SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:04 pm

Hey everyone,

This site has been great to me so far with the LSAT and the application processes. Time for the really big decisions now, though.

So I got in at CUNY and SUNY Buffalo in New York. I got waitlisted at Suffolk and Mercer (not planning on attending either). I am waiting to hear from Southwestern, U. of San Fran and Santa Clara... My guess is that I'm in at Southwestern and USF, but might be out at Santa Clara. I'm also sure that they won't offer my any schollys.

So, it looks like the big decision is between CUNY and SUNY. I am interesting in public interest/government work, so both schools seem to fit the bill in that regard. SUNY is a tier 1 school, but it doesn't seem to have the same programs that interest me like CUNY does. CUNY is also cheaper, and closer to the city (I want to live/work in a big city)... but its a tier 4. But given my career aspirations in public interest, this seems to be the school for me.

I also have a hefty amount of UG debt (aprox. $55,000) and I need the cheapest education I can get. With that in mind, should I even consider Southwestern, Santa Clara or USF? These schools interest me primarily because of their programs and CA location.

I am leaning towards CUNY right now, but hoping some people here are willing to offer their advice. Thanks!

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baboon309
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby baboon309 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:14 pm

Eric_Arthur_Blair wrote:Hey everyone,

This site has been great to me so far with the LSAT and the application processes. Time for the really big decisions now, though.

So I got in at CUNY and SUNY Buffalo in New York. I got waitlisted at Suffolk and Mercer (not planning on attending either). I am waiting to hear from Southwestern, U. of San Fran and Santa Clara... My guess is that I'm in at Southwestern and USF, but might be out at Santa Clara. I'm also sure that they won't offer my any schollys.

So, it looks like the big decision is between CUNY and SUNY. I am interesting in public interest/government work, so both schools seem to fit the bill in that regard. SUNY is a tier 1 school, but it doesn't seem to have the same programs that interest me like CUNY does. CUNY is also cheaper, and closer to the city (I want to live/work in a big city)... but its a tier 4. But given my career aspirations in public interest, this seems to be the school for me.

I also have a hefty amount of UG debt (aprox. $55,000) and I need the cheapest education I can get. With that in mind, should I even consider Southwestern, Santa Clara or USF? These schools interest me primarily because of their programs and CA location.

I am leaning towards CUNY right now, but hoping some people here are willing to offer their advice. Thanks!


We call it TT here

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:18 pm

Yeah, you're right. Let's just say its ranked... compared to CUNY.

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evilgenius
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby evilgenius » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:20 pm

I'd vote for CUNY. Though SUNY is a tier 1, it doesn't place well in the city. Also as you mentioned CUNY is cheaper and has a lot of exciting PI programs. It also has a strong alumni base in NYC working in PI. Just be warned that with CUNY your options would really be limited to public interest (almost soley) for at least 3-5 years after you graduate. A couple of friends of mine also struggled to find a job after CUNY for a couple of months, but they eventually found jobs that they are very happy with.

HyeMart
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby HyeMart » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:29 pm

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Last edited by HyeMart on Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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acash09
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby acash09 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:41 pm

I think it's a no-brainer that you go with the higher ranked school (UB), considering they are both quite affordable.

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:45 pm

Actually that's another huge consideration that I can't find much info on; living in Buffalo vs. living in Queens. It seems like the SUNY campus is in a much better area... but CUNY is moving closer to Manhattan.

It also seems like there would less competition in the job market in Buffalo compared to NY City... but the question is; "Do I want to live/start a career in Buffalo?" and "Does it matter?"

The whole ranking thing seems like a no-brainer, but CUNY is really attractive for PI and its clinical program whereas from what I've read about Buffalo, it seems they are just "getting off their feet"..

Thanks for the responses. Anyone live, or know anyone who lives, in either Buffalo or Queens/Long Island?

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evilgenius
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby evilgenius » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:51 pm

HyeMart wrote:baboon is just being a red ass.

as for the suny vs cuny...as someone from the city, there no question suny is better. Coming from cuny won't do you any favors over suny in the big city. the reason most cuny people have jobs after graduation, is that the school which is full of the older crowd has i assume prior experience.

the buffalo cost of living would be lower (assuming you dont have somewhere to live for free at cuny) then living in flushing as well.

and btw, cuny alumni base shouldn't factor in the decision.


The cost of living in Flushing being more than that in Buffalo is completely untrue. I lived in Queens for a few years.... Flushing definitely isn't Manhattan. I visited Buffalo earlier this year. All of the students that I spoke with recommended that I live off campus, as the actual campus is outside of the city and extremely boring.

