Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Which one?

Georgetown
4
5%
Vanderbilt
18
24%
Chicago
36
47%
Texas
18
24%
 
Total votes: 76

Eazy E
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Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Eazy E » Wed Mar 03, 2010 5:44 pm

Just out of curiosity, where would you all lean towards? My interest is criminal law, which seems to be solid wherever you go. I'm not especially worried about debt, but GULC would have to cough up some serious dough to really get into the race.

D.C. has politics, Nashville and Austin have music (my back-up career path :D) and Chicago, is well, Chicago. Loved the ASW at Gtown, was underwhelmed by my visit to Chicago. Still have to visit Austin and Nashville, which I know is a crucial piece of the puzzle.

Honestly, I'm leaning away from Chicago and money isn't really the issue. It's more of a "do I fit in here" thing. Is that crazy? It seems obvious that Chicago would give me the best career options, but the reality is I'll be spending three years of my mid-20's in one of these places. That's no small thing.

I won't make my decision based on this and I know I'm so lucky to have this dilemma, but like I say, I'm curious.

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gossipgirl
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby gossipgirl » Wed Mar 03, 2010 5:46 pm

How much $ at each?

Eazy E
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Eazy E » Wed Mar 03, 2010 5:47 pm

The Vandy and TX offers are about 1/2 tuition.

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gossipgirl
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby gossipgirl » Wed Mar 03, 2010 5:52 pm

I'm not sure if criminal law placements are the same as corporate biglaw placements. If so, Vandy places really well according to the recently released stats, NLJ250. Texas obviously places really well in Texas.

If you want to be in Texas, go to Texas.
If criminal law chances are similar (you have to do research on this) and you want East Coast, then Vandy.
If Midwest and if you find criminal law chances much better from a better school and/or want mobility, then Chicago.

This will entail research but I think once you do that leg work, your choice will be clear.

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jks289
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby jks289 » Wed Mar 03, 2010 5:57 pm

I think if your gut feeling is that Chicago isn't right for you that matters a lot. But it isn't going to matter to people filling out your internet poll. I wouldn't pick Gtown over the others without money, and I wouldn't pick Texas and Vandy if I wasn't reasonable comfortable being regionally limited (widely regional, but still) by their locations. So I think visiting and your own sense of your personality match, and where you want to wind up living long term are going to be the way to come up with the answer here. good luck, congrats on the great options!

Torvon
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Torvon » Wed Mar 03, 2010 7:12 pm

What direction are you looking at taking inside of criminal law? If you're wanting to be a prosecutor or public defender of some kind then you should take the different schools LRAPs into consideration.

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Joga Bonito
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Joga Bonito » Wed Mar 03, 2010 7:19 pm

jks289 wrote:I think if your gut feeling is that Chicago isn't right for you that matters a lot. But it isn't going to matter to people filling out your internet poll. I wouldn't pick Gtown over the others without money, and I wouldn't pick Texas and Vandy if I wasn't reasonable comfortable being regionally limited (widely regional, but still) by their locations. So I think visiting and your own sense of your personality match, and where you want to wind up living long term are going to be the way to come up with the answer here. good luck, congrats on the great options!


Originally I didn't read OP's original statement, I just say the poll and voted Chicago. That said, I'd still pick Chicago but you'll be fine no matter where you go. Chicago is a great city, UofC is a great school even if the campus environment is dull.

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thickfreakness
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby thickfreakness » Wed Mar 03, 2010 7:33 pm

Joga Bonito wrote:
jks289 wrote:I think if your gut feeling is that Chicago isn't right for you that matters a lot. But it isn't going to matter to people filling out your internet poll. I wouldn't pick Gtown over the others without money, and I wouldn't pick Texas and Vandy if I wasn't reasonable comfortable being regionally limited (widely regional, but still) by their locations. So I think visiting and your own sense of your personality match, and where you want to wind up living long term are going to be the way to come up with the answer here. good luck, congrats on the great options!


Originally I didn't read OP's original statement, I just say the poll and voted Chicago. That said, I'd still pick Chicago but you'll be fine no matter where you go. Chicago is a great city, UofC is a great school even if the campus environment is dull.



So, in other words, "I voted without reading the thread, then read the thread and the part where OP said Chicago didn't have a very good feel to it, and yet I still vote for Chicago because I think it's a good school." Fail.

OP, I think you should cross Chicago off your list. If you visited as a prospective/admitted student and they didn't impress you, I doubt it's going to be much different when you're in school there. Schools try to put their prettiest, bestest foot forward to prospectives and if you were still unimpressed I think that's a very important thing to consider. Here's my take on the options:

GULC: Big class size, big city, big COL, super competitive market. They are sporadic at best with scholarship offers. You'll be plugged into DC, though, which could potentially net you some nice opportunities for criminal law. However, all the other T14 PI folks are going to be gunning for those jobs, so it'll be tough.

