Top Law Schools

So, ive been reading the forums for a while on information but i wanted to get some input before deciding which school. This might seem like a ridiculous question and i think i know what im going to do, but id like to see how this poll turns out.

Right now I have a 90k scholarship from UVA (also instate) and 45k from Michigan. Already tried to negotiate and that was a no go. Only apps left outstanding are Penn WL (that i havent responded to be on) and NYU so feel free to take that option if you vote.

the concern for me is feel of campus, and how conservative of a reputation UVA has. I felt like there was more to do in ann arbor than charlottesville. also, im comfortable having a range of opinions present, but would definitly prefer a liberal leaning area/not like to be in an overwhelmingly conservative situation. how conservative is the town/general student body, and how conservative are the law students/faculty? Also I feel like Michigan has a very slightly better reputation (though not enough to justify 45k i think)

Also for full disclosure: I dont really know where I'd like to end up working, dont really want to be in Chicago/Midwest but would be ok with east/west/south, and if i had to pick an interest, it would be some sort of entertainment/sports law (and i realize thats near impossible from any school)

One person's take:

1. Cost: Advantage: UVA

2. Reputation:I think the difference in reputation is pretty close to zilch, if there at all. Basically, a dead tie.

3. Atmosphere: I think Charlottesville is great. As a whole, I think it's also a pretty liberal area (college town, just like Chapel Hill, Ithaca, and the like).
From TLS synopsis: "UVA is situated in what can, by all measures, be called a college town. Charlottesville is small and packed with greenery. Chances are high that while walking around the city or shopping at the mall, you will see someone you know. The law school is a short drive from the airport and not too far from the Appalachian Trail. Many find the intimate surroundings a welcome relief from the bustle of a big city lifestyle.
[...]
Many students add that the beauty of the campus and Charlottesville is unparalleled among the T14. The weather is pleasant and there is nothing like watching the campus change color with the seasons. Charlottesville itself offers a variety of dining and nightlife options. Students also report the high quality of the facilities is a major selling point for the school."

It's definitely less urban. If urban is a draw for you, that's a big plus for Michigan. There's definitely going to be "more to do" there, assuming you like doing the things available in urban areas. However, Charlottesville is going to have some stuff to do; it isn't Cullowee, where you damned well better like hiking or drinking. Personally, I'd take the green over the grey, though plenty of people would elect otherwise - a perfectly understandable preference. Advantage: Depends (for me, notable advantage to UVA).

4. Weather: Advantage: Charlottesville.

5. Politics: I get it, but you'll be able to find people to associate with - definitely outside of the law school, but also within. If it's the gestalt feeling of political leanings, still understandable. At least minor advantage to Michigan.

My opinion is that Charlottesville is a great town with a great setting and great weather. Ann Arbor is a cool city with a suitable setting and crumby weather. Tie the reputation, and give a big advantage to UVA in terms of cost, and the clear winner is UVA (were I in your shoes). If departmental political climate is a heavy issue for you, I suppose it could pull all the way over to Michigan; that had better be some serious pull, though.

You can't make a bad decision in your circumstances - maybe a better or worse one, but not a bad one. I'd go with UVA, and I wouldn't regret it for a moment.

EDIT: Goofed in reading the tuition numbers. Modified post accordingly.

UVa is less liberal than other schools, such as Berkeley. That doesn't mean it's conservative. There is a strong liberal slant the school, and you shouldn't be afraid of the political climate. Having a well-represented minority viewpoint should be considered a positive, not a negative, because you might actually find someone who disagrees with you and who will present you an opportunity to develop your viewpoints.

You'd be crazy to turn down more than twice as much money (scholarship + in-state discount) to get essentially the same exact placement prospects, just at a school in a different location--especially a location you don't want to end up in.

Since you don't want to be in Chicago/Midwest (where Michigan has a slight home-court advantage), and are fine with the East/South, it looks like UVA's the obvious choice here. Michigan places slightly more on the West Coast, but that difference isn't worth 45k + in-state discount.

Thats definitely what I am leaning toward, just wanted to see some opinions on what I was concerned about. Any reasons why people on this poll voted for Michigan?

I love UMich, personally prefer it to UVA, and tend to vote for it in polls like this. But UVA seems like the obvious choice here. I suspect the worries about UVA being too conservative are either spurious or overblown.

That's a big money difference and it's hard to say $45k+ doesn't matter. If I was in your position, it would be difficult to turn down UVA, but if I was to make the case for Michigan...

You're right about the difference in feel. I visited both UVA and Michigan and there really is a noticable difference in the student body. I really felt that the folks at Michigan were more mature/less fratty.

If you're interested in sports law, Michigan has some great faculty in that area. It's also a big-10 school. I think UVA has sports teams, but I'm not sure. You should google Virginia football/basketball and see if anything comes up.

For work, Michigan would be better for the West, UVA would be better for the South, and they both do well in the East.

Location can be important and it sounded like you liked Ann Arbor more than C-ville.

Tough choice.

UVA. Better cash, and you can place where you want to. Don't worry about the politics. None of these schools (save maybe Regent) are so nutty in either direction that it should pose a problem.

legalease9 wrote:UVA. Better cash, and you can place where you want to. Don't worry about the politics. None of these schools (save maybe Regent) are so nutty in either direction that it should pose a problem.