Also, attending CUNY, there are more networking and internship opportunities in the city. There's really no difference between the two if you want public interest. If you want to work for a firm (neither will give you Big Law) then Buffalo has an advantage. Buffalo also has a more interdisciplinary curriculum if that matters to you.

NY88
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby NY88 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:59 pm

The CUNY School of Law is located in a decent area of Queens. It is a safe area. It is also about a 10 minute car ride to Queens Supreme Criminal and Civil courts. I would definitely live there over Buffalo. You can drive or commute into NYC in about 30 -45 minutes. You are also about a 20 minute car ride to Nassau County ,Long Island. I know CUNY graduates have been hired by the Queens DA's office. I know Queens College has built dorms but I am not sure about the graduate housing. You are also 15 minutes away from Citifield(NY Mets), half -hour to Yankee Stadium. St.John's University is 10 minutes away. You will not be bored.

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acash09
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby acash09 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:00 pm

Eric_Arthur_Blair wrote:Actually that's another huge consideration that I can't find much info on; living in Buffalo vs. living in Queens. It seems like the SUNY campus is in a much better area... but CUNY is moving closer to Manhattan.

It also seems like there would less competition in the job market in Buffalo compared to NY City... but the question is; "Do I want to live/start a career in Buffalo?" and "Does it matter?"

The whole ranking thing seems like a no-brainer, but CUNY is really attractive for PI and its clinical program whereas from what I've read about Buffalo, it seems they are just "getting off their feet"..

Thanks for the responses. Anyone live, or know anyone who lives, in either Buffalo or Queens/Long Island?


I've actually lived nearby to buffalo (Rochester) my entire life, and lived just 2 miles away from CUNY Queens for 4 years while I was in undergrad. Personally, I think the hustle and bustle of Queens/NYC life made me stressed out (maybe because I was raised an upstate), and the COL is way higher than in Buffalo. Transportation in Queens is a headache, especially if you have a car.

UB law is a great school, I went to visit it about a month ago. It is also well respected across upstate NY for post-law school (many employers in Rochester look for UB grads, including the firm I work at now).

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chutzpah
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby chutzpah » Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:07 pm

I grew up a few miles from Queens College and I think the area is very safe, if a little boring. Its not a particularly fun neighborhood but it is busy, right off the LIE, and there are plenty of buses to Flushing and Jamaica where you can get the subway to the city. CUNY is potentially in a deal to move the law school to Long Island City, but I don't think the move will actually happen for a few years. I don't think anyone would step on the Queens College campus and say "omg I want to go to school here", but its adequate and it is quite well known for its public interest programs. I guess it comes down with what you're comfortable with. Feel free to PM me if you want more details about the area.

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Fri Mar 26, 2010 8:47 pm

So obviously the resources and facilities at SUNY have got to be better than at CUNY.

Does it make that big of a difference?

istorm88
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby istorm88 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:40 pm

acash09 wrote:
Eric_Arthur_Blair wrote:Actually that's another huge consideration that I can't find much info on; living in Buffalo vs. living in Queens. It seems like the SUNY campus is in a much better area... but CUNY is moving closer to Manhattan.

It also seems like there would less competition in the job market in Buffalo compared to NY City... but the question is; "Do I want to live/start a career in Buffalo?" and "Does it matter?"

The whole ranking thing seems like a no-brainer, but CUNY is really attractive for PI and its clinical program whereas from what I've read about Buffalo, it seems they are just "getting off their feet"..

Thanks for the responses. Anyone live, or know anyone who lives, in either Buffalo or Queens/Long Island?


I've actually lived nearby to buffalo (Rochester) my entire life, and lived just 2 miles away from CUNY Queens for 4 years while I was in undergrad. Personally, I think the hustle and bustle of Queens/NYC life made me stressed out (maybe because I was raised an upstate), and the COL is way higher than in Buffalo. Transportation in Queens is a headache, especially if you have a car.

UB law is a great school, I went to visit it about a month ago. It is also well respected across upstate NY for post-law school (many employers in Rochester look for UB grads, including the firm I work at now).


I also live in Rochester and this is an accurate assessment. In Upstate NY, UB (no one in NY refers to UB as SUNY, even if it is the only law school in the SUNY system) is well respected with strong local ties. This makes it a great regional choice....but idk if that's what your looking for. It may very well have decent placement outside of Upstate NY, but someone else would have to speak on that matter as I have no clue.

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Sat Mar 27, 2010 12:07 pm

Thanks for the advice all...

It's still a touch decision. Maybe a school in CA will give me an offer I can't refuse and that will put all this to rest. Thanks!

irish017
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby irish017 » Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:08 am

Do you want to work solely in PI law?