Vandy: Livable city with low COL, the school is very socially active and involved, and the class size is small. Job placement outplaces rank. You've got half the tuition covered. It's not likely to give you the same options as GULC for the DC market, but you can still probably pull something decent down.

UT: Like Vandy, Austin's a very livable city with low COL. I'm not really sure about student culture (be it social or non-social). A lot of people are going for the TX markets, and you'd have great PI opportunities there if that's where you wanted to end up. Half tuition covered. Again, not the same type of options as GULC.

If I was in your situation I'd go to UT or Vandy, because those DC jobs are going to be so competitive your odds of finding something outside of DC with UT/Vandy are probably better. Though you're not especially debt averse, you could take the 1/2 scholarships and have a better quality of life (if that's what more available money would do for you...) in Nashville or Austin. Obviously, though, you MUST visit Vandy and UT before you make the final call.

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Joga Bonito
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Joga Bonito » Wed Mar 03, 2010 7:53 pm

thickfreakness wrote:
Joga Bonito wrote:
jks289 wrote:I think if your gut feeling is that Chicago isn't right for you that matters a lot. But it isn't going to matter to people filling out your internet poll. I wouldn't pick Gtown over the others without money, and I wouldn't pick Texas and Vandy if I wasn't reasonable comfortable being regionally limited (widely regional, but still) by their locations. So I think visiting and your own sense of your personality match, and where you want to wind up living long term are going to be the way to come up with the answer here. good luck, congrats on the great options!


Originally I didn't read OP's original statement, I just saw the poll and voted Chicago. That said, I'd still pick Chicago but you'll be fine no matter where you go. Chicago is a great city, UofC is a great school even if the campus environment is dull.



So, in other words, "I voted without reading the thread, then read the thread and the part where OP said Chicago didn't have a very good feel to it, and yet I still vote for Chicago because I think it's a good school." Fail.

OP, I think you should cross Chicago off your list. If you visited as a prospective/admitted student and they didn't impress you, I doubt it's going to be much different when you're in school there. Schools try to put their prettiest, bestest foot forward to prospectives and if you were still unimpressed I think that's a very important thing to consider. Here's my take on the options:

GULC: Big class size, big city, big COL, super competitive market. They are sporadic at best with scholarship offers. You'll be plugged into DC, though, which could potentially net you some nice opportunities for criminal law. However, all the other T14 PI folks are going to be gunning for those jobs, so it'll be tough.

Vandy: Livable city with low COL, the school is very socially active and involved, and the class size is small. Job placement outplaces rank. You've got half the tuition covered. It's not likely to give you the same options as GULC for the DC market, but you can still probably pull something decent down.

UT: Like Vandy, Austin's a very livable city with low COL. I'm not really sure about student culture (be it social or non-social). A lot of people are going for the TX markets, and you'd have great PI opportunities there if that's where you wanted to end up. Half tuition covered. Again, not the same type of options as GULC.

If I was in your situation I'd go to UT or Vandy, because those DC jobs are going to be so competitive your odds of finding something outside of DC with UT/Vandy are probably better. Though you're not especially debt averse, you could take the 1/2 scholarships and have a better quality of life (if that's what more available money would do for you...) in Nashville or Austin. Obviously, though, you MUST visit Vandy and UT before you make the final call.


Yes that is correct... It's not so much about me thinking Chicago is a good school, it is a good school, a better school by all objective measures than the other ones listed, although those are good schools as well.

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patrickchillis
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby patrickchillis » Wed Mar 03, 2010 8:03 pm

Easy, join a fellow Niner fan at Chicago

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The Brainalist
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby The Brainalist » Wed Mar 03, 2010 8:22 pm

1. What city do you eventually want to live in after law school? If it is anywhere but TX or the TN region, then Chicago.
2. How committed to criminal law are you? 60%? A lot of us think of things like criminal law and constitutional law without really knowing what that means aside from TV and movies. If you are less than 85% sure you want to do criminal law (and street-level, not white collar), then Chicago.
3. Like some implied above, the answer is also Chicago if you want to be a federal prosecutor because of how competitive it seems to be. For other jobs, like DA, it may matter less.
4. Sticker is a lot of money. I feel like Vandy and Texas should offer more given your Chicago acceptance. As they approach full tuition, my answer would change. Maybe negotiation is called for.