+1

holydonkey wrote:That's a big money difference and it's hard to say $45k+ doesn't matter. If I was in your position, it would be difficult to turn down UVA, but if I was to make the case for Michigan...

You're right about the difference in feel. I visited both UVA and Michigan and there really is a noticable difference in the student body. I really felt that the folks at Michigan were more mature/less fratty.

If you're interested in sports law, Michigan has some great faculty in that area. It's also a big-10 school. I think UVA has sports teams, but I'm not sure. You should google Virginia football/basketball and see if anything comes up.

For work, Michigan would be better for the West, UVA would be better for the South, and they both do well in the East.

Location can be important and it sounded like you liked Ann Arbor more than C-ville.

Tough choice.

is there really a significant advantage for sports/ent law at Michigan (besides having legit teams in major sports)? I know there is a sports and entertainment law journal at UVA so I assume there is some faculty/institutional support for that interest. Anyone with any experience in this?

I definitly liked the vibe of Ann Arbor over cville, but I think i could enjoy UVA too..i like a college town feel, cville just seemed even smaller than most (but maybe i just got the wrong impression)

Behold the website for the Virginia Sports & Entertainment Law Journal in all its glory - --LinkRemoved--

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure about the differences. I can tell you that this is the guy that hosted the DC area social mixer for Michigan students - http://www.perennialse.com/Team/Chitta/

45 k is alot of money but u should go where you will be happy if u really don't like cville it might not be worth the extra dough

holydonkey wrote:That's a big money difference and it's hard to say $45k+ doesn't matter. If I was in your position, it would be difficult to turn down UVA, but if I was to make the case for Michigan...

You're right about the difference in feel. I visited both UVA and Michigan and there really is a noticable difference in the student body. I really felt that the folks at Michigan were more mature/less fratty.

If you're interested in sports law, Michigan has some great faculty in that area. It's also a big-10 school. I think UVA has sports teams, but I'm not sure. You should google Virginia football/basketball and see if anything comes up.

For work, Michigan would be better for the West, UVA would be better for the South, and they both do well in the East.

Location can be important and it sounded like you liked Ann Arbor more than C-ville.

Tough choice.

The most famous play in Michigan sports history:
--ImageRemoved--

The most famous play in UVA sports history

holydonkey wrote:The most famous play in UVA sports history

Well played, Sir Donkey.

--ImageRemoved--

UVA and Mich are very close in almost every respect as far as opportunities you will have as a grad. I tend to like Mich better, but that is a significant enough $$$ difference, so I say UVA is clear choice.

showNprove wrote:--ImageRemoved--

Not to be outdone, showNprove draws blood...

See also Colorado vs. Michigan (1994), "The Catch": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Nt6HjqtJt8

Michigan: All-time record, 877–302–36 (.737)
Virginia Tech: All-time record 668–428–46 (.605)
Michigan State: All-time record 618–429–44 (.587)
UVA: All-time record 599–520–48 (.534)

Virginia 17 - Michigan 18
In the Pigskin Classic on August 26, 1995, Virginia led Michigan, in Michigan's home stadium, 17-0 in the fourth quarter. The Cavaliers blew the lead, giving the Wolverines two scores, and the final came on the last play, where Scott Dreisbach threw a fifteen yard touchdown pass to Mercury Hayes for the touchdown that gave the Wolverines a one-point win, 18-17.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_C ... ichigan_18

Tribe upends UVA 26-14 in football opener
http://www.wm.edu/news/stories/2009/tri ... er-123.php

I came down to choosing between Michigan and Virginia and chose Michigan. My scholarship situation and interests are different that yours, but from talking to lawyers and law students in the south, a Michigan law degree seems to be just as strong as UVA, so don't worry that you won't be able to get back to the south. I was also really concerned with the political culture at each school and asked for advice from TLS. Heres the thread, fwiw: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=113802

As a Mich grad and a uva law 0L, I will say that the picture of App. State beating Michigan was totally uncalled for....what a depressing day that was

Michigan has a very rich history of being a football powerhouse. I'm sure if OP went there, (s)he could read a lot of stories about Michigan's greatest players and games. Too bad she won't be able to see any new ones, now that Michigan football is as bad as UVa.

If OP wants to go to a football school, (s)he should go to Ohio State.

tangential886 wrote:I came down to choosing between Michigan and Virginia and chose Michigan. My scholarship situation and interests are different that yours, but from talking to lawyers and law students in the south, a Michigan law degree seems to be just as strong as UVA, so don't worry that you won't be able to get back to the south. I was also really concerned with the political culture at each school and asked for advice from TLS. Heres the thread, fwiw: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=113802

Thanks for the input, I definitly read through your thread earlier and it was helpful. I think I'm ok with what I've heard of the political climate, Im thinking it wont be as liberal as I'd like at UVA, but as long as its not stifiling or affecting how courses are taught/graded I think I would be fine.

I guess at this point with the overwhelming $$ advantage, im feeling a little ridiculous to just be thinking about QOL reasons to take on extra debt, when by all accounts the schools are so similar, with a few more "fratty" kids at UVA and a bit smaller town (I kind of like the beer/softball vibe). As far as my interests in law go, i dont feel like anyone really knows that either school would make a difference at all.

and as far as the sports references go...I would be staying loyal to my undergrad rather than looking to root for a new team (though i would at least root for the teams at michigan but not UVA haha)