Danteshek
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Danteshek » Wed Mar 31, 2010 4:18 am

Eric_Arthur_Blair wrote:Thanks for the advice all...

It's still a touch decision. Maybe a school in CA will give me an offer I can't refuse and that will put all this to rest. Thanks!


Why CA? SW has good public interest opportunities. LA is also full of non profits etc. I can give you more info if you are seriously considering...

TracyLynn
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby TracyLynn » Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:55 am

I actually got accepted to both UB and CUNY as well, and thought I'd share my thoughts. First, I'm a native Buffalonian, so I have a different perspective. I love NY though and applied to a few NY schools including CUNY in the hopes of moving there. I received a $5000 scholly to UB, while I received nothing from CUNY (I understand their tuition is super cheap... do they even given schollys?). This makes the tuition about the same. COL is way cheaper in Buffalo than Queens. Also, I don't want to be totally limited to public interest.

I know that people say that after the top 20 or so, rankings don't matter. But I like to think there is a difference between the top 100 and a tier 4 school. If I got some $$$ from CUNY to compensate for the high cost of living compared to Buffalo, maybe I'd consider. Most likely, I'll end up at UB in the fall. Good luck with your decision!

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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby TracyLynn » Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:58 am

Also, at UB's open house, I was told that around 20% of their alumni work in NYC. They also have a semester in NYC program for finance law if that's something you're interested in. I'm not saying UB has fantastic placement in NYC, but I think it's a possibility.

PoliticalJunkie
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby PoliticalJunkie » Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:05 am

No confirmation that CUNY is moving closer to Manhattan. Thye want to but haven't even made plans to purchase the property yet let a lone build a location.

I was less than impressed by the facilities, but their PI programs are great.

Either way, take the total COA rather than solely tuition. The limitation of a CUNY degree, for me, wasn't worth the 30K -50K savings (esp with schollys at other schools) despite my interest in PI and their programs.

However, if you know that you want to work in NYC PI then you should have good connections. Outside of NYC PI though you are very limited.

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Eric_Arthur_Blair
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Eric_Arthur_Blair » Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:34 pm

Danteshek wrote:
Eric_Arthur_Blair wrote:Thanks for the advice all...

It's still a touch decision. Maybe a school in CA will give me an offer I can't refuse and that will put all this to rest. Thanks!


Why CA? SW has good public interest opportunities. LA is also full of non profits etc. I can give you more info if you are seriously considering...


The weather and the opportunities for immigration work. I also think Spanish makes me more attractive on a national level, and what better place to bone up than in Southern Cali?

The only problem is schools. I'm basically only waiting on Southwestern, and I don't know if they're worth it.

I def want to stick to PI law... I can't imagine doing anything else, and I need to take advantage of IBR and loan forgiveness.

Danteshek
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby Danteshek » Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:44 pm

SW has a long standing immigration clinic you might be interested in (with Prof. Ramos). Also, SW is launching a clinical course that will execute immigration appeals to the 9th circuit (with Prof. Mason - need to be I'm top 30 percent to be invited - or get an A in Mason's Crim Pro or Evidence). There is also a capstone course on immigration. I can't think of a better school to do immigration...

harveyspectorlover
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby harveyspectorlover » Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:28 pm

sorry i know my question doesn't fit this thread, but just needed an opinion. SUNY (closer to home, Canada) or OU Law (have ties with Oklahoma)

timbs4339
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby timbs4339 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:47 pm

What is your total COA including UG debt?

If it is as high as I think it is, you'll basically require PI in order to have a shot at paying it off in 10 years after graduation from any of the schools listed, assuming you can get and keep a PI job. CUNY might be the best in this regard, because you can aggressively intern and work during the school year.

harveyspectorlover
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby harveyspectorlover » Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:54 pm

timbs4339 wrote:What is your total COA including UG debt?

If it is as high as I think it is, you'll basically require PI in order to have a shot at paying it off in 10 years after graduation from any of the schools listed, assuming you can get and keep a PI job. CUNY might be the best in this regard, because you can aggressively intern and work during the school year.



Total would be around 100,000

timbs4339
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Re: SUNY vs. CUNY et. al

Postby timbs4339 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:02 pm

harveyspectorlover wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:What is your total COA including UG debt?

If it is as high as I think it is, you'll basically require PI in order to have a shot at paying it off in 10 years after graduation from any of the schools listed, assuming you can get and keep a PI job. CUNY might be the best in this regard, because you can aggressively intern and work during the school year.



Total would be around 100,000


I'm confused at how you got to this number. 55K UG debt, 45K in-state tuition, 45K living expenses? Or do you have COL covered or a full scholly?




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