Eazy E
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Eazy E » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:58 pm

thickfreakness wrote: So, in other words, "I voted without reading the thread, then read the thread and the part where OP said Chicago didn't have a very good feel to it, and yet I still vote for Chicago because I think it's a good school." Fail.

OP, I think you should cross Chicago off your list. If you visited as a prospective/admitted student and they didn't impress you, I doubt it's going to be much different when you're in school there. Schools try to put their prettiest, bestest foot forward to prospectives and if you were still unimpressed I think that's a very important thing to consider. Here's my take on the options:

GULC: Big class size, big city, big COL, super competitive market. They are sporadic at best with scholarship offers. You'll be plugged into DC, though, which could potentially net you some nice opportunities for criminal law. However, all the other T14 PI folks are going to be gunning for those jobs, so it'll be tough.

Vandy: Livable city with low COL, the school is very socially active and involved, and the class size is small. Job placement outplaces rank. You've got half the tuition covered. It's not likely to give you the same options as GULC for the DC market, but you can still probably pull something decent down.

UT: Like Vandy, Austin's a very livable city with low COL. I'm not really sure about student culture (be it social or non-social). A lot of people are going for the TX markets, and you'd have great PI opportunities there if that's where you wanted to end up. Half tuition covered. Again, not the same type of options as GULC.

If I was in your situation I'd go to UT or Vandy, because those DC jobs are going to be so competitive your odds of finding something outside of DC with UT/Vandy are probably better. Though you're not especially debt averse, you could take the 1/2 scholarships and have a better quality of life (if that's what more available money would do for you...) in Nashville or Austin. Obviously, though, you MUST visit Vandy and UT before you make the final call.


Thanks for the well-reasoned response. I'm not completely off of Chicago, but I think you're right that I should seriously consider crossing it off my list. In this economy it's hard to turn down a school with such a great brand-name, small class size and a killer career services office (seriously, they bust their asses to make sure that all their students get jobs).

Between debt load, COL, QOL and class size, Vandy's taking the lead in my head at the moment.

The Brainalist wrote:1. What city do you eventually want to live in after law school? If it is anywhere but TX or the TN region, then Chicago.
2. How committed to criminal law are you? 60%? A lot of us think of things like criminal law and constitutional law without really knowing what that means aside from TV and movies. If you are less than 85% sure you want to do criminal law (and street-level, not white collar), then Chicago.
3. Like some implied above, the answer is also Chicago if you want to be a federal prosecutor because of how competitive it seems to be. For other jobs, like DA, it may matter less.
4. Sticker is a lot of money. I feel like Vandy and Texas should offer more given your Chicago acceptance. As they approach full tuition, my answer would change. Maybe negotiation is called for.


1) I'm pretty open geographically, although I do like the South (parts of it, at least). Chicago will definitely give me the most options, but I'm not super into the BigLaw scene, so the access to NY/Chicago/Boston/etc. isn't that big of a deal to me. I probably see myself in a smaller city like Nashville, for example.
2) I know the realities of criminal law and I've interned in non-profits, but I'm in no way married to any particular field. I also have an interest in academics, which is big at Chicago and TX IIRC.
3) You're probably right about the high level gov't positions favoring Chicago, but I don't know that it's totally cut and dry.
4) I was honestly pretty suprised that Vandy and UT coughed up as much as they did. It never hurts to press for more, though. That GULC sticker price plus D.C. COL is just ridiculous. And I don't really see a huge advantage to going there over going to Vandy/UT. Plus it's gotta be really hard for GULC to place so many students ITE, same goes for UT.

Thanks all, I appreciate the responses.

Eazy E
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Eazy E » Sun Mar 07, 2010 5:25 pm

*bump*

Esc
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Esc » Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:12 pm

Judging by what you say your priorities are, and the $, I'd spend the time and money to visit UT and Vandy before making your decision. Chicago will give you better options, but half tuition is nothing to sneeze at, especially if you are interested in going into a low-paying field.

Eazy E
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Eazy E » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:19 pm

Definitely visting both Vandy and Texas.

I didn't mention it, but I could also go Indiana on a full-ride. But I have serious doubts about job prospects. For example, I 3L who called me the other night basically admitted that their career services office sucks and that OCI was terrible.

Esc
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Re: Texas ($) v. Vandy ($) v. GULC (maybe $) v. Chicago (sticker

Postby Esc » Tue Mar 09, 2010 7:45 pm

Eazy E wrote:Definitely visting both Vandy and Texas.

I didn't mention it, but I could also go Indiana on a full-ride. But I have serious doubts about job prospects. For example, I 3L who called me the other night basically admitted that their career services office sucks and that OCI was terrible.


Don't even consider Indiana if you have Vandy and Texas as half-ride options.




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