MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

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raskolnikov32
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MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby raskolnikov32 » Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:28 pm

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Last edited by raskolnikov32 on Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Go State
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby Go State » Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:43 pm

If you really want Chicago then I would re-take the LSAT. Try and shoot for $$ at Northwestern if you want to try and keep your debt down. The Chicago legal market isn't great right now and it's going to be tough to find work in those practice areas coming out of John Marshall, and Depaul at sticker is just a bad investment. MSU with full-tuition isn't bad but it won't get you into Chicago. On the other hand, if you 100% for sure want to live in Michigan, and are OK with potentially practicing in other areas besides the ones that you mentioned then MSU wouldn't be bad. The reason I say that about the practice areas is that "corporate" (as in corporate transactional work) is something that is typically practiced in either larger/midsize firms or boutiques (basically ex-biglaw partners that left and took their clients with them), and those are tougher to break into from a low ranked school, and even more so in a bad economy.

Also, MSU isn't "on the rise," (see, e.g., my posts here: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=65727&start=75) and the GPA stipulation can be brutal. Keeping that 3.0 or above sounds like nothing now, but when you see that literally half the class is forced to get some sort of C or below and the median is a 2.66 it makes you think.

Kobe_Teeth
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby Kobe_Teeth » Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:09 am

Go State wrote:If you really want Chicago then I would re-take the LSAT. Try and shoot for $$ at Northwestern if you want to try and keep your debt down. The Chicago legal market isn't great right now and it's going to be tough to find work in those practice areas coming out of John Marshall, and Depaul at sticker is just a bad investment. MSU with full-tuition isn't bad but it won't get you into Chicago. On the other hand, if you 100% for sure want to live in Michigan, and are OK with potentially practicing in other areas besides the ones that you mentioned then MSU wouldn't be bad. The reason I say that about the practice areas is that "corporate" (as in corporate transactional work) is something that is typically practiced in either larger/midsize firms or boutiques (basically ex-biglaw partners that left and took their clients with them), and those are tougher to break into from a low ranked school, and even more so in a bad economy.

Also, MSU isn't "on the rise," (see, e.g., my posts here: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=65727&start=75) and the GPA stipulation can be brutal. Keeping that 3.0 or above sounds like nothing now, but when you see that literally half the class is forced to get some sort of C or below and the median is a 2.66 it makes you think.


+1...pretty much agree. However, I would say if you re-take and even just break the 160's you will get money from Loyola, DePaul and Kent and those schools WITH $$$ are worth it if BigLaw isn't your only goal...and if you can mitigate the CoL by living at home or with a S/O (like me!).

plex
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby plex » Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:49 pm

Agreed, same basic advice, but keep in mind Go State likes to pull numbers out of thin air that he "quotes," usually from himself. The curve at MSU for 1L's is a B-curve.

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General Tso
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby General Tso » Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:55 pm

None of the above...it's not elitism but realism at this point. NYU students are getting no job offers after 300+ applications. That doesn't mean that they are turning down 75k, 65k, 55k, jobs. They are getting NO JOB OFFERS.

I am no elitist...I attend what many here would call a TTT. But even I am having second thoughts about law school. You need to retake the LSAT and get into a school that will give you realistic job prospects. None of the schools you are looking at are worth over 50k debt.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:02 pm

lol @ "Hey, at the moment you're considering MSU v John Marshall v. DePaul... you shouldn't consider law school unless you get Northwestern [and OP makes no mention of significant work experience] with money."

Then again... OP is clearly confused. "I want corporate/business law" + "I don't want biglaw" = lolwut?

Anyway, my suggestion is that you shouldn't attend any of the schools that you have as options at the moment. As others have said, it isn't so much elitism (though, let's be real: yes, it is); it is realism. I wouldn't attend any school short of UIUC to work in Chicago (you'd get in state there, not sure how much that puts tuition at). You'd still be "at risk," but eh.

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Go State
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby Go State » Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:06 am

plex wrote:Agreed, same basic advice, but keep in mind Go State likes to pull numbers out of thin air that he "quotes," usually from himself. The curve at MSU for 1L's is a B-curve.


You realize a 2.66 median is a B- curve, right? I just looked this up. The curve at MSU is: 25% A, 30% B, 40% C, 5% D or lower. There is also 5% discretion in there. So to be exact, 40-50% of the class gets some type of C or lower, and 45% is the target.

See: --LinkRemoved--, p. 39.

My guess is a 3.0 GPA stipulation would require being somewhere around top 40% of the class (if not better).

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hiromoto45
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Re: MSU or John Marshall Partial Tuition vs. DePaul sticker

Postby hiromoto45 » Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:22 am

Hey guys. 157/3.53 white suburban (Chicago burbs) upper-middle class male (so, polar opposite of URM).


As a suburban upper-middle class URM, (oh wait we don't exist) nevermind... :roll:




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