Duke v. UT, Vandy?

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Which one

UT 85k COA
7
19%
Duke 129k COA
20
56%
Try to get Vandy to UT price
9
25%
 
Total votes: 36

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DallasCowboy
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Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby DallasCowboy » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:41 pm

Hey everybody, I bet many could see this thread coming from a mile away.

I want to pay off my loans. Scholarship appeals are pending at both. I have visited Duke and love it and plan to visit UT next weekend.

I want a good chance to make near market $ (hence no UF or FSU for me)

My preferred cities are Tampa, Orlando, Austin, DFW/Houston, Miami. In that order.

Ties: I went to UF undergrad and grew up in Texas.

I noticed that there are 9 Tampa/Orlando offices at Duke OCI (27 Texas offices). There are 2 at UT (81 Texas offices). 8 at Vandy (27 Texas offices).

How hard would it be to solicit interviews from Florida firms coming from UT if I grade well?
I know the Florida market is in the tank right now, so that is why I feel like Texas will be where I end up finding a job. The last thing I want to happen is paying 60k in extra loans (after interest) for the same job. The other last thing I want to happen is missing out on an opportunity because I went to a lower-ranked school. Down the line, does the Duke prestige make a difference?

Thanks.

louboutin
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby louboutin » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:49 pm

Hey I have a similar situation. I got a great scholarship at Duke, but then UT offered me more, so I am taking UT. I like Austin and my family and friends are all around Texas.
But it seems like you really liked Duke, so if the difference in the COA is not too big of a deal for you, you should go to Duke. And I'm completely unknowledgeable on what school is better for Florida, so I won't even try to answer that question. Good luck!

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soullesswonder
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby soullesswonder » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:52 pm

Duke and Vandy both offer an easier path to your top two markets (bigger OCI presence in FL). You have ties to Texas already so I'm sure it's in your best interest to throw yourself in the pile of other Texas natives studying law in Austin. Alan Dickinson (from Duke's career services) and Dean Hoye both sounded really confident about Duke's placement in Texas.

Totally spurious argument - Duke is full of undergrads with Jewish grandparents; therefore Duke gets more respect in FL and you should pack your bags for Durham :D

Esc
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby Esc » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:52 pm

Duke. It'll give you the best Florida opportunities, and growing up in Texas will allow you get into the DFW and Houston markets. The only downside is that this would make it very difficult/impossible to get an Austin job (unless you grew up in Austin, that is) but for everything else it makes more sense, and the Austin market is so small its not safe to bet on getting a job there anyway, even for a UT grad.

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DallasCowboy
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby DallasCowboy » Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:01 pm

I love this reinforcement from a UT man, Esc. I'm probably wrong, but I keep getting the feeling that I would be much more likely to finish top half of UT than Duke. Does anybody have an idea of how deep secondary markets go into Duke's class rank(i.e. Florida)?

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gogators
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby gogators » Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:04 pm

Hey bud. I don't know the money situation exactly but I'd say that say sheer lay prestige Duke and Vandy have better national name rep than Texas. Overall, I think it would be hard to choose anyone of them over another although it doesn't seem like you're going to Vandy ASW which unfortunately seems like we get everyone who comes to send in their deposit :lol: My recommendation: if the money is a difference of 60k between Duke and Texas...I'd still choose Duke. (BTW I'm a huge Texas fan and I'd still personally do this.)

BUT COME TO VANDY ASW ANYWAYS!

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thickfreakness
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby thickfreakness » Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:33 pm

Seems to me to be a Duke or Vandy breakdown here. Like others have mentioned, Duke and Vandy have more lay prestige and definitely would carry more clout in the FL markets than UT. With your connections to your home market you should be alright in Texas.

I called around to around 20 firms in my home market today, actually. I'm trying to keep this place open after school so I was trying to solicit some advice and information from firm recruiters about OCI and school choice. Basically, the first thing they asked was what schools I was considering (Vandy and Duke) and then if I was from the area. Once they established that I was from the area, they basically told me that growing up and going to UG in the market was very helpful and that, even if they didn't OCI at one of the schools (usually Duke), they would still love to have my resume sent in and would fly me back for an interview. Obviously, none of that is guaranteed or anything, but it seems like being able to show a connection to a market is important for snagging a job there, especially for secondary markets from T10/T20 schools. A couple of the recruiters basically told me that they would definitely love to talk more regardless of whether I picked Vanderbilt or Duke. FWIW, I'm from a state bordering on Florida.

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sternc
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby sternc » Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:51 pm

Where does one find the information about what firms do OCI's at different schools, namely Texas?

