Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

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LeTigre
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Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby LeTigre » Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:55 pm

Doing a site search of linkedin.com via Google, it seems people get better/more interesting jobs from Pepperdine, but free tuition at Southwestern is very tempting.

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jmaan
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby jmaan » Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:57 pm

LeTigre wrote:Doing a site search of linkedin.com via Google, it seems people get better/more interesting jobs from Pepperdine, but free tuition at Southwestern is very tempting.



southwestern for free..the opportunities at pepperdine arent THAT much better

LeTigre
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby LeTigre » Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:11 am

First 5 results for each

Graduating 2009, current jobs

Pepperdine:
Associate Attorney
Attorney
Attorney
Associate Director, Business Affairs
Staff Attorney
Associate
Research Assistant /Law clerk
Associate
Law Clerk
Law Clerk


Southwestern:
President at Guild Opera Company
Associate
Sole Practitioner
Independent Contractor
Law Clerk
Associate Attorney
Associate
Research Assistant
Associate
Volunteer Court Attorney/Law Clerk

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quadsixm
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby quadsixm » Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:14 am

jmaan wrote:
LeTigre wrote:Doing a site search of linkedin.com via Google, it seems people get better/more interesting jobs from Pepperdine, but free tuition at Southwestern is very tempting.



southwestern for free..the opportunities at pepperdine arent THAT much better


SW for sure

LeTigre
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby LeTigre » Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:50 am

What are you guys basing your opinions on?

eth3n
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby eth3n » Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:57 am

SW for sure x 100000000000000

both schools you will need great grades + networking to grab some amazing job, no serious difference when it comes to job opps (both 0% biglaw), I say go to SW, rape face and keep your full ride (btw this is assuming you have gentle full ride strings, e.g. 3.0+ or top half)...

Pepperdine will not get you far enough in CA to really consider it over a full ride imho

elmagic
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby elmagic » Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:55 am

LeTigre wrote:What are you guys basing your opinions on?


There is really no reason to consider Pepperdine over Southwestern in this situation. Both schools are largely limited to the LA area, and although Pepperdine has a higher ranking job prospects are not that much better than at Southwestern, especially considering the kind of debt you would be accumulating at Pepperdine.

Both schools have pretty good reputations in LA, but Southwestern in particular has a lot of PD/DA and judges as alumni. You are going to have a very difficult time getting Big Law out of either but with limited debt you can make a decent living coming out of Southwestern.

Here is a link to the current alumni from Southwestern registered with the California bar:
http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... d=&status=

Here is a link to the current alumni from Pepperdine registered with the California bar:
http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... d=&status=

Notice that Southwestern has about double the alumni in terms of sheer numbers, which of course can mean a lot of things, but it's something to keep in mind. Also now that Ken Starr is leaving Pepperdine there is a lot of talk that Pepperdine's growing reputation will begin to settle if not diminish so make of that what you will.

LeTigre
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby LeTigre » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:36 pm

elmagic wrote:
LeTigre wrote:What are you guys basing your opinions on?


There is really no reason to consider Pepperdine over Southwestern in this situation. Both schools are largely limited to the LA area, and although Pepperdine has a higher ranking job prospects are not that much better than at Southwestern, especially considering the kind of debt you would be accumulating at Pepperdine.

Both schools have pretty good reputations in LA, but Southwestern in particular has a lot of PD/DA and judges as alumni. You are going to have a very difficult time getting Big Law out of either but with limited debt you can make a decent living coming out of Southwestern.



I really appreciate the input from everyone. I was particularly curious about opinions on these two schools, but what would happen if I threw in USC at sticker? I don't really want this to come down to money, I want to get the best education possible, however I don't like loans.

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Great Satchmo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:51 pm

LeTigre wrote:
elmagic wrote:
LeTigre wrote:What are you guys basing your opinions on?


There is really no reason to consider Pepperdine over Southwestern in this situation. Both schools are largely limited to the LA area, and although Pepperdine has a higher ranking job prospects are not that much better than at Southwestern, especially considering the kind of debt you would be accumulating at Pepperdine.

Both schools have pretty good reputations in LA, but Southwestern in particular has a lot of PD/DA and judges as alumni. You are going to have a very difficult time getting Big Law out of either but with limited debt you can make a decent living coming out of Southwestern.



I really appreciate the input from everyone. I was particularly curious about opinions on these two schools, but what would happen if I threw in USC at sticker? I don't really want this to come down to money, I want to get the best education possible, however I don't like loans.


I'd go USC, take the debt, and not look back.

But that's just me...

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General Tso
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby General Tso » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:57 pm

I think you are being too debt averse. Pepperdine is worth 50-60k debt. That is like $400 per month on a 30 year plan.

What are the gpa requirements for the two schollies?

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Great Satchmo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:11 pm

swheat wrote:I think you are being too debt averse. Pepperdine is worth 50-60k debt. That is like $400 per month on a 30 year plan.

What are the gpa requirements for the two schollies?


Living expenses.

Figure ~$20k a year on the high end, = $60k over 3 years (being conservative, erring on the high end).

So, it would be $90k-$100k in debt from Pepperdine, as opposed to $60k in debt from Southwestern.

Significant to me.

