Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

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PhillyLaw2010
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Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby PhillyLaw2010 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:35 pm

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated! I'm having a tough time.

I plan on working in the Philly area and practicing Public Interest law. I think I want to be a public defender but that could change as I go through school.

Temple has a better PI program and a great Trial ad program. I was going to choose them but Villanova offered a full ride. Temple has offered nothing so it would be around 18 grand a year in tuition.

If it were another school I might just take the full ride without thinking but I get the sense that Villanova is going to be a bit of a culture clash for me. The school seems way more conservative than I would like and the students seem young and less diverse (they don't call it Vanilla-nova for nothing). The facilities are nice though and I sat in on a class and was very impressed by one of their professors.

Temple, in general, is more my kind of scene. It has a very active National Lawyers Guild chapter (as opposed to Villanova) and a lot more students that are similar to myself (left politically, activist oriented). However, graduating with sixty thousand dollars less debt could really free me up to do whatever Public Interest law I want to do. And Villanova is not so bad... I would get a fine legal education and probably find some like minded folks along the way.

Any thoughts?

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pany1985
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby pany1985 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:38 pm

I'm sort of amazed that you've seen both campuses and want to choose Temple, scholarship aside.

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DerrickRose
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby DerrickRose » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:49 pm

Its nice that you've done research into the schools, and it seems like you've gotten a good handle of the two of them.

That being said: Don't be an idiot, take the money.

And as an aside, Temple is pretty stingy with the scholarship dough. Can't imagine that's a route to good things for a T2.

JOThompson
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby JOThompson » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:50 pm

Temple does well in the city, Villanova excels in the suburbs. The Trial Ad program at Temple will be great preparation for any sort of public defender work. If you're also more comfortable with the Temple atmosphere, I think this becomes an easy decision IF you find a PI job. Otherwise, Villanova makes the most financial sense since you won't be enslaved to your debt.

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anthonyc350
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby anthonyc350 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:30 pm

I got offered more money at nova than temple but I can't bring myself to go to school in the suburbs, I'd really prefer temple to living on the mainline but its stupid not to take the money...

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T14_Scholly
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby T14_Scholly » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:33 pm

Aren't you past Villanova's deadline?

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pany1985
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby pany1985 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:36 pm

Well, it's stupid not to take the money provided that you don't lose the scholarship. I ended up not accepting either offer, but I was admitted to both last year. Temple wouldn't give me any money (presumably because I was in-state and it was already only like 15k/yr), but Villanova gave me enough that it made it cheaper than Temple. The catch is that you can lose a scholarship but you can't lose in-state tution (unless you move out of the state, which would be terribly stupid and make no sense).

PhillyLaw2010
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby PhillyLaw2010 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:50 pm

Villanova's scholarship does not come with GPA requirements... so no worry on that end.

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pany1985
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby pany1985 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:59 pm

Well then that's a pretty good deal

keg411
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby keg411 » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:42 pm

PhillyLaw2010 wrote:Villanova's scholarship does not come with GPA requirements... so no worry on that end.


I think you have to take the full ride. You can also try to negotiate with Temple using the 'Nova scholarship. Even if they don't match, they might be able to get close enough to be competitive.

Still, a full ride with zero strings in the region you want to work in? Great job :).

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underachiever
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby underachiever » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:54 pm

Take the full ride to 'Nova

CanadianWolf
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:57 pm

Reads as if you really want to attend Temple. In certain circumstances I can understand the culture shock aspect to which you referred in your original post. This is a tough call, but, for you, Temple appears to be the better choice.

splinter23x
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby splinter23x » Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:13 pm

I admittedly don't know anyone from Villanova Law, but I have a hard time believing the students are that conservative. Sure, perhaps it's not 100% far left like Temple, but this is still law school, you're likely talking 2/3 of the class being liberal. And even so, politics of your fellow students, in my personal opinion, should not be a factor in choosing your law school. Villanova is just as good as Temple in the Philly area, and has a much better name outside Philly from what I know. Personally I'd go to Nova if they were the same price, so in your case it should not be up for debate in my mind.

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WithGrace23
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby WithGrace23 » Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:20 pm

Villanova seems to be giving out a few free rides this week...

Temple does seem to have better PI and better federal clerkship placement, (16 last year v. Villanova's 8 ) And I'm sure the feel of the campus is entirely different than Villanova (some people claim for the worse because its in a poor section of Philly, I personally like it)

If all things were equal in your situation I would chose Temple....but they aren't

I would not pass up a free ride at Villanova in order to go $54,000 in debt at Temple. Especially if you plan to go into PI.

Did you try negotiating aid at Temple? I bet they would give you an offer if they knew what you had on the table.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:27 pm

Villanova & Temple are like night & day. Extreme opposites. Polar opposites.

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apper123
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby apper123 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:52 am

Villanova, and I do not see how this decision is even remotely close.

JOThompson
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby JOThompson » Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:16 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Reads as if you really want to attend Temple. In certain circumstances I can understand the culture shock aspect to which you referred in your original post. This is a tough call, but, for you, Temple appears to be the better choice.

Go to Temple and take advantage of IBR + PI. The debt becomes a non-issue and you'll end up in a school where the focus/atmosphere fits your needs.

PhillyLaw2010
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby PhillyLaw2010 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:55 pm

Thanks for the input.

I just talked to a professor from Temple that I met through an acquaintance. Very nice person whose done a lot of PI work in the city.

I told her the situation and she said that I would hands down get a better education at Temple. They have a much better Trail Ad program and I would have far more connections in Philly for Public Interest (considering that they run the whole town when it comes to that). I would also probably like the professors and students a whole lot more.

BUT she said that even given all of that she would still recommend going to Villanova hands down. She said that the money is a big deal when it comes to PI work. She said that I might be pretty unhappy at Villanova's campus but that in the long run it would be helpful to suck it up for three years and avoid the debt. It will make it a whole lot easier to do what I want to do afterwards.

One more weekend to mull it over and then I decide. But how can I choose Temple now? She pretty much sold me. I guess I am going to take the plunge????

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apper123
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby apper123 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:59 pm

I really can't comprehend how anyone interested in PI would choose significant debt over a full ride at a school that is essentially a complete equal.

And Villanova is in a very nice area with direct access to Philly. I have a hard time believe you wouldn't enjoy it. Hell you could prob live teh same place you would in Philly and commute every day if you really wanted to.

And "programs" and all that stuff are really overblown. They don't make any type of significant difference in hiring. It's all about the gradez.

Like I said before, this should not be even a remotely close decision.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby NU_Jet55 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:00 pm

1. Retake
2. Re-apply
3. Go to Penn
4. Profit

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apper123
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby apper123 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:10 pm

NU_Jet55 wrote:1. Retake
2. Re-apply
3. Go to Penn
4. Profit

I would ignore this post.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby NU_Jet55 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:12 pm

apper123 wrote:
NU_Jet55 wrote:1. Retake
2. Re-apply
3. Go to Penn
4. Profit

I would ignore this post.


+1

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beach_terror
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby beach_terror » Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:15 pm

apper123 wrote:I really can't comprehend how anyone interested in PI would choose significant debt over a full ride at a school that is essentially a complete equal.


I'd hardly call 18k in tuition significant debt.

If you have a full ride to Villanova, why haven't you tried to leverage some $$ out of Temple. I figure they'd offer you something if you explain your situation some. You'd have to have pretty stellar numbers to get a full ride out of Nova.

PhillyLaw2010
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby PhillyLaw2010 » Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:02 pm

Temple is not giving me any money. I already told them about my scholarship offer but it made no difference.

jimicornerstone
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Re: Temple Vs. Villanova with a full ride

Postby jimicornerstone » Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:11 pm

PhillyLaw2010 wrote:Temple is not giving me any money. I already told them about my scholarship offer but it made no difference.


I don't like the sound of that. I'm in a similar situation and am hoping to get something, even like 5k a year from Temple. I only have a 15k offer from Nova and am not really considering it, but have asked them to up the offer. Mirroring the majority of the sentiment here, I don't see how you can turn down a no-strings full ride, I may consider it if Nova comes up with an offer that would make them the cheaper option, but I really do like Temple a lot better for many of the reasons already mentioned.




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