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soullesswonder
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby soullesswonder » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:03 am

sternc wrote:Where does one find the information about what firms do OCI's at different schools, namely Texas?


http://www.nalpdirectory.com, use the advanced search feature. There are quite a few boutique and smaller firms that are not registered with NALP, but virtually all BigLaw firms are represented.

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thickfreakness
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby thickfreakness » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:05 am

soullesswonder wrote:
sternc wrote:Where does one find the information about what firms do OCI's at different schools, namely Texas?


http://www.nalpdirectory.com, use the advanced search feature. There are quite a few boutique and smaller firms that are not registered with NALP, but virtually all BigLaw firms are represented.


Just a word of warning, there are a fair number of secondary market employers that don't use NALP, even if they are NLJ250 or otherwise "ranked" as biglaw firms. I would try anonymous phone calls to summer associate contacts about OCI. That worked quite well for me.

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sternc
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby sternc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:18 am

What do you mean by these phone calls? You just called random 1ls?

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DallasCowboy
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby DallasCowboy » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:30 am

I'm sure he means he contacted the firm's liaisons or w/e.

Thank you for the great idea freakness! I think your little adventure just completely got me set on Duke. I always wondered if firms just didn't bother to OCI at T14 schools because they didn't think they would draw much interest. Hearing that made me very happy lol.

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soullesswonder
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby soullesswonder » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:30 am

thickfreakness wrote:
soullesswonder wrote:
sternc wrote:Where does one find the information about what firms do OCI's at different schools, namely Texas?


http://www.nalpdirectory.com, use the advanced search feature. There are quite a few boutique and smaller firms that are not registered with NALP, but virtually all BigLaw firms are represented.


Just a word of warning, there are a fair number of secondary market employers that don't use NALP, even if they are NLJ250 or otherwise "ranked" as biglaw firms. I would try anonymous phone calls to summer associate contacts about OCI. That worked quite well for me.


Yeah, I should have clarified - by BigLaw I meant V100. I doubt most people would consider NlJ250 firms like Baker Donelson to be BigLaw

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thickfreakness
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby thickfreakness » Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:00 am

sternc wrote:What do you mean by these phone calls? You just called random 1ls?



Hiring partners and SA recruiters. Basically, the people who actually do the hiring of SAs and new associates.

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DallasCowboy
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby DallasCowboy » Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:57 pm

Update: I talked to a lot of people. I'm going to Duke.

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thickfreakness
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby thickfreakness » Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:06 am

soullesswonder wrote:
thickfreakness wrote:
soullesswonder wrote:
sternc wrote:Where does one find the information about what firms do OCI's at different schools, namely Texas?


http://www.nalpdirectory.com, use the advanced search feature. There are quite a few boutique and smaller firms that are not registered with NALP, but virtually all BigLaw firms are represented.


Just a word of warning, there are a fair number of secondary market employers that don't use NALP, even if they are NLJ250 or otherwise "ranked" as biglaw firms. I would try anonymous phone calls to summer associate contacts about OCI. That worked quite well for me.


Yeah, I should have clarified - by BigLaw I meant V100. I doubt most people would consider NlJ250 firms like Baker Donelson to be BigLaw


True. But there are at least a couple of corporate firms in my market that aren't on NALP, but pay top salary, handle lots of appellate and complex litigation work, and are generally on the placement lists for Vanderbilt, etc. every year because they have the best jobs. NALP is great for big markets, but you've got to do a lot of legwork for smaller markets because the picture NALP paints isn't even close to being accurate.

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RVP11
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby RVP11 » Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:12 am

DallasCowboy wrote:Update: I talked to a lot of people. I'm going to Duke.


Congrats on making the right choice.

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thickfreakness
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby thickfreakness » Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:22 am

DallasCowboy wrote:Update: I talked to a lot of people. I'm going to Duke.



Congratulations on making a decision. I'm making a call a week from today, and there's a great chance I'll be at Duke next fall, as well.

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:23 am

Duke is correct. and FWIW I called both UF and FSU to get a rough % of biglaw numbers, after talking to about 5 people per school before finding someone who even knows wtf biglaw is, It is around 8-10% for UF and around 3% for FSU. That deterred me a good bit.

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Grizz
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Re: Duke v. UT, Vandy?

Postby Grizz » Sun Apr 04, 2010 1:17 am

thickfreakness wrote:FWIW, I'm from a state bordering on Florida.


Lemme guess, Alabama?

And Dallas, congrats on your decision.




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