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General Tso
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby General Tso » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:20 pm

Great Satchmo wrote:
swheat wrote:I think you are being too debt averse. Pepperdine is worth 50-60k debt. That is like $400 per month on a 30 year plan.

What are the gpa requirements for the two schollies?


Living expenses.

Figure ~$20k a year on the high end, = $60k over 3 years (being conservative, erring on the high end).

So, it would be $90k-$100k in debt from Pepperdine, as opposed to $60k in debt from Southwestern.

Significant to me.


If the options are 100k debt Pepperdine and 60k debt SW, I say skip law school altogether.

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Great Satchmo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:23 pm

swheat wrote:
Great Satchmo wrote:
swheat wrote:I think you are being too debt averse. Pepperdine is worth 50-60k debt. That is like $400 per month on a 30 year plan.

What are the gpa requirements for the two schollies?


Living expenses.

Figure ~$20k a year on the high end, = $60k over 3 years (being conservative, erring on the high end).

So, it would be $90k-$100k in debt from Pepperdine, as opposed to $60k in debt from Southwestern.

Significant to me.


If the options are 100k debt Pepperdine and 60k debt SW, I say skip law school altogether.


Looking through your profile, it doesn't appear that you have much a of a difference situation, with maybe a ranking bump of 10-20 for the similar situation.

The reality is, people are likely going to finance between $40k-$60k in living expenses. So that tuition numbers are only part of the picture.

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General Tso
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby General Tso » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:26 pm

Great Satchmo wrote:Looking through your profile, it doesn't appear that you have much a of a difference situation, with maybe a ranking bump of 10-20 for the similar situation.

The reality is, people are likely going to finance between $40k-$60k in living expenses. So that tuition numbers are only part of the picture.


You assume no personal savings/parental support on my behalf :P

I worked and saved for several years prior to starting law school. I am looking at around 60-70k debt, which is higher than I'd like, but manageable on a worst-case scenario of $50-55k starting salary.

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Great Satchmo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:38 pm

swheat wrote:
Great Satchmo wrote:Looking through your profile, it doesn't appear that you have much a of a difference situation, with maybe a ranking bump of 10-20 for the similar situation.

The reality is, people are likely going to finance between $40k-$60k in living expenses. So that tuition numbers are only part of the picture.


You assume no personal savings/parental support on my behalf :P

I worked and saved for several years prior to starting law school. I am looking at around 60-70k debt, which is higher than I'd like, but manageable on a worst-case scenario of $50-55k starting salary.


Yes, I do assume that, as the majority of law school applicants don't likely have a couple dozen G's saved up. I respect the fact that you do, I'm sure you worked hard for the position you are in.

It's just a reality for many that there are not savings to rely upon and that much, if not all, of school needs to be financed. It certainly puts us in a tough spot, but it's either going to be something that is worth the end result as an attorney, or it's not.

I don't think $90k-$100k in debt from Pepperdine is outrageous.

However, if it's true that SW and Pepp don't have dispirit employment opportunities, then cutting that debt almost in half seems like the smart thing.

That being said, if it was my choice and USC was in it for sticker - I'd go with USC.

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Great Satchmo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Great Satchmo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:39 pm

swheat wrote:
Great Satchmo wrote:Looking through your profile, it doesn't appear that you have much a of a difference situation, with maybe a ranking bump of 10-20 for the similar situation.

The reality is, people are likely going to finance between $40k-$60k in living expenses. So that tuition numbers are only part of the picture.


You assume no personal savings/parental support on my behalf :P

I worked and saved for several years prior to starting law school. I am looking at around 60-70k debt, which is higher than I'd like, but manageable on a worst-case scenario of $50-55k starting salary.


Oh, you also mentioned parental support.

I wish I could count on that like I could in undergrad....

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arhmcpo
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby arhmcpo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:55 pm

have you tried negotiating aid with Pepperdine? They are not usually averse to makin' it rain on applicants-
USC for sticker if you can pull it off; even with limited aid you can still apply for small schollys and grants while your in school or enter writing comps etc. USC at Sticker assuming you want Big Law or the like, if you want PI then the whole ranking system is kinda useless.

Danteshek
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby Danteshek » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:55 pm

1. Southwestern has a more central location than Pepperdine closer to a large number of legal employers. This makes a big difference because it's easier to work as an extern during the year if you're a student at Southwestern. It's a major pain to commute to downtown LA from Malibu.
2. Southwestern has been around a lot longer than Pepperdine and has a much larger base of alumni.
3. Southwestern's reputation is progressive, public service oriented, and unlike Pepperdine, not associated with conservative politics. Lot's of attorneys in LA have a serious aversion for Pepperdine because of its conservative orientation.

For these reasons, I think that the opportunities coming out of Southwestern are probably just as good as Pepperdine, and possibly better.

FWIW know personally at least one person who chose SW full ride over USC sticker. It is also very common for students to turn down T2's like Loyola and Santa Clara with little or no money at Southwestern - usually because of location and/or particular interest.

eth3n
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Re: Pepperdine with 15k or Southwestern with full tuition paid?

Postby eth3n » Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:51 pm

If you can get into USC, I would say its worth the debt.




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