big law. Personally, I would prefer St. Louis biglaw because it is slightly less stress, I prefer St. Louis over Chicago, and the lower COL appeals to me. Others would rather be in Chicago for the city life and the higher salary (usually). It just comes down to personal preferences.

I don't really see your point as to WUSTL grads will get better jobs in St. Louis than in Chicago. In some ways, it can actually be harder for Wash U grads to stay in St. Louis.


Let me re-phrase...

The "better" big-law jobs are in Chicago. But sometimes you can get a St Louis "big law" job with about the same effort as a Chicago "mid-law" job. So it would make more sense (assuming that's your goal) to stay in St. Louis.

Or if that phrasing doesn't work well for you, I'll say that it takes less effort to get a better job in St Louis than Chicago. But you could still get some job in Chicago.

Overall, my point is that you can go to either market. It's just harder to get the higher-up jobs in Chicago than in St. Louis.

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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby romothesavior » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:12 pm

You Gotta Have Faith wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Not really sure what you're basing that last paragraph on. Why would St. Louis jobs be better than Chicago jobs? Top WUSTL grads are going to be looking at market-paying biglaw jobs at top Chicago firms (Kirkland and Ellis, Mayer, etc.) They also will have the opportunity for St. Louis big law. Personally, I would prefer St. Louis biglaw because it is slightly less stress, I prefer St. Louis over Chicago, and the lower COL appeals to me. Others would rather be in Chicago for the city life and the higher salary (usually). It just comes down to personal preferences.

I don't really see your point as to WUSTL grads will get better jobs in St. Louis than in Chicago. In some ways, it can actually be harder for Wash U grads to stay in St. Louis.


Let me re-phrase...

The "better" big-law jobs are in Chicago. But sometimes you can get a St Louis "big law" job with about the same effort as a Chicago "mid-law" job. So it would make more sense (assuming that's your goal) to stay in St. Louis.

Overall, my point is that you can go to either market. It's just harder to get the higher-up jobs in Chicago than in St. Louis.


Not necessarily. St. Louis firms are very wary of WUSTL grads because they see them as flight risks. They don't want to end up being a student's "fallback" if they can't get Chicago/DC/NYC. They are very concerned with retention and people leaving after a short stint and doing a lateral move into another market. You have to show a firm commitment to STL to get a St. Louis firm job.

Also, what is this "midlaw" you speak of? Midlaw isn't some easy fallback for someone who misses the biglaw cut. It is just as difficult to get as biglaw.

Brdway4212
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby Brdway4212 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:34 pm

I really appreciate all of the input. I definitely have a lot to consider (but hearing different viewpoints is helping me weigh the options). Not sure where I would rather be if I can't break the NE market. I've only spent a couple of days in both cities when I attended the ASDs, so hard to know.

I'm also starting to doubt my own gut feelings. Until recently, I thought I had a better gut feeling about WashU. The admissions dean there had made it sound like they would raise my scholarship given other competitive offers (90k Illinois included)...but came back and said they won't. I'm currently trying to separate my anger about that from my true feelings about the school...hard to do.

In response to an earlier comment, stats are 168, 3.5 ivy undergrad. I'm not sure why no BC/ BU. I would absolutely love to get off the wait list at UVA, but realize that is extremely unlikely since they seem to have waitlisted the world there this year.

I'm considering taking the June LSAT to help with waitlists (although that may not help because of late timing with release of scores). I was scoring around 172-175 on most practice tests. Several people have mentioned that I should apply again next cycle...but I can't stand the thought of working at my particular job another year. I never thought this process would be quite so stressful!

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DerrickRose
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby DerrickRose » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:37 pm

Brdway4212 wrote:The admissions dean there had made it sound like they would raise my scholarship given other competitive offers (90k Illinois included)...but came back and said they won't. I'm currently trying to separate my anger about that from my true feelings about the school...hard to do.

This is where I would normally start trolling for Illinois, but outside of having somewhat of a footprint in DC, we place almost no one in the Northeast. So I won't. But if you suddenly fall in love with the Chi....

In response to an earlier comment, stats are 168, 3.5 ivy undergrad. I'm not sure why no BC/ BU.


*Thanks his lucky stars he didn't take TLS'ers advice to reapply*

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You Gotta Have Faith
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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby You Gotta Have Faith » Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:41 pm

romothesavior wrote:
Not necessarily. St. Louis firms are very wary of WUSTL grads because they see them as flight risks. They don't want to end up being a student's "fallback" if they can't get Chicago/DC/NYC. They are very concerned with retention and people leaving after a short stint and doing a lateral move into another market. You have to show a firm commitment to STL to get a St. Louis firm job.

Also, what is this "midlaw" you speak of? Midlaw isn't some easy fallback for someone who misses the biglaw cut. It is just as difficult to get as biglaw.


Mid-law is most certainly easier to get than big-law. There are different tiers within each, but on the whole, getting into one of the monster firms can be more challenging than getting into a firm that only has 50-100 attorneys. In any case, it's a far cry from "just as difficult to get as biglaw." It doesn't pay as well as big law but it pays better than private practice or a smaller firm (most of the time). Please trust me on this one, I've been looking at this for a while now.

As for flight risk concern, I think it *can* be true but doesn't *have* to be. I think there are two prevailing views about WUSTL grads getting jobs here in St Louis (that are conflicting views) and I think both are over-stated. The first is:

(1) The flight risk argument. WUSTL grads are all somehow just dying to get out of St Louis, and St Louis firms are wary of this. Thus they might not even give them a job. The second (alternative) view is that,

(2) St Louis firms just LOVE the WUSTL grads who want to hang around St Louis. Since most of them go away, they are happy as heck to get the ones who DO stay in St Louis.

In the end, I think it really depends on the person almost as much as WUSTL itself. If you are from NY, have always worked in NY and want to go back to NY... then sure, StL firms will see you as a major flight risk. But if you are from, say, Kansas, then despite the lack of any connection to StL (or Chicago), StL firms are less likely to see you as a flight risk simply because they know there is not as prevailing of a legal market where you're from, and StL would be a "step up" for you.

However, I will definitely agree with you that showing a firm commitment to StL really helps you in getting a job here, whoever you are and whatever your GPA/resume is. No matter where you're from, if you go to WUSTL you at least have the argument to employers that you went there precisely because you wanted to work in StL (for some people that's actually true, and others just use that to get a job).

If I don't reply right away, it's not that I've neglected the thread... it's that I have 1L finals to study for. Meh.

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Re: WUSTL vs. Emory?

Postby Brdway4212 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 4:04 pm

DerrickRose wrote:
Brdway4212 wrote:The admissions dean there had made it sound like they would raise my scholarship given other competitive offers (90k Illinois included)...but came back and said they won't. I'm currently trying to separate my anger about that from my true feelings about the school...hard to do.

This is where I would normally start trolling for Illinois, but outside of having somewhat of a footprint in DC, we place almost no one in the Northeast. So I won't. But if you suddenly fall in love with the Chi....

In response to an earlier comment, stats are 168, 3.5 ivy undergrad. I'm not sure why no BC/ BU.


*Thanks his lucky stars he didn't take TLS'ers advice to reapply*


I think Illinois is pretty much out of the running right now. I went to college in the middle of nowhere...and while I loved it, I can't handle that for another 3 years. Plus I am not used to such a huge school. The whole environment of the campus/ 40,000 people there really overwhelmed me. Did TLS people tell you to reapply last